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Technical Doing a ring job the old way

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by squirrel, May 19, 2019.

  1. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    before I honed, the groove was there, even deeper, and the engine was burning a quart of oil every hundred miles. But the rings in 5 of the cylinders had a lot of wear on them, too. It was not fouling any plugs.

    It sure will be interesting to see how it works when it's done! At the very least, it's a cheap experiment. And if it goes 200 miles on a quart now, it will use half as much oil, which is a significant improvement--it will only take two cases of oil for a long trip, instead of 4.

    I did that Corvair a couple years ago, it had two bores with serious rust issues, one of them had an area about 2" x 2" rusted away. It used a quart every 50 miles. I replaced the two bad cylinders, and put in new rings, and it went down to about 500 miles per quart, which I hear is about as good as you can expect from one of those.
     
    Blues4U and Old wolf like this.
  2. your small block is a shorter stroke higher compression engine than the Hudson. Jim isn't adding a performance cam bigger carb or hedders ect.. and Hudson engines & parts aint near as plentiful or cheap as a small block. He isn't gonna abuse the car. So good enough will suffice in this instance. I used to hate removing the ring ridge at the cyl top. Until I bought a high dollar Snap On ridge removal tool. It locates down in the bore and a bit cuts the ridge from the bottom up. It will not over cut. And follows the cylinder wall below the ridge. It removes 100% of the ridge even from a out of round bore. and its easy to use and pretty fast. Buy one you will find its well worth every penny.
     
  3. Ah ok- I know of a Hudson collector in London who owns a wrecking yard for big trucks- he is said to have a stash of parts for Hudson’s- if you come up short on something let me know and I will approach him
     
  4. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    thanks...

    I also got a call back from a Hudson guy that's less than 200 miles from me. I will try to visit him sometime in the next few weeks.
     
  5. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    I got some rings in the mail today, so I'm out there a grindin' away...

    The rings are NORS, and they fit a .030 over Caddy 331 engine. One of the oil rings was broken (they are cast, with spring steel rails), so I will use one more old ring than I hoped. Also, the rails are too tight to use without grinding, so I am thinking about just using the old rails, instead. The Hudson has 4 rings per piston, the top oil ring (above the pin) uses the rails, the lower ring (below the pin) does not.

    I also took a closer look at the old pistons, they have a ring spacer on the top groove, which is kind of neat...I don't think I've ever seen that before. They're also knurled, which I have seen before. The new rings have decent fit as far as ring groove wear not being too much.

    I also stuck an old ring in a bore to see how much gap they had...they had quite a bit! like 3/16" on the one I checked. yikes, no wonder it burned so much oil.

    To make the new .030 rings fit the .020 bores, I marked a line 1/32" from the end of each ring with a scribe, and ground to the line with the edge of the grinding wheel on my small bench grinder...then finished with the hand ring grinder, to get it square...and then checked the gap. I'm not to picky on gap, anywhere from .015 to .025 on the top rings is fine, and even tighter on the second, and oil rings, is ok.
     
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  6. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    going back together. I think the new rings are from 1958, anyways, a couple pictures for your viewing pleasure.

    ring06.jpg ring05.jpg ring04.jpg ring03.jpg ring02.jpg
     
  7. I like the dual carbs. and I see the relief on the deck to allow better flow from the valves. Its just me however I would weigh the bigger piston & rod and remove some weight from the big end and above the wrist pin on the rod to balance everything.
     
  8. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,929

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Love it, Leak-Proof
    You should be good to go now.
    Did you dig up an old labor guide to check to price back in the days?
     
    squirrel and Old wolf like this.
  9. Cool Tool! Any chance you remember who made it?
     
  10. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    The rod tool is a Blue Point, it's old, and they haven't made them for decades. It's my best "whatizit?" tool

    We went out for dinner with friends, so lost two and half hours :) but the rest of the pistons are in, I'll get the pan and head cleaned up and installed, and see if I can get it running tonight.
     
    ottoman, Thor1, j-jock and 2 others like this.
  11. Jim,
    I have never seen a tool like that. Is it to protect the journal when you are installing the pistons?
    Bob
     
  12. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    yes, also lets you pull the rod onto the crank journal....or push the piston out of the bore, if you're removing it. Very handy. I love it
     
  13. I just found a picture of one on line, and I can see why you would like it.
    Bob
     
  14. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    The only problem is it won't fit 7/16" rod bolts. Which I have on two of my engines!
     
  15. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

  16. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    Anyways, the ring job is done, car is running again. It's almost 11pm, so I will wait until tomorrow for a test drive. But it sounds good so far.

    ring07.jpg
     
  17. Johnboy34
    Joined: Jul 12, 2011
    Posts: 1,397

    Johnboy34
    Member
    from Seattle,Wa

    Of coarse it does! Probably hasn't run that good for a long time!

    Sent from my SM-G900V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  18. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    Went for a little drive this morning, seems to be doing ok. I'll have to put some miles on it to figure out how much oil it's using now. I also changed the oil, it was kinda dirty after 25 miles, wonder why? :)
     
  19. TrailerTrashToo
    Joined: Jun 20, 2018
    Posts: 1,086

    TrailerTrashToo
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Maybe because the new oil has detergent?
     
    Old wolf likes this.
  20. any full car photos? now that the engine is going to live.....
     
  21. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    sure...just took one this morning.

    car july.jpg
     
  22. Needs one of these canvas water bags hanging in the grille. :p

    Untitled01.jpg
     
  23. Nostrebor
    Joined: Jun 25, 2014
    Posts: 1,204

    Nostrebor
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    If you are good at keeping them from leaking, you can get the usage down to almost nothing on a fresh build, and a quart a change on a well seasoned one. It takes a lot of practice to keep the oil inside a Corvair engine.

    I'm really enjoying this project, and envious of the relatively rust free relics you drum up to play with.
     
  24. Sorry Jim, I can’t resist, but I showed my nine year old son the picture of your car and the first thing he said was Doc Hudson!


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  25. Just from looking at the design, the only way I could see to convert it to use with the 7/16 bolts, would be to butcher this one or build a copy to accept the larger rod bolts.
    I guess I'll have to continue using fuel line hose, but this device would seem to solve the most difficult part of removing the rod, and that is, to get the rod off the journal without damaging the finish on the journal. Even with the rubber hose covering the bolts, that is when I am most paranoid.
    I like the look of the car, and hope it runs well. It is just my own thing, but I hate sunvisors.
    :)
    Bob
     
    sidevalve8ba and Thor1 like this.
  26. flatford39
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 2,800

    flatford39
    Member

    So you guys were undertakers last year in that LaSalle Hearse....what's the motiff this year???

    Hornets??? That's actually a nice looking car...I have always been intrigued by how ugly they are but actually quite handsome at the same time. They play with your mind.
     
  27. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    I hate sunvisors too, I took it off when I first got the car, mainly so I could get the windshield back in place (the garnish holds it in, and was not installed all the way). But my goal with this car is not to make it be the best looking car, so the visor went back on. It has sunburn everywhere except where the visor protected th paint...looks a bit funny with it off.

    Not sure about the theme of this car, if there is such a thing. I did get a Doc Hudson mascot, a very badly built (new) toy car, I'll get a picture of it soon, I expect.

    I'm thinking about driving the car out to Monterey in a few weeks for the Hell on Wheels rally. It would be totally irresponsible, so it just might happen.
     
  28. Johnboy34
    Joined: Jul 12, 2011
    Posts: 1,397

    Johnboy34
    Member
    from Seattle,Wa

    And the way the front seat lays down to the rest seat, you can sleep in it! We had one as our family car in the later 50's, Dad would take us boys fishing and we would sleep in it! He had put an Olds V8 in it though.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  29. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 49,794

    squirrel
    Member

    The Nashes and Ramblers had lay down seats, but not Hudsons....at least not these ones.
     
  30. Nice to see you extending the lifespan of this cool old survivor. I wonder how many nice old cars like this get passed up (or parked) because the mindset is we have to do a frame off restoration? This is proof positive you don't have to spend a fortune to have and enjoy an old vehicle.
     

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