Dodge LA / 5 speed transmission options

Forgive what may be simple questions but I spent a lot of years with sports cars and am now having to get educated on all things American V-8.

I have a '41 Plymouth Coupe and would like to build an LA Dodge engine for it and would like to have a drive train that will cruise comfortably on the highway at speeds of 75 mph.

I'm thinking that I'd like to install a 5 speed transmission with overdrive and something like a 3:55 Dakota rear end. After doing some research, it looks like the 90's version of the T-5 transmission might be a good choice. I've been unable to determine whether there is a Dodge 5 speed that might work.

IF I go with a T-5, how do I mate up the Mopar Engine and the Ford transmission? I get it that I'll need an adapter or adapter bellhousing of some kind. (suggestions are welcome) But, also what kind of flywheel, clutch, t/o bearing, clutch fork do I use? Any suggestions for easily adapting the clutch linkage?

Also, I have to connect all this up, so what kind of driveshaft do I start with? I recognize it will have to be adapted to length.

Is there a Dodge transmission with all the goodies that would work out easier? If so, what year and what vehicle?

Thanks for your inputs.

Rock

 

I think you need to look at what Chrysler already did for you. Back in the late 70 with the supposed gas shortage, both Ford & Chrysler made a simple gear swap in their 4 speeds and both the Ford top loader and the Chrysler 833 now sported 4 gear OD & 3rd became direct. Yes you can find them and they had Hurst shifters from the factory. To answer your soon to be second question - Yes I have one.
Van
A good article on this was just in Car Craft or Popular Hot Rodding, they put one in a Cuda and were thrilled with it.

 

Don't know much about a "T-5"' trans, but, I'm using a 5 speed OD out of a 90 Dakota that had a V6 (pre-magnium). I'm told the bell bolts up to the V8, it is a hydralic clutch. If you planning on doing serious hammering, the V6 trans may not hold up. Mopar also offered a 5 speed in large trucks with V8s, but I'm not sure those were pre-magnium and I'm not sure (should, but ??) the mag bell will bolt to the LA engine.

As far as an adapter bell, all you need is the trans bolt pattern and the correct trans housing register. Then you add a disc that matches the trans to the pressure plate and flywheel that matches the engine. You need the front drive shaft yolk that fits the trans and get an adapter u-joint (from NAPA) to match the yolk to the drive shaft.

Mopar also shoved a bunch of OD 4 speeds into the late 70s through the late 80s into pickups. Most were slant 6 engines, but the trans was the old 833 with 3rd gear swapped to the od and retained the 1 to 1 4 the gear by mounting the shift lever upside down.

You might have a look over at www.moparts.com in the street rod section for more assistance. Gene

 

If by LA engine you mean a later 318 (5.2) or 360 (5.9), the Dakota and full size trucks used a 5 speed with OD on 5th on the V6 3.9 and the aforementioned V8's.
The whole setup from one of these trucks should be fairly easy to find and would work well in your '41 Plymouth.

Ray

 

An LA Mopar small block was built from 1967 until 1992 or 1993. The Mopar small blocks build after 1993 were called Magnium motors, there are a new engine design with many things different then the earlier motors. I do believe the transmissions and bellhousings interchange between the two engine series though. Gene

 

You can always give the guys at hothemiheads a call. I'm sure they can point you in the right direction. Good luck.

 

Thanks, guys. That Dakota 5 speed setup sounds interesting. Who made that transmission for Dodge? Do you know the torque rating?

 

There are two generations. Earlier models are called AX15, later versions are New Process (NP3550, IIRC),which is/was at least partly owned by Chrysler. They also were used in Jeep products, although you have to change the bellhousing portion of the trans to Dodge (it bolts on and is ordinarily considered part of the trans).

're strength, I guess it depends on how you intend to drive it. I believe these boxes are fairly rugged, but if you really intend to thrash it, maybe there are better choices.

Ray

 

I ordered a 2000 Dakota with the NP 5-speed, SOHC 4.7L V8, and a 9.25" rear with 3.92 gears and LSD. I beat the ever loving piss out of that truck and it loved every minute of it. The only problem I ever had with the trans was in the shift linkage. Right after I got the truck it would act funny going into 3rd gear and finally just flat out wouldn't (at about 20k miles). I tore down the trans and discovered the shift fork has a steel tab on it that had bent. I welded it up, ground it to size and no more problems. The shift linkage design is pretty piss-poor, but overall the trans was pretty bulletproof. Hole shots, drag racing (14s stock), and pulling 8000 pounds without an issue. Sold the truck to a buddy who still beats it and it runs as strong as ever. It should handle a mild 318 or 360 without too many problems. I *assume* the bellhousing is the same between the LA engines and the newer SOHC ones, but who knows.

 

Yes the bellhousing is the same between the 4.7, A's, LA's and even the new Hemi.

 

Thanks, Guys. I'll look into the NP 5 speed.

Griznant, I assume you meant 8.25, not 9.25 rear.

 

Rock, as long as you are going this route that 41 rear is not going to last long, explorer 8.8 rear end fits under your car, has discs or drums, and a 4.5 bolt pattern
something to consider anyway with more diff ratio options.

 

I went a bit different route to Mopar five gear happiness. My '48 Plym has a Tremac TKO500 five speed. It was a bit of screwing around to do, but it has been the best money I've ever spent! Not too hard - order the Chev pattern trans, Lakewood has an adapter scatter shield for Chrysler small block to Chev trans. Flywheel came from Centerforce up in Prescott, AZ., clutch is off the shelf from them too. I went with a hydraulic throw out bearing from quartermaster up in Chicago area, Willwood supplied the pedals and master cylinders. Sounds like a lot of nit for a shickle, but it now has over a hudred thousand miles of absolutely torturous milage on it with out a hickup. I loked into the Dakota trans and found that the tourque specs were a bit lower than what I felt might be nessesary in the future. I don't remeber what they were specifically, but they were pretty low. On the flip side, I'm now getting pretty serious about doing a turbo on my 360, and looking for outrageous numbers - and it won't worry me a bit to put it back through the Tremac.

 

Let me try and recap the trans questions with regards to swapping.
Most of the late Mopar corporate v-6 and v-8 share the same block bolt pattern. This includes the 3.7 and 3.9 v-6 and the 4.7 SOHC, 5.2 (318) Magnum, 5.7 Hemi, 5.9 (360) Magnum, and 6.1 Hemi. This is the same old small block bellhousing pattern that we have had since 1962.
Any of these engines can be donors, for trans and bell, as a unit. The flywheels used on the 3.7 and 4.7 are not suitable for redrilling. The 3.9, 5.2 and 5.9 flywheels can be rebalanced, if needed, for the swap. The 5.7 and 6.1 have not been checked.

The Jeep/Dodge AX15 5-speed, the Jeep NV3550 5-speed, the Jeep NV1500, the Toyota R150F, R151F & R155F, the 87-92 Toyota Supra Turbo R154, the Isuzu AR5 and the Pontiac Solstice\Saturn Sky\Chevy Colorado\ GMC Canyon MA5 5-speeds all share the same case to bellhousing bolt pattern (Large Pattern). As such there are a number of possibilities that can be had when a 5-speed is desired:

However, Input shafts lengths vary.

Pre 1995 R150\R151 = 6.5"
1996 up Toyota R series = 7.5"
AX15 = 7.875"
87-92 Turbo Supra R154 = 7.25"
AR5 = 8.2"
MA5 = 8.2"
NV3550 = 7.875"
NV1500 = 8.6"
AX5 = 7.5"
Toyota W series = 6.5"
Toyota G series = 6.5"


If the NV1500 or NV3500, as used with one of the engines first listed above, is available then it can be used, trans and bell, and the same flywheel notes apply as for the Dak AX15. If the NV comes from a Jeep inline 6 or the Mopar 4-cyl then a Dak bell will be needed but the issue then goes back to the shaft length that was used and what will be required to accomodate the trans in the swap.
Since the NV1500 has a longer shaft than the AX15 we would need to consider where the splines are located in relationship to the clutch disc. Actually, if any of the trans and bells are swapped around the spline location must be checked. We can support a 'short' shaft and we can shorten a 'long' shaft but the splines are not moving.

Here is a 4x4 site with lots of info:
http://www.jeeps-offroad.com/showthread.php?t=4740
Here is another useful site:
http://www.drivetrain.com/parts_catalog/manual_transmission_overhaul_kits/dodge.html


Basically, if you find one attached to a 318-360 grab everything.

Hope this helps.

.

 

Thanks, Guys.

Frankie, what year Explorer rear fits?

 

Just wondering, was the standard Mopar OD four speed tranny not considered? I mean, it's the easiest bolt on imaginable, because it was designed to be there.

I use one in my 440 4 speed Challenger with 3.23s and a 26" tall rear tire, and my cruise at 75 MPH is about 2600 rpm.

Unless it's the novelty of running a 5 speed you're after, I'd give more thought to a four speed.

 

I'd try and find a mid 90's Dakota with a factory stick shift magnum v-8 and use the rear end also. The v-8 had a stronger rear end than the earlier v-6 and a lot of people drag raced the early magnums without too many issues. That way you don't have any issues with input shaft length and the driveshaft is steel so it's easier to shorten/lengthen for your car. Good luck.

 

I did some searching on ebay for nv3500 transmissions. It appears thaey are used in Chevy/GMC applications, too. Do they have the same bellhousing as the Dodge?

Scotto, are you talking about an A-833 tranny? I have no problem with 4 speed, as long as I have OD. Where would I find one?

 

I have a 84 D150 6 cyl with that 4 spd OD trans. It was going to be a winter beater. We fixed it up and I drove it for a few days and parked it in my Dads back yard. That was in 94 it still sits there. One of the worst engine/trans/rear end combos I could imagine and I'm not a fussy driver. I would be leery about putting that trans in any hot rod.

 

I looked at the 4 speed O/D as well before I set my Tremac up, but I didn't like the gear spread. The ratios were too far apart for my application to be very effective. With a relatively mild cammed big block on tap, I bet that it's probably great. With my kinda overcammed, peaky, small block... not so good.

 

Yep, you want one out of a 1975 through 1985? Dodge Truck or Van. They have a 0.75 final drive, I think.

I could give you more info tomorrow, too much beer tonight....

 

Mid to late 90's, ford exploder

 

And that rear has the same track width as the original Mopar?

 

Nope, 9.25". There was a series of option codes where if you ordered the V8, the 3.92s and the LSD the 9.25" magically appeared. I've got a picture of the axle tag around here somewhere. It wasn't a fluke either since two other friends ordered 2000 Dakotas with the same engine/gearing/LSD and all of us got a 9.25". It was a big bastard hanging under the ass of my little Dakota.

 

No, different bells between the makes.

Mopar issued alot of the 3+1 units, some with alum tails, some with alum main case and some all aluminum. Many were used with /6 in the Volare-Aspen and as mentioned in pickups. The /6 trans is the same as the v-8 trans but of course you will need the v-8 bell. You can use any smallblock bell but keep in mind that the O/D trans has the largest of the bearing retainers so an earlier bell will require boring out the opening to accomodate.
FWIW, the reduction is .69 in 4th gear. This allows you to use something as deep as 4.56 out back (4.56 x .69 = 3.14 effective final).

Perhaps special-k will sell his trans...

.

 

Yep, 73RR finished up what I was gonna say.

You might look for a Dodge Truck in the junkyard and get the whole kaboodle from the flywheel/bellhousing back to the yoke for pretty cheap, and it would bolt right up to your 360.

Oh, and to save you from scratching your head later, the 360 is an externally balanced engine where as the 273/318/340 were internally balanced, mix the two and your car will shake like Michael J Fox!!

 

IMHO you would be better off going with an AX15 trans the NV3500 has a more "Truck Like" feel, and rattles like a peanut can full of bolts at idle (yes this is normal) Rockland standard gear builds a "Tranzilla" version of the AX15 if you are worried about strength. I have an AX 15 behind a 408 Inch 5.9 Magnum in a Jeep TJ.

For what it's worth I found a 3.9 Dakota bell housing on car-part.com 3 years ago for 15.00 at a yard in Ohio, they had something like 30 of the bellhousings in stock, so I'd imagine they might still have a few.

 

Yeah, the Durangos came with the 9.25 as well, probably the same complete axle.

 

Close enough to work. IIRC it was within 1" overall. If you get one from the Junkyard, make sure you get the Ujoint flange while you are there. Here is one on my 53 Plymouth frame

 

My o/t '08 Ram 1500 has the Getrag 6 speed behind the V6, supposed to be the same bellhousing pattern as your V8. Could be another option, if you could even find one. I think it's a model 238 Getrag.