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Technical ***December 2021 Banger Meet Thread - Run Run Rudolph***

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Jiminy, Nov 30, 2021.

  1. Banger Speed parts are as rare as Hen's Teeth, just pulling your leg.
    I was told 10 or 15 years ago that eBay helped move a lot of the parts oversees, not that I believe it but it does seem plausible. Your best bet is to get involved with some local to you hot rodders, not the credit card type, the guys who build them. You will start to find parts and bring cash, lots of it.

    The thing to keep in mind is that most of this stuff was made some time ago and if it survived, it probably had a few repairs. Don't necessarily be afraid of brazing repairs, just be aware that you might have to add to the repairs in the future.

    Instagram has a few advertisers, Part Swapper is a good start.

    Another good contact is Jim Brierley, search him up and his book.

    Best of Luck, quite honestly, drugs cost less and there are medical interventions.

    Jet96 likes this.
  2. Jiminy
    Joined: Oct 25, 2012
    Posts: 422


    I added these links to the thread header on page 1 just after the info about Jim Brierley and his book. Let me know if there other links to add.
    Dannerr likes this.
  3. raaf
    Joined: Aug 27, 2002
    Posts: 660


    Thanks for the replies Bob and John...Because of the parts situation, there are two paths here, and thus my conundrum.

    I'm working from Brierleys book, so I've got good source material.

    The problem is the dark side is calling to me. I'm aware of the repop and aftermarket stuff and lacking patience and access to the really righteous stuff, I'm quickly cascading in the direction of the newer parts. And in my moments of greatest weakness, consideration has even been given to a certain newer block that you are all aware of.

    I love my stock A fenders and all. But there is also a parallel universe where I see it elevated into sleeper territory. I'd love to see 120+ hp and I want to drive it all day. Obviously, to get me there, some other things are going to need to change too. I'll probably go with juice brakes and improved transmission, but don't plan on touching much else. I've got a set of bent spokes sitting in the corner too.

    I have a realistic sense of cost. I'm practical in most other areas of my life, not so much on the vehicles side of things. I don't want to be.

    Most of the folks on this thread have seemed to hold the line, sometimes with truly rare stuff. But I think if I want to make this happen in the foreseeable future, I'm going to need to listen to that dark side.

    With that admission of sorts, does anyone have experience with the Serr Miller Head? Based on my research, this one looks the most promising, but I have zero practical experience so I'd love an opinion or direction if anyone has it. I think if I center in on the head first, I can build my way backwards.

    Thank you!
    Old Dawg and trikejunkie like this.
  4. Raaf,

    Most of the Folks here have been at this for quite a while.
    IMHO, it is your car, do with it what you can, (a) afford (b) what you can, not brag about who built it for you (c) what you like, after all, you have to look at it and drive it.
    The Burtz motor is good nothing wrong here, in my opinion. It will not pass for a race motor if you are thinking that way, just check with event staff.
    The Serr Miller Head, I have one, sn 002, this is my recommendation for street car with single carby.
    I have made this suggestion several times and no one has complained.
    The Dan Price 4 port Cragar cross flow is pretty good for more poop, some get raced at Bonneville and El Mirage.

    Just a couple random thoughts, J
    Old Dawg likes this.
  5. raaf
    Joined: Aug 27, 2002
    Posts: 660



    Thank you for your thoughtful reply. It's a nice coincidence that you run the Serr Miller.

    I can add some context to my project in response...

    I have to build the engine myself. I have only rebuilt a four stroke lawnmower engine prior, but for me, this will be the real joy in owning my A. For better or worse.

    It has to be streetable. I want to be driving this car as much as possible. Stuff always goes wrong in life, but I don't want to contribute to my sorrows from too much ambition.

    But there is also my greed for horsepower too.

    Speaking of which, how much horsepower do you think you are seeing from yours?

    And do you you have any other recommendations for a build centered around the Serr Miller?

    Also - sincere thanks. I do not take the information, or years of experience on this thread, for granted.

    -- Raaf
  6. Stan Back
    Joined: Mar 9, 2007
    Posts: 1,396

    Stan Back
    from California

    You don't want John's horsepower, but you're on the right track listening to his advice.
  7. Raaf,
    You are miles ahead in your thinking, be realistic and you will not be disappointed.
    I would read Jim's book thru and then start looking for a "B" motor, you can use the "A" but it is a ton of work getting the oiling and bearings right. Most "A" cranks are ground pretty small and they are not big enough to begin with. Drilling for oil to rods can be done, maybe better to look at a Scat crank and rods with bearings.
    If you get a good "B" motor you can find a "C" crank or it may already have one.
    If you look at AER rods for "B" crank, that is a good move, the Scat rods only fit the "A" rod journal.

    As for my Serr-Miller, I estimate 100-110 hp on a good day, but this is a street car with fenders and a roof.
    Stan is mentioning the Bonneville attempts HP, about 280-300. My lakester has been 179+ mph at Bonneville.

    One last thought, camshaft, talk to Jim B.
  8. I had to replace an iron Miller-Scofield head years ago when it broke (mortally) in a race. I replaced it with a Serr OHV. I made the mistake of just bolting it on. No. 1; I had a lawn sprinkler in the engine compartment! No.2; the engine ran poorly! Bottom line: Put a ceramic sealer in the cooling system! And apply a non-hardening sealer in any threaded hole you screw a bolt into the head! So that your engine runs properly; put a three angle grind on the valves. And make sure the valve springs don't "Bottom Out" when you bolt down the head!
  9. John,
    I have heard stories like this before, not any particular head or design, it happens.
    My first OHV was a Dodd 4 port. Sold as ready to run, yeah sure.
    I installed it and fired it up dry, just a few seconds to make sure I had it secured.
    The next day, I added water to the cooling system and it would not crank over, cyl 1 full and 3 filling fast.
    took the plugs out to drain the cooling system, a new procedure, do not try this at home.
    After some welding and about a pound of JB weld, I got that sucker to run.
    Best speed was 141 mph at Lakes meet. The learning curve was about 3 years and I wouldn't trade it for anything.

    Back to Steve's heads, I know for a fact who the casting house is, they make heads and girdles for us locally and the quality is the absolute best I have ever seen. The Donovan's I have done all had some inclusions somewhere, I used a pressure sealant service to seal them up. It is an issue with custom built parts that are cast, I hear some foundries are better than others. I cannot wait to see the new Birner heads coming out of Ohio soon, should be impressive.

    Best, J
    Old Dawg likes this.
  10. Phil Damon
    Joined: May 8, 2020
    Posts: 51

    Phil Damon
    from San Diego

    New motor just about ready to drop in. B block with C crank drilled for full pressure oil, AER rods, EGGE pistons with modern ring package, Brierley cam, Aluminum McEachern timing gears, Stipe oil pump, Murray Horn harmonic balancer, Buttermore 7:1 Winfield crowsfoot head, FSI distributor, lightened flywheel, Mustang pressure plate and Holley 94. Air cleaner is from a 1936 and has been gutted and a K&N filter installed. Just waiting on the new flywheel housing to show up.

    [​IMG]IMG_9802 by nomadpsd, on Flickr
    Dannerr, Binger, Jet96 and 13 others like this.
  11. Gerald Sleater
    Joined: Jan 4, 2021
    Posts: 19

    Gerald Sleater

    Well, where to begin. I guess for me it's back to the drawing board. Took my 30 coupe out for drive, finally had gotten it sorted and it was running beautifully. Then I had someone who failed to yield and t-boned the coupe. Long story short no seat belts suck and I got partially ejected. Cars totalled, and I still need to heal. On the flip side my burtz block ships soon, got the notice while in the hospital. And I'm now getting a 31 coupe as a replacement. This one's getting belts. Merry Christmas everyone

    Attached Files:

  12. motorcade 1
    Joined: Jun 25, 2010
    Posts: 61

    motorcade 1

    THAT SUCKS get healed up there is aways time to fix your car
    Gerald Sleater likes this.
  13. G_Don
    Joined: Feb 17, 2017
    Posts: 43


    So I’ve probably put about 80-100 miles on my car since the juice brake conversion. I noticed the car is leaking oil. The dip stick reads about half full after only 80-100 miles which I know model as notoriously leak and mark their territory but I think this is a little excessive leaking. Also I noticed the cast iron block where it meets the bell housing has one of the cast iron tapped holes broken… you can see the bolt where it threads in and should be a blind hole, but it’s screwed in and showing in the one picture.

    In any case, Is this something that can be fixed? Or something that can’t?

    Is there any way to check the oil pressure etc?

    Attached Files:

  14. raaf
    Joined: Aug 27, 2002
    Posts: 660


    @Gerald Sleater - Wow. I wish you the best as you heal. That's scary and a tough loss - but also a gift in that you are still with us. I hope you get through it as best you can.

    @johnneilson - Thanks for the added information. I've got a Model A engine, not a B. So that's pushing me towards the Burtz. It's a good running A as is, so I would definitely store/keep the current engine. It's not the original of course. You've definitely solidified my interest in the Serr Miller.

    @Phil Damon - Beautiful - and enviable. That's the kind of curated build that makes this place great. Where in San Diego are you? I'm in North Park.
  15. Phil Damon
    Joined: May 8, 2020
    Posts: 51

    Phil Damon
    from San Diego

    @Phil Damon - Beautiful - and enviable. That's the kind of curated build that makes this place great. Where in San Diego are you? I'm in North Park.[/QUOTE]

    I'm way out in East County/Campo but I work in El Cajon.
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2021
  16. Phil,
    Merry Christmas to you and Family!!
    That is a nice looking assembly, I would expect nothing less from You.
    Enjoy, John
    Phil Damon likes this.
  17. G_Don,
    Let's see, lots of questions... I'll attempt
    The housing bolt boss is broken, probably not repairable nor is critical. If/when you take the motor out you can replace the housing.
    More than likely the rear main needs some attention, without knowing what is there it is hard to suggest a solution.
    What that means is it will need be opened up and then analysed.
    Can you check oil pressure? well, a stock Model "A or B" is not pressurized. (some debate about "B's" but that is for another discussion)
    The best bet is to take some pictures of the side cover and see if there is a oil line modification.

    There is a pretty good book availability that will address stock motors and modified so you can identify what you have.
    See the front page of this thread and look for Jim Brierley's book 4Bangers and Me.
    It is a good read of 80 plus years of modifications done to Mode "A" motors.

    Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays, John
    G_Don likes this.
  18. Phil Damon
    Joined: May 8, 2020
    Posts: 51

    Phil Damon
    from San Diego

    Thank you John and Merry Christmas to you too!
    The guy that did the line bore for me is the one who did the line boring on Pete Ardema's V12.
  19. Phil,
    You definitely have found a capable shop to do the line bore, Pete has some pretty impressive motors.
    We were talking about the DOHC Chevy V8 in the lakester at the Oct meet, incredible!
    Yeah the V12 is over the top, it sounds awesome at full song going down course.

    Best wishes for You and Family, John
    Old Dawg likes this.
  20. callcoy
    Joined: Aug 31, 2008
    Posts: 164


    Happy Christmas
    Well it didn't start that way, we just started to open gifts with our 8 out of town family members when my heart when into ventricular tachycardia, family called 911 and the paramedics did their thing. My PB dropped completely, they shocked me back into synesis rhythm. I felt rotten before they arrived once they restored my rhythm I felt like nothing had happened, Four weeks ago I received a new pacemaker/defibrillator they found in my case that it was not programed for my needs. I had to spend Christmas at another hospital in ICU till yesterday afternoon, I am one blessed dude!
    BeaverMatt, guitarguy and loudbang like this.
  21. Airborne34
    Joined: Dec 4, 2007
    Posts: 572


    Phil, Do you know what oil filter adapter that is, as in model and source. thanks
  22. Kevin Pharis
    Joined: Aug 22, 2020
    Posts: 302

    Kevin Pharis

  23. V4F
    Joined: Aug 8, 2008
    Posts: 4,261

    from middle ca.

    stock dipper system may only have like 3# . should have been a stock guage in the dash ...... steve
  24. Phil Damon
    Joined: May 8, 2020
    Posts: 51

    Phil Damon
    from San Diego

  25. Liberty Garage
    Joined: Oct 14, 2008
    Posts: 117

    Liberty Garage

    stay well Stevo we have a lot more FAST meetings and the big birthday coming up the other steve
  26. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,230


    Gerald Sleater, Old Dawg and v8flat44 like this.
  27. guitarguy
    Joined: May 26, 2008
    Posts: 598


    Ohhhh, I like that. Didn't know they made one like that.
  28. Stovebolt
    Joined: May 2, 2001
    Posts: 3,427


  29. Phil Damon
    Joined: May 8, 2020
    Posts: 51

    Phil Damon
    from San Diego

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