The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by fargoguy, Nov 12, 2018.
I feel terrible for these poor folks. My sympathies to all involved.
I have a friend up in Paradise named Larry Ladwig who was an old-time mechanic (worked with Andy Granatelli's Studebaker crew at Bonneville) and car detailer; he's in his late seventies now - if anyone knows his status please send me a PM. I remember he had several cars at the place he shared with his brother - '63 Sport Fury and '67 Ford wagon among them.
This is him at an auction about ten years ago:
Prayers to all out there in California ..Firefighters fighting these monsters deserve high praise . Cant even imagine. It's hard for us "flatlanders" to understand. It doesn't happen up here in New England too often .Trying to explain to my kids it's the air with no oxygen and ,1000 degrees that gets you.The toasted Tundra story brings a tear to my eye . God Bless to all
Heartbreaking. The loss of life is staggering. Prayers going out to all involved. Lippy
I would think in this day and age the government would have more wildfire equipment seeing that there is a fire season every year. I guess the money is better spent on vacations and such.
egads - Thanks for Bang Shift link - so many personal stories of heroism and tragedy coming out of all of the fire areas
Owner and his wife were out of state, per the report. Does that make it better?
I imagine the 'note' that the couple received was that their property was over run by an uncontrollable fire that moved 8 football fields per MINUTE!
Helpless, the feeling...
There is nothing that tons of ground fire crews can do, if it was being pushed by such high winds...you cannot have fire crews in front of that fire, that is insanity. You rely on air tankers but they were grounded for long spells due to no visibility and very high winds at low altitudes.
The Paradise town roads have lots of fire hydrants, even in the mostly rural looking roads, so they did prepare for less drastic wild fires.
I live in a bowl surronded by mountains. The Thomas Fire swept all around us faned by high winds. My place is full of Oak trees (23) there is no chance for defending my property if it gets into the Oaks. We are on a slope so if it comes up the hill it will travel very fast especially with winds. I have several cars and got one out to a large parking lot. The others I planned to drive one myself leave a couple and hightail it out of here. I have 30 water spickets with hoses around the property but if a fireman's hose that is inches wide can't put out the fire what is my 3/4" hoses going to do. I stayed while all of my neighbors left. It was 4 days before any fire engine bothered to come down my street, when it did it was a L.A. City truck, I retired from L.A. City many years ago and took that as a sign. All turned out well for us in this case but many otheres were not so lucky. Make a plan and put it on paper what you will do, what you will take and where you will go if a fire occurs, this is important..I wish the best for all of the people involved in these fires.
Live in a different part of the country
I know enough about you to know that your comments weren’t uncaring, and I don’t think anyone took it that way.
I have a background in building, so I sometimes forget that not everyone knows about the different characteristics of building materials.
One example being that we would specify timber beams in public areas, as they take longer to burn through than a steel beam would take to melt, thus allowing people time to escape in event of a fire.
I have also spent a lifetime farming and started, (accidentally) a small fire that destroyed a few acres.
How it started, was with one small ember drifting 70 metres through the air, and landing in some branches.
The speed at which that spread was amazing.
We could not control it, we were at the decretion of the weather.
For fire breaks to be effective, they need to be massive, as embers can drift a long way.
Store cars away from these areas, in the cities ?
Underground bunkers would work possibly, but would be massively expensive.
We had some winds of 85 mph recorded in Southern California a day ago. That's strong enough to be considered a category 1 hurricane (hurricanes begin at 74 mph).
It appears that at least two of these fires were initially sparked by "malfunctions" with utility company's power lines. These aren't "forest fires", they are wildfires. "Tree huggers" aren't to blame, and 46% of California is owned, administered by, and under the complete control of the federal government.
There's way too much misinformation, faulty conjecture, and uninformed opinions in here.
So far, forty-two people have been incinerated sitting in their cars while attempting to evacuate, and that number will certainly rise. Please have a little fucking compassion.
Most of these fires start on federal land, spreading to private land. State land (CA) is a very small percentage of it. 60 percent of California is under some type of federal land management. "Tree-huggers" notwithstanding. These people need our support right now, not finger-pointing. Enough with the blanket statements.
Yep blame the power companies. So let's shut off all the power when the wind starts blowing and listen to all the bitching and lawsuits...you can't have it both ways. Living in the flat lands has its advantages.. I'd blame the palm trees it it would do ant good....
i thought about some kind of underground bunkers, easier in hill country because they could be cut into the hill.
i had a side job installing wood stoves many years ago. there were all kinds of rules about how close they could be to combustibles, but for every air space or non combustable "layer" the numbers were smaller and smaller. a 3' set back could be cut down to 5" with a layer of brick an air space and a metal shield. i would think it could be done for a building, with of course the right amount of "set back" from stands of trees/shrubs etc.......
i also heat my house with an out door wood boiler and generate a wheel barrow full of ashes from time to time. i set the wheel barrow out in the middle of the yard away from the buildings till it cools before i dump it. i have seen it with 3" of snow on top, two days later and when you dig into it you still find hot ashes in the center. i have also found readable pieces of paper that i used to start the fire with months later. sitting under the protective/insulating layer of ash.
rockets make reentry into the atmosphere with out burning up.
there has to be a way, to if not totally protect property, but maybe a few ways to slow the fire down, limit the heat, reduce the fuel, cool down zones were fires are small enough to extinguish. stop one house from catching fire, it may not light the next one and so on.
The problem is by the time these wild/forest fires get to larger populated areas they are usually beyond the slowing down stage. If they could be slowed they wouldn't make it to the properties in the first place. People who live in these types of area live there for a reason, they want the wilderness close by. Sadly sometimes this is the price that gets paid for living there.
IF I had an expensive home in a high risk area for fire, and IF I had the funds, I would design a foaming system (similar to those used in aero/petro/chem) to cover my home and prudently landscaped perimeter. Think "generator/water supply (pool/tank)/mixer/pump/cycling sprayer. The system could even be activated remotely.
It does seem to be as a practical matter, oftentimes large collections are just that, concentrated in one area, and whatever happens to one, happens to all. The national museum of Brazil was recently completely destroyed by fire. It had no sprinkler system, something that has also destroyed more than one car collection.
Los Angeles Car Show - 1929
over 300 burned
Do you really think that this would work.?
Even if it did, how do you go about cleaning it off afterwards ?
You bet it'll work.
Biodegradable foam is like a soap product. (You know how suds diminish and get washed into the drains?)
All you'd have to do is modify the delivery system of an existing commercial system. There are many of them in the commercial/industrial markets now.
Nature's a bitch
One house left standing after Ike wiped the peninsula clean.
It's not even over yet...how to turn the page on all Mother Nature's nastiness...thoughts and condolences to those who survived and those who have lost family.
There was a foam product shot all over a burning building here and it contaminated wells of 20+ rural homes in the area...so I'm not so sure that's a viable solution.
Wrong product. There are many others. It's an easy Google.
Maybe there is...too bad they didn't research it...quite frankly toxic shit shouldn't ever be allowed...then there's cost perhaps some can afford it...then you might axphixiate or die of melting plastic fumes...etc...then you would need oxygen supply like on airplanes and thermal heat suits...I would choose to get the heck away from it...not an easy solution whichever route you choose to travel.
We try as we do to protect against the force of nature it's a costly often fruitless battle. I will chose to not live in a forested area for the hell I am witnessing...and of course that is no guarantee I won't become victim to any number of disasters that could strike at random.
So- Are you in the fire service? OR, a "second responder" like myself? I'm the guy who makes sure all that shit works FYI, and get's to your place when needed, so I don't need a "buy it on discount here" BS scenario..... Does the average Joe know how foam= Class A/B works? How to set up a preventative system? Or- have it on automatic to disperse when catastrophy is striking, as in get the F' out now!?!?!
Yes- Google is your friend, as well as youtube....- But, that doesn't mean shit to the average homeowner......
I won't pass judgement just yet, but explain yourself a lil......
See the latter part of page 3 in this thread.
I just think it's a viable idea, and a possible solution to losing multi-million dollar homes with multi-million dollar car collections, that's all.
The human mind is an amazing thing when it comes to solutions.
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