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coil wireing question ??

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by lorodz, Mar 28, 2010.

  1. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    ok i have had to re wire my 56 chevy .now im to the part of the coil i know i need a + wire to the + side of the coil and the - goes to the distributor ..now ive seen the postive come from the starter ..is this where to get 12 volts from ..or just run it from 12v key switched on...

    another question is does the coil run 12volt constant or it just needs to see 12v on start up....thanks...
     
  2. the wire coming from the starter is to give full 12 volts during starting , hook that to the + side of coil. there should be a ballast resister in the wire coming from the ignition switch to drop the voltage during normal running
     
  3. bryan6902
    Joined: May 5, 2008
    Posts: 1,137

    bryan6902
    Member

    You can actually hook your coil up backwards and it will still run. Think about it, it's just a coil of wires, it doesn't really care about + or -.
     
  4. patman
    Joined: Apr 30, 2007
    Posts: 541

    patman
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  5. 333 Half Evil
    Joined: Oct 16, 2006
    Posts: 1,440

    333 Half Evil
    Member

    Make sure the coil you have is an externally resisted coil. If it is not, then do not run the ballast resistor.
     
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  6. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    its a msd coil ...bottle style
     
  7. shortbed65
    Joined: Feb 20, 2009
    Posts: 204

    shortbed65
    Member
    from ne Ill

    Correct -- it's a weaker spark

    Not sure about your '56 Chevy wiring ,or if you have point ignition
    --- but my '63 C-10 factory wiring for the coil is a steel wire not copper,(grey metal) which makes for the resistance,,,
    Mines HEI now so I pulled that wire out and eliminated the starter "R" terminal wire also
     
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  8. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    well i got a electronic distributor ... and a msd external coil ....ive had to re wire the entire ignition set up ..i was having a problem and thought it was the distributor to only find out my ignition was messed up .when i was trying to start the car i would only get 12v to the starter not the coil than i did a search and realized everyone was using the starter to the coil to give it power on start up .my question is does the coil need the 12v or lower on a constant basis to run or does it see 12v and than after its running not see those 12v like a switch ..
     
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  9. walker
    Joined: Dec 29, 2008
    Posts: 213

    walker
    Member

    12v on startup is for a hotter spark. If you run an externally ballasted coil on 12v for a long period of time it will get very hot and break down. I have had much better luck using coils that are internally ballasted, or say on them that they take 12v power.
     
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  10. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    Does the coil need 12v constant or just on start up..??????
     
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  11. shortbed65
    Joined: Feb 20, 2009
    Posts: 204

    shortbed65
    Member
    from ne Ill

    I'd leave it at full voltage
    fyi --- MSD ign box operates at 10-18v
    Mallory ign box operates at 8-16v
     
  12. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    ok so no resistor...and run it from the nipple on the starter to the positive on coil ...

    not using msd box just coil
     
  13. 333 Half Evil
    Joined: Oct 16, 2006
    Posts: 1,440

    333 Half Evil
    Member

    If it is electronic ignition with the external msd coil, you should not have to run the ballast resistor. I've used msd, mallory, and accell ext. coils on electronic distributors with no ballast resistor. If you are running an electronic ignition conversion in a points type distributor, it will depend on the kit you used on if it will need a ballast resisitor or not. Some of the conversion kits have modules that will burn out if the coil has too much primary voltage and it is on without the engine running. Much like the way points do.
     
  14. Commish
    Joined: Jan 9, 2010
    Posts: 379

    Commish
    Member
    from NW Ok

    Lorodz, from your last question, I not sure you are clear on this yet. If ign. is electronic and needs 12 volt input, then all you need is a 12 volt supply from the ign. switch to input of coil. The only time you need a wire from the starter is when the coil runs at reduced voltage after started.
     
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  15. tommy
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 14,758

    tommy
    Member Emeritus

    I'd contact the manufacturer which I don't think you named, for the wiring diagram that they want. The Chrysler electronic ignition that I use does use a ballast resistor so just because it's electronic doesn't mean that one is not required. Of course it is not wired like the points system diagram above. I'd be afraid of frying the box before I knew what happened.
     
  16. redsdad
    Joined: Oct 5, 2009
    Posts: 254

    redsdad
    Member

    ^^^^^
    What Tommy said.

    On points, they lived a lot longer at 7-9 volts. That is why there is a resistor in the wire (either a resistor wire or a ballast resistor, depending on the car). The problem with that is when cranking, the battery voltage drops to about 10, meaning the ignition saw about 5-7. Reduced spark power at one of the times you need it most. The wire from the starter sent full battery voltage (about 10) to the coil for starting.

    Electronic ignitions control the voltage in the box and there are no points to burn with excess voltage. Each manufacturer has a different requirement, so do what Tommy says.
     
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  17. If you're using an internally resisted coil, then use a constant 12V to the coil. The coil will say that it's internally resisted. If it isn't internally resisted, and your using a ballast resister, then it's 12V to the resister first, then to the coil. If you're using a resistance wire, then IT goes to the coil. Testing the coil with an Ohm or Multi Meter will tell you what the coil is...low Ohms will most likely be NOT internally resisted. High Ohms will most likely be internally resisted...if the coil doesn't have what it is on it...
     
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  18. 29nash
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 4,544

    29nash
    BANNED
    from colorado

    It don't matter if it's points or electronic. Every one I've seen, and certainly every one I've hooked up from scratch run with a ballast(or resistance wire) between the ignition switch and the coil. No need for 12v to the coil after the motor is running.

    Edit that to say; It don't matter if it's points or electronic. Every one I've seen run with a ballast(or resistance wire) between the ignition switch and the coil. Every one I've hooked up from scratch have a ballast resistor, I don't fuck with resistor wires. No need for 12v to the coil after the motor is running with any coil I have ever seen. I hook up a ballast resistor on all coils whether they are old manufacture 6v coils or later 12v versions. It's right if it works.................
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2010
  19. Qutoe 29NASH "It don't matter if it's points or electronic. Every one I've seen, and certainly every one I've hooked up from scratch run with a ballast(or resistance wire) between the ignition switch and the coil. No need for 12v to the coil after the motor is running."


    Not true (well what you have done may be true but that doesn't amek it right). Many brands of Electronic Ignitions DO WANT a constant 12v when running.

    TO answer the question , we really need to know what brand and model of ignition he is running.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2010
  20. Ebbsspeed
    Joined: Nov 11, 2005
    Posts: 4,844

    Ebbsspeed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    440roadrunner, remember last June or so when there was a huge debate about this on another thread. You and I were the only ones to agree on this, everyone else was, Yeah, whatever.....

    Check out the schematic attached, and look at the "internal" wiring of the coil. It does make a difference.....
     

    Attached Files:

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  21. Ebbsspeed, add me to the list of those that agree. Certainly the engineers here at work (where we make Electronic Ignitions and Coils!) agree as well.
    There is no question that the spark energy of a coil wired back wards is decreased.
     
  22. OldBuzzard
    Joined: Mar 8, 2008
    Posts: 878

    OldBuzzard

    Right! The coil does seem to care.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2010
  23. OldBuzzard
    Joined: Mar 8, 2008
    Posts: 878

    OldBuzzard

    The minus terminal is common to both windings, primary and secondary. The free end of the secondary is your spark. The plus terminal is power to the primary which is turned on and off by the points to create a pulse in the secondary. In theory it shouldn't make a difference, but it seems to.
     
  24. 29nash
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 4,544

    29nash
    BANNED
    from colorado

     
  25. 29nash
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 4,544

    29nash
    BANNED
    from colorado

     
  26. so what kind of ignition does he actually have? in my first post i assumed he had just points
     
  27.  
  28. lorodz, backing to your basic question. You said you did a rewire, if it's a factory style replacement the resistor bypass is off the ing. switch.(provided your useing the stock type switch also) On the back of the switch theres ign.1 that goes to the resistor and then to the coil and ign.2 that goes to the other post of resistor to give full voltage at start up. Ing.1 is constant with key on and ign.2 is momentary with key in start position.
     
  29. lorodz
    Joined: Jul 26, 2009
    Posts: 3,727

    lorodz
    Member

    well my distributor is from gmc bubba here on the hamb.....now the coil is a msd but bubba said not to run that so i picked up a stock gm coil ...now on the side of the coil it says to run a resistor in between the ignition to coil +

    my only question here is does the coil need 12v constant or only on start up thats all...
    i bought a ignition switch and key from autozone but for some reason when i ran the 12v power to the on postion ,on the key, to the coil ..when i go to crank it over to start i get no 12v from the switch to the coil. so what i was gonna do is run a 12v constant to a toggle switch and just flip the switch only on start up so i get 12v to the coil, but i wanted to know if i have to leave it on after start up or can i shut it off,i have tryed it and it does work weather the toggle is on or off ...which way is correct..toggle on or off after start up..

    my whole problem here is the ignition preety much ..but i cant find one with a key aftermarket,other than the one i have already bought ..
     
  30. Sounds like your coil is conected to Acc needs to be on Ign
     

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