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Hot Rods Cliffords' 6=8

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by dtwbcs, Jan 7, 2016.

  1. dtwbcs
    Joined: Nov 15, 2011
    Posts: 841

    dtwbcs
    Member
    from Brenham,TX

    Anybody used his dual carb setup? Or the single 4barrel intake? I have the 4barrel intake ;but am leaning now towards the dual carb setup that he sells- for my GMC engine. Other than he is proud of his stuff. He sells it with dual Weber 38/38's, why not two four barrels? Or is it that those duals equal to a single 4barrel carb? Also would it be an issue to run heat to the intake instead of water?
    Thanks in advance,
     
  2. steinauge
    Joined: Feb 28, 2014
    Posts: 1,507

    steinauge
    Member
    from 1960

    All Clifford research stuff is,IME first class.You do get to pay for that.You will generally get your best results power to headache wise with the Clifford 1X4.The twin Weber setup really passes some air and will make more top end power than the 1X4 if you are willing to spend the money and go through the Weber carb setup process. I have never tried hot air instead of hot water for intake heat,but I don't see why it wouldn't work as long as you have some method of turning it off once the engine heats up.
     
  3. mr.chevrolet
    Joined: Jul 19, 2006
    Posts: 7,573

    mr.chevrolet
    Member

    I have the Clifford single four barrel manifold on my 292 chevy. works well. I have a hot water tube welded to the bottom to provide heat to the carb. always hot.
     
  4. mink
    Joined: Oct 4, 2007
    Posts: 1,310

    mink
    Member
    from CT

    I bought a Clifford intake brand new for my project. I can't complain. I have since replaced the edelbrock with a 390cfm 4 barrel and the temporary gas line. I haven't really got to test it out yet. Idles nice
     

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  5. I used a Clifford intake and headers on my 292. Tried several different carbs and the best was a 350-390 cfm Q-jet found on Monza's little 262 V/8s....Intake was heated and I ran 2.5 inch pipes out to a pair of steel pack mufflers and to a pair of 3 inch "blewey pipes"18 inches long. Man, that thing would sing.
     
    Frankie47 likes this.
  6. banjeaux bob
    Joined: Aug 31, 2008
    Posts: 6,067

    banjeaux bob
    Member
    from alaska

    Clifford equipment is quality stuff. If you're looking for more information and some different "takes' on combinations that have been tried and tested go over to Inliners International.There a lot of folks there who have tried most everything out there for inline engines.
    http://www.inliners.org/
     
    Frankie47 likes this.
  7. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,578

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    2 4's way too much carb for a six. The smallest single 4 barrel is about right. Or the twin 2 barrels. The single 4 barrel works well and is simple. Don't know what advantage there is to twin carbs except tradition.
     
  8. choptop40
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 3,896

    choptop40
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    To make it pull like a v8 you had to fabricate dividers in the head , I had a solid lifter version , viper headers.....no one could figure out how to set the valve lash...
     
  9. Devin
    Joined: Dec 28, 2004
    Posts: 2,351

    Devin
    Member
    from Napa, CA

    What size GMC do you have? I was just looking at the Clifford Weber 38/38 DGAS Setyo for my 270 but was wondering if it would be too much carb. (If you ask the question you know the answer lol)
     
  10. raprap
    Joined: Oct 8, 2009
    Posts: 768

    raprap
    Member
    from Ohio

    I had a Clifford single 4 barrel intake at first on my 292. Well designed, simple and it worked great. Inline sixes should always have a water heated intake for even and complete atomization of the fuel. A cold intake (I've seen ice build ups on them) will make your six run poorly and cause detonation. I switched to an OFFY 3x2 with 5100 Holley/Webers for the look and power. Each carb is about 160 CFM so together it's approx. 500CFM's. That's a good air/fuel volume for a built big block six. I've even disconnected the outer secondaries and found no loss in power but over 20MPG @ 65mph. A 3x2 set up evenly distributes the Air & Fuel across the head nicely. Simple straight linkage with progressive carbs make the set up simple. Chevy Motor 2.jpg
     
  11. old sparks
    Joined: Mar 12, 2012
    Posts: 414

    old sparks
    Member

    2 fours on a Clifford works very well for me. In my situation all I need is for it to idle and run wide open. This combo worked by curing the uneven fuel distribution I encountered when running the single four system. It also proved the theory that the 292 loves a lot of fuel that the sdra guys believe in. I haven`t yet run into non inline guys that don`t tell me that I have to much carburator
     
  12. ol-nobull
    Joined: Oct 16, 2013
    Posts: 1,640

    ol-nobull
    Member

    Hi. My avatar here shows my 46 Chevy Coupe with the 235 engine with the Clifford water heated manifold with 2 of the Weber 34-36 carbs. The water heated intake works just fine. I probably am going to have to put in a bypass water valve around my heater come summer months though.
    I had to slightly modify the bell crank on side of engine & use a Lokar cable to operate the carb linkage as the original carb linkage pulled straight down and this setup pull toward the firewall.
    I did not like the Red Line air cleaners that came with the setup as they were cheap chrome and were not holding up well so I bought the Orbit style cast/polished aluminum from Speedway and 2 offset air cleaner base adapter bases from an ebay seller.
    I also got the Clifford shorty tube headers as this thicker/deeper intake would not allow clearance for Fenton & most other Headers.
    Also bought the Clifford 264 grind cam with solid lifters & new heavy duty springs.
    Runs like a dream. Changed to 700R16 Cokers on rear with 600R16 front & changed ring & pinion from 411 to 355. Now it will cruise down the road at 2,500 RPM at 65 MPH with the original 3 on the tree. This setup was worth the money.

    Jimmie
     
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  13. mr.chevrolet
    Joined: Jul 19, 2006
    Posts: 7,573

    mr.chevrolet
    Member

    I should have mentioned in my post that I am running a 600 CFM Holley carb turned sideways for even fuel distribution. Langdons cast headers too.
     
  14. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,694

    NashRodMan
    Member

    What he said but I have the hot water plate that bolts to the bottom of the manifold. It works great.
     
  15. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,694

    NashRodMan
    Member

    Mr C,
    How is that 600 working for you? When I researched my setup I saw that a 390 was the recommended carb CFM.
    Oh and I also have the Langdons cast headers. LOL
     
  16. mr.chevrolet
    Joined: Jul 19, 2006
    Posts: 7,573

    mr.chevrolet
    Member

    I have had no trouble with the carb, runs great. I also have a reworked head, ported with bigger valves. got it on E-Bay long ago from a stock car guy in Neb. also running a Wolverine Cam from Langdons. no idea on the specs, just bought what Tom Langdon recommended after hearing all the specs and how I was going to use it. 200-4R OD with a shift kit too.
     
  17. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,694

    NashRodMan
    Member

    Sweet. I was asking cuz I'm just wondering if my carb isn't big enough. My 292 is bored 0.030, with a Clifford cam and I have a World Class Camaro T5. It doesn't seem to have as much power as I thought it would have but Im no tuner by any means!! thanks
     
  18. raprap
    Joined: Oct 8, 2009
    Posts: 768

    raprap
    Member
    from Ohio

    NashRodMan,

    My 292 is .30 over, ported, polished with Langdon's 270 dual duration Wolverine cam and a non-WC T-5 from a Z-28. I've known Tom for over 20 years and I purchase my stuff from him. He is the go to guy for newer GM inline power stuff! Honest and prices are as good as there is. He came up to me at the NSRA NATS North in Kalamazoo, showed his friend his products on my car and sold the guy right there. He even heard my car running a little rough and went back to his truck and brought over a dwell tack, new points and carb jets and fixed my car so it run like a Swiss Watch! now that's going above and beyond.
     
    6-bangertim likes this.
  19. dtwbcs
    Joined: Nov 15, 2011
    Posts: 841

    dtwbcs
    Member
    from Brenham,TX

    Ole no bull -Fenton headers won't work with Clifford intake? I have a gmc270 engine but hope to upgrade to a 302
    I'm reading that water heat is the way to go? Or does it matter that much?i bought a 32/36weber to go with the intake but am thinking I should have bought a small 4barrel instead...
     
  20. gas pumper
    Joined: Aug 13, 2007
    Posts: 2,956

    gas pumper
    Member

    I run no heat on a street 235 with a pair of single rochesters and have no issues with icing or anybad behavior, YMMV.

    On our 302 race motor we run a Clifford Single 4 bbl intake, no heat, no issues and we run that in 30 degree weather and 100 degree weather. A Holley 600, not sideways, great performer and a record holder at the Loring LSR....
     
  21. ol-nobull
    Joined: Oct 16, 2013
    Posts: 1,640

    ol-nobull
    Member

    Hi Danny. The Fenton's will not work with the newer Clifford's that have the water heated chamber cast into the bottom of the intake. That chamber is just too deep for the Fenton's to clear. If you have the older Clifford intake without the water chamber cast in the bottom they should work.
    I think just 1 32-36 is not enough for your engine. When I ordered my setup I talked to Larry at Clifford's & gave him my specs - @354 bored 0.060 & he recommended his Clifford 262 grind cam & two 2 barrel Weber 34-36 carbs. At that time I also asked Larry about the Fenton headers and he explained that the oversize of this newer intake just would not allow clearance and I would have to grind both the intake & fenton headers to almost paper thinness to match them together. So I ordered his Shorty Tube headers also. His stuff is not cheap but it is good quality. I recall it was around $2,000 for everything 2 years ago - cam, lifters, springs, complete intake set up with carbs, linkage manifold, air cleaners, fuel regulator, headers & gaskets, etc.
    I have no complaints at all with his stuff other than what I consider cheap chroming on the Red Line air cleaners which I replaced this year with polished cast aluminum ones.
    Jimmie
     
  22. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,694

    NashRodMan
    Member

    Raprap,
    Ya, I did a lot of reading at Langdons site. He is very knowledgeable and a nice guy, easy to talk to. I bought the engine from a guy I know that already had it built but never used it. He had the machine shop that built it put the Clifford cam in so the engine was already built. Got a great deal on this "new" engine and it included the Langdon exh manifold and the Offenhauser intake. Its not lump ported though. Bummer. LOL Anyway I had a friend (who is a much better mechanic than I am) check it out quickly and he said the Holley 390 secondaries aren't kicking in. So, I think that is the first place to look at for my situation. I know this engine is much more capable than I am experiencing!!
    Sorry to everyone else on this thread...don't mean to hijack this thread but there is a lot of great info building up here!
    Thanks all!
     
  23. dtwbcs
    Joined: Nov 15, 2011
    Posts: 841

    dtwbcs
    Member
    from Brenham,TX

    Jimmie thanks 4 the Info...
     
  24. ShawninCO
    Joined: Jun 18, 2013
    Posts: 22

    ShawninCO
    Member
    from Colorado

    Hello All. I finally have the time and money to put my 223 back together. Have had the cam ground by SLR, all the machine work has been done per Larry etc.

    I've run into a snag with the timing chain. With the new setup I understand I need to now go "dot to dot" with the timing gears rather than the original setup because of the new cam grind. When I do so, I have significant conflict between a connecting rod and the cam. Is the attached picture "Timing chain correct for Clifford" the way it should be installed on the engine? This is quite a bit different then the original "Timing per book". Must be doing something dumb, but I don't see it. The difference between the "dot to dot" setup and the original seems to be way to much to compensate for the additional 4 degree advance with the new cam.

    Thank you.
     

    Attached Files:

  25. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 9,468

    jimmy six
    Member

    I’ve used Cliffords equipment since 1975. Jack was a fun guy to work with back then. His GMC tubing 3-2 manifold served me well for over 30 years and is now a wall hanger. His long tube Viper header were the best available and I used them in different cars.
    The photo you see lead to him making a single and dual manifolds for the GMC as he only made the tubing and side draft Weber’s for the GMC. I was able to convert a 194-292 single manifold for my GMC stock head with a lot of hours of work. After setting speed records with it I understand he received calls with customers wanting one. Their reply was they didn’t make one. Soon one was available. Anyway I’d recommend Clifford to anyone, not inexpensive but well worth it. I still have a few extra 193-292 in my stash. The headers are Burns Stainless without the extension. 84099F15-B84C-40D6-807C-3E2611D8B48E.jpeg
     
  26. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 10,829

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Looking at the dots compared to the key way in the gears, they look the same to me. Think I would try and set the dots as in the manual then check with a degree wheel.
     
    6-bangertim likes this.
  27. ShawninCO
    Joined: Jun 18, 2013
    Posts: 22

    ShawninCO
    Member
    from Colorado

    Thanks. I may have to go that route. Larry from Clifford says explicitly in his documentation to go "dot to dot" and has confirmed as much en an email but it isn't working for me or like I said, I'm missing something basic.
     
  28. Screen Shot 2021-03-17 at 8.13.54 PM.png

    I've had a Clifford 4-barrel intake on my 223 inliner for 12 years now with a 390 Holley, Clifford's splitter headers, 265 Clay Smith cam, and Mallory ignition. Never had a problem, gets great gas mileage. Quality equipment, no complaints from me.

    Before reinstalling this last time, I polished the manifold and had it powdercoated clear. And the headers stay rust-free with an occasional wipe down with black stove polish.
     
  29. NashRodMan
    Joined: Jul 8, 2004
    Posts: 1,694

    NashRodMan
    Member

    Pete,
    Nice set up ya got there! Love that rocker cover too. Almost got one for mine but never pulled the trigger.
     

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