The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by lilbill, Nov 24, 2006.
I would be really interested in that 2X1 intake! Planning on selling them?
Hi im building a 181 for a fenderless 36 gmc rod -have been talking to a iron Duke stroker guru who told me the 87 fiero hydro roller cam will fit the 181 block--fiero block was used in rwd's and fwd's, Fwd stuff wont work, Im trying to find a cam maker who will outfit .3000 taller SBC chevy hydro roller lifters with 6 cyl/4 cyl tie-link bars , comp cams apparantly are too Big for their own good "go away-Dont bother me" so no luck with lifters yet- But i found the only cam maker in the univers and can get a custom hydro roller with -oh 485 lift would be alright. Crower sells SS roller rockers 1 7.5 ready to go for the 4 cyl. Im making my own cast intake for either two 94's or a single, plenium will have a bolt on top plate. this is to get it runnin, 175 hp with carbs should be pretty easy but I want to go EFI to get 200 N/A hp eventually. i'll have to drill the crank front to use a bolt to hold down the SBC fluid damper. The 153 was called the "shaky II" and enlarging it to 181 only made it worse so ill be using big fluid cushion mounts (vette ls1) with a front plate mounting them well above the crankshaft centerlne as well as duel benz diesel engine shocks on both sides. a msd box and vacuum advance dis both help idle smoother er else the damn thing will shake worse than a meskin washin machine. Using the 50lb flywheel/clutch setup would be smoother but im using a 25 lb assembly i scored on ebay with a T5. A better choice for sidedrafts would be the new Zeniths instead of the old carter blueflame carbs
Isky offers 3 roller cams in their catalog for the chevy II.
They are all solids,not hydraullic
My '29 highboy has a 153 " with an Isky cam, 2B carb, headers and a 4 speed. Plenty of scoot and no problems. Been in the car for 34 years!
I just picked up another from a fellow HAMBer that will go into a '32 Chevy modified.
I love 'em.
I have one of these motors. SBC Head modified to fit. Am working on a intake idea for it. want to put it in a 32 PU
I just read the whole thread and noticed no-one mentioned OMC marine as a chevy ll banger engine. I have a friend here in town that has one in his swather as well. I don't know the brand of it, but apparently they were used in farm machinery. They were only available in Canada in Chevy lls from 62-64. They were used in Nova's until 1970 in the US. The one I used in my 27 T tub was out of a 66 chevy van. I don't know if it was factory or whether someone dropped it in there. I also used a turbo 350 behind it. It is running a 2.79 ford 8" rear end with 29 inch tall rear tires. It is a screamer off the lite and chirps going into second if you hold the pedal down to the metal, which is how you have to drive it. It would do 65-70 on the hiway, but with the tall top on my tub it is like pulling a parachute and the car does not like headwinds. They drastically cut the speed down. Gas mileage is great around town, but brutal on the hiway as you have to keep your foot to the floor. I gave the car to my daughter a few years back and she lives in a large metrolitan area. The car mostly gets driven under 50 mph now and no head winds. I live on the prairies and everywhere I go I need to travel at 65-70 mph due to the distances involved. It is also windy here. I need a V-8. I loved that little engine though and would use one in a track T if I built one. Pat.
The 8 port head is the the difference, you say so your self. There was also a 6 port head 181(the lower hp one)
Some of the later heads have coolant running to the manifold. I do not know which ones, but some of them do! The chevy II version does not, the early 8 ports dont either. Thats why I say it depends on which one.
I was referring to the stock manifold exit for the exhaust "going out the hood". The stock manifold exhaust exits straight out the top of the manifold, but its turned 90 degrees by an elbow. 90 degree exhaust bends arent a good idea in any situation.
...So its gota be changed for a hot rodder right? Then you add the price of a clifford set-up to a 300 dollar motor, and your looking at damn neer v8 money for half the performance.
We also dont need to even think if it was a salt water system, and the corrosion in the block.
So yes, they are sometimes awesome deals, and sometimes they are not!
My 151 is at the machine shop geting cleaned up, they are great but can be spendy!
Im not taking any orders, but it would be extremely limited numbers, and by request only.
All 181's are 140 hp and have 8 ports. I did say that is the difference, but it has nothing to do with the exhaust running through the hood. There are no 6 port 140s.
Those marine intake/exhaust manifolds are interchangeable between the 110, 120 and 140 hp engines and because there in boats, they all have water pumping through them. Is that what you meant by running the exhaust through the hood? Using one of the marine manifolds?
fordnutz, that a great looking touring. I like the skinny whites and baby moons. Reminds me of a car that was on the cover on Car Craft in the late 60's. I'll have to look for that mag.
Of course your right about the OMC. Speaking from my own back ground, we used the mercruiser banger over the OMC by about 20 to one. Mercruiser is want the customer wanted.
Pat: first, beautiful car.
What would you estimate your HP at? What displacement is it?
Flyin T, the car you are referring to was Monteiro's T on the cover of Car Craft. It was also in the Beach Party movie with Annette and Frankie Avalalon. I saw the car in the movie at 13 and I was hooked. Had to have one some day. I used the 4 banger to be different. I was going for the early 60's look. As for the OMC engine, I think you could get the 153 version from them. It was a factory Chev engine. The mercruiser was a larger displacement, so I guess that is why they outsold the OMC. The skinny wheels are 14x5 late 60's nova and the rear are 15x5 1/2 54 ford station wagon. They fit nice in the fenders. Axle is a narrowed super bell. 67 mustang rear.
GuyW, Thanks for the compliment. I don't know what the horsepower is but I started with the 153 engine, so 90 hp to begin with. Shaved the head and bored 60 over. That is about it. Pat.
thanks for the info on your car, I'm sure it's the one I remember too. I'll have to watch beach blanket bingo again and try to spot it.
The 153 was mercruiser's and omc's work horse. It wasn't until about 1971 or so that mercruiser came out with the 140 hp, 181 ci motor. The mercruisers before, like you mentioned, were based on the 90 hp 153 Chevy II engine and those were rated at 110 or 120 hp for both suppliers. And merc had the cool little finned aluminum side and valve cover. I always liked the factory Chevrolet valve cover for the little four, it was stamped 'Chevy' instead of Chevrolet.
I don't know why merc outsold OMC other than the I/O unit was better.. in many ways. Nothing wrong with the old OMCs but their power trim deal was very clunky. The outdrive was lowered all the way down and then to trim the engine the front motor mounts had little lifts in them and the engine and out drive tilted as one piece. the Mercruiser of course used the hyd rams along side of the stern drive. OMC jumped all over that design in the 80s when mercs patent ran out and came out with the Cobra which was a piece of shit, then they redesigned it into the king cobra. It's ok. Mercruiser still the king.
Flyin T, the movie is called Beach Party and the car is in the opening scenes. There was also a yellow T tub in another Annette/Frankie movie. Not the same car. They are both pictured in the book on the LA Roadsters as both guys were members. My brother worked at OMC in Vancouver, BC. I used to get my engine parts from him as I could buy wholesale. Pat.
I'll check netflix for that movie.
It's always good to have connections when buying marine parts.
When OMC introduced the Cobra they really had their hands full with all the problems. When they re-engineered they they wanted to let it be know that the units were stronger and more reliable. They approached us about getting some king of record that they could use in their advertisements. So we built one of our tunnels, used a King Cobra drive with a nose cone and a single carbed small block chevy and went after the ETII record, Endurance Tunnel. We set the kilo record at 116 or 118 ( I can't remember exactly now) and I believe the records still stands today. The Cobra in the end did become a strong unit.
Way off topic.
May be a dumb question, but does it matter which way you run the V8 head- would it be possible to flip the head end for end?
cam is on the right side so the head had to go that way.
Like I said, probably a dumb question...
I knew about the cam placement
I Don't know how to tell you guys this, but the Pontiac motor and the "Iron Duke" are engines from the same mold so to speak. I worked for GM as a Pontiac service manager when the 2.5 came out. Pontiac wanted a new 4 banger for their line and did not want the awful Vega based 2.3 that was still available because they remembered the trouble they had with their version of the Vega, the Astra. They wanted to start with a clean sheet but GM management said it must be all metric. Pontiac didn't have the funds available to make all new tooling for metric construction at that time. They went hunting in the GM warehouses and found the Iron Duke tooling gathering dust. Pontiac brass made a pitch to GM brass to reuse the Iron Duke with some evolutionary changes. GM brass bought it and Pontiac changes the bore(increased)and stroke(decreased) to 151 ci instead of 153. A new smog head was fitted and other minor changes done. All this added up to much less investment than a clean sheet engine. I got the info in person from SoCal Pontiac district service manager at a meeting prior to introduction. And, he got the news straight from the horse's rears in Detroit.
Some of the old boats also had a 153 engine that was rated 130 hp. This enine had a 2 carb set up. You guys looking for a 2 carb manifold might try looking in some old boat boneyards.
somewhat related thread....
Yes some did have dual carbs but there are no manifolds to be had from the marinized chevy II engines that will work on the street. You could run one of these in your car, but I don't know why anyone would want to.
The intake and exhaust on all of the 153 and 181's marine engines, are cast into one big heavy water cooled manifold. This picture is of the more common single carb manifold, but the dual set up is the same.
Clifford Performance makes an intake for the 153:
I spotted this marine head on eBay this morning.....
Somebody here might have a use for it.
I just bought a 1996 regal with 2 of these 181 motors and i know one is locked and the other has only 50lbs in 2 and 150 in the front two holes. I been thinking of if they need to be replaced could i build them up a little or what. They had a bad manifold design tjhat is expensive and lets water in for some reason. Im learning about it now. I wonder if a small block vortec head would be a good match. I need to look at how you would do the intake as well but they make a marine exaust manifold . Dont know if it would work at that angle. But it would be cool to show off...
I ALSO HAVE 2 153 CHEV.II ENGINES. i'd like to build 1 for my T. I know bore is the same as a 283, but would the deck height be the same? Are the rods the same length?[as283] Will the head from a 120/140 mercruiser fit the 153 block? [the 8-port variety] . what cams are available? I'll stop here and see if we can get some midget guys w/knowledge of these engines to chime in. Thanx in advance!
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