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chevy ll 4 banger ?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by lilbill, Nov 24, 2006.

  1. The crank is different. It is also a lot beefier. I am not sure what you mean when you say "... longer rods on a 153 crank"? Longer rods on a 153 crank would just run the pistons into the head. Maybe you are thinking of grinding the throws off center?

    Charlie Stephens
     
  2. The pistons are the same as a 283..I can't think of a thing else..Maybe the oil pan bolts?
     
  3. vinfab
    Joined: Apr 18, 2006
    Posts: 217

    vinfab
    Member

    A 305 has a 3.48 inch stroke, not a 3.25. However a 307 is 3.875 x 3.25, so a 153 is half of a 307. And you cannot use 283 pistons even though they have the same bore diameter, the pin height will be incorrect due to the 283s 3 inch stroke.
     
    X-cpe likes this.
  4. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 12,700

    Tim
    Member
    from KCMO

    Any chance you can show wha radiator you using and how the hoses are routed?

    As just mentioned 283 has incorrect wrist pin height. 307 pistons are what you’d want.

    Also as far as I can tell stock flattop 307 pistons are what was used to make these little motors 10:1 comp in some factory applications
     
  5. You sure of this, boys? You're the experts..What does a W235NP piston fit?
    153 uses a 5.7 rod so what is the deck height of a 153 ? 283?
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  6. justabeater37
    Joined: Jan 1, 2009
    Posts: 1,356

    justabeater37
    Member

    Someday I still want to use the 181 block and pistons with the 153 crank but need to find the 5.85” rods or perhaps stay with the 5.7” rods and a 327 flat top. Then use a 181 head with an individual runner intake with Weber size drafts. So many ideas so little cash.
     
    29EHV8 and Papas32 like this.
  7. chiliman
    Joined: Oct 8, 2011
    Posts: 78

    chiliman
    Member
    from liberty mo
    1. H.A.M.B. Chapel

    Yeah keep the input guys Learning a lot guys yep
     
  8. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Yes, I confused the 305 and the 307. I'm not a small block aficionado. Doing the math none of these engines come out exactly what they are called. Some come closer than others. One thing I found out while trying to use 307 pistons is that the manufactures lower the pin height with oversize pistons to keep compression to the stock specs. So the bigger the overbore the farther down the hole the piston sits. I got several sets of .040 over pistons before I learned this. I'm using Ross forged flat tops for a 250 L6 with 181 rods and crank. 153 and 181 rods are the same length but the 181 uses the same bearing as a 350 while the 153 uses the 283 bearing. On my block the Ross pistons stick out the top .020" and have to be fitted for zero deck. On the next one I'll deck the block to fit the 307 pistons.
     
    vinfab likes this.
  9. “I’m not a Small Block aficionado.”

    Don’t worry! There’s still time!


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    tractorguy likes this.
  10. Trying to figure out what fits you could always find an older shop with catalogs that is willing to work with you. Or maybe a GM dealer on a slow day? You should be able to look up the parts for the banger and then cross reference to other applications. If I remember correctly the parts came from a number of different small block V8 and 6 cylinder engines.

    Charlie Stephens
     
  11. gearheadbill
    Joined: Oct 11, 2002
    Posts: 1,312

    gearheadbill
    Member

    Obviously a wrong-headed addled septuagenarian comment. The stroke of the crank is what defines; longer rods do not. My apologies
     
  12. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Not a problem. Sometimes it is hard to get your head around it all at once. There are at least 3 threads on the HAMB about these engines. Some of the information is wrong and I posted some of it. We learn as we go.
     
    29EHV8 likes this.
  13. Years ago I acquired one of these engines in a trade. It was in a Willys flat fender. It was hopped up years ago with a bunch of great goodies. I got it to put in my daughters (15) Model T lakesmod, with a T5 that we are building now.
    The engine turned out to be a 181, Erson cam (hooped) Mallory ignition, header, stainless valves, Clifford 4bbl intake etc. It still had stock rods and pistons. Well I just sold off my vintage racecars that run hopped up 250 Chevys. Had some parts left over and low and behold my kids engine now has 4" TRW flat top forged pistons and Eagle H beem rods!
    I am going to build my own intake with 2 97s or 2GCs.
    Were looking for a "CHEVY" valve cover...
    Also need an aftermarket camshaft, anyone holding? Or have advice on a cam that works good with a stick?

    -Shiny
     
    Tim likes this.
  14. justabeater37
    Joined: Jan 1, 2009
    Posts: 1,356

    justabeater37
    Member

    Hoping to have my T with the 153 on the toad by spring. Lump ported head, dual 97s, Frontenac cover with and adapter, Isky cam, flat top pistons. Mated to a T50 5 speed should be a fun little car. Only question I still have is what are people doing for distributors? I have one with a vacuum advance and several Mercruisers AF92FD0B-1D2B-4085-90E7-A704E4DB9E17.jpeg without.
     
    1929CDAN, Tim and 29EHV8 like this.
  15. v860rich
    Joined: Nov 6, 2006
    Posts: 37

    v860rich
    Member

    I race some vintage midgets that use these engines, mostly 181's. All of mine have magnitos.
    I do have some stock 153's in a storage shed and one of them may have a points ign. still in it.
    I also have a bunch of cores to sell, marine head, blocks, cranks ect.

    THANX RICH
     
    29EHV8 likes this.
  16. Fstarocka
    Joined: Mar 29, 2013
    Posts: 175

    Fstarocka
    Member

    didnt read all 16 pages, but the 153 were the same motor as the 67 chevy2, the earlier models had a 2" crank journal size.. later 2.1iirc. the 140/3.0 also have custom pistons witha special pin height.. 2 thou more than regular.. I rebuild these and not always 100% on the exact specs till i double check and confirm :) I cross reference the parts on rockauto.. usually you can get a set for a v8 (bearings/rings/etc) for just a little more than for a 4 banger -

    They are DEAD reliable.. i know some mercruiser guys tried fuel injection on them to up the power to 185 and had issues.. so i would leave it stock :) if anything id port the heads, maybe ill the block down and play with a nice street cam.. cant see the need for more than one carb but it is cool to have 2 :)

    Odd bore size too on the 153.. 3.875
     
  17. Yup, besides the 153, only the 230, 250, 283, 307 :rolleyes:
     
    29EHV8 likes this.
  18. Flamed48
    Joined: Apr 19, 2011
    Posts: 677

    Flamed48
    Member

    Stroke is all in the crank shaft


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  19. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Looks like you took my 3X1 Offey intake mod to the next level with 2X2 instead of my 2X1. Looks great! A Harper approach to a part of 97s on one of these engines would be fun to try.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2019
  20. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Is your 181 a one or two piece rear main seal engine? Are the rods for the four or did you use small block rods? What grind is your Erson cam? That's aftermarket.
     
  21. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    The 292 has a 3.875 bore too. Way different height but same bore.
     
    Mark Yac likes this.
  22. It is a 2 piece rear seal.
    The rods are from one of my 250 six cylinders, really nice pieces. SBC rods have a different thickness main.
    Not sure what grind the Erson cam is, numbers punched on it are messed up.
    Any kniw a good cam to run in one of these with a stick?

    -Shiny
     
  23. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 3,398

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    Cause I'm looking way and don't feel like looking it up , will a 181 crank work in a 153 block? , What pistons would you use with a shorter compression height ?
     
  24. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,140

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    Here are 3 Erson cam profiles that were worked up for my build before Erson moved back east. I chose #3. 100_1908.jpg 100_1909.jpg 100_1910.jpg

    Yes the 181 crank will work in a 153 block. There may be interference with #2 rod and the fuel pump lobe on the cam. I am using Ross forged flat top 250 Chevy six pistons and stock 181 rods. They are about .020" too tall and have to be fitted. That will vary from block to block if they have been decked,
     
  25. Still waiting to hear what the deck height spec is on a stock 153 block..What are they , really?

    Google is so totally f*cked now..
    "What is the deck height on a Chevy II , 153 engine?"
    Answer:
    "Chevy II's? Seriously, we got'em at Ebay..."
     
  26. Flamed48
    Joined: Apr 19, 2011
    Posts: 677

    Flamed48
    Member

  27. Fast411
    Joined: Sep 2, 2010
    Posts: 19

    Fast411
    Member
    from Montana

    Just for informational and interest purposes, there is a huge following in Brazil and other South American areas of the Chevy Opala. Found this fellow that owns Classic Racing Parts in Brazil Jean Michel Colet. They build some really stout 4 and 6 cylinder GM engines. Head porting on the 153 style heads looks amazing. They have intakes, forged pistons, etc. Classic Racing Parts is on Youtube and you can see some interesting work on these engines.

    Jean's email to me: "First, I would like to invite you to follow our social network, Instagram, see: https://www.instagram.com/classicracingpartsoficial/ Yes, we work a lot with them, and we have spare parts, here there is the 151 "which is 3" of course x 4 "piston. The model 153" only came out 4 years in Brazil from 1970 to 1974. This one crankshaft stroke is 3.25 ". We put it on the 151" engine with the 4 "pistons yielding a 164" engine"
     

    Attached Files:

  28. CNC-Dude
    Joined: Nov 23, 2007
    Posts: 943

    CNC-Dude
    Member

    The Brazilian version is like the US Iron Duke 151 cubic inch engine that has 4 intake ports and not like the older US 153 engine that has just 2 Siamese intake ports like the larger 194,250,292 six cylinder engines which has 3 intake ports.
     
  29. tractorguy
    Joined: Jan 5, 2008
    Posts: 693

    tractorguy
    Member

    Really nice looking rebirth of the Chev II in your T. As to your distributor......Rich mentioned magneto. Likc Rich, I have also had several midget race cars with Chev II motors. I just sold my last car about a month ago. It was a 153 Chev II installed in a Solar rail frame chassis in the 1960's when the Ford V8/60 was removed. Instead of a Vertex magneto, the engine builder converted a Wico tractor magneto to be adapted to the original lower distributor body of the 153. It was a really nice setup and very traditional. I still have several other "homemade" tractor magneto conversions to Chev II on the shelf. That type of a unit would really set you apart from the crowd. I do not know any of the fine points of the process of marrying the magneto to the distributor body, but there may be some experts out there. Have fun
     

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