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Technical Body Filler Basics

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by K13, Jan 11, 2020.

  1. oldcootnco
    Joined: Jun 10, 2010
    Posts: 67

    oldcootnco
    Member

    The last 16 yrs. of my bump and grind career was at a major fire truck builder. We had more than one company try to get the business. We were using an Evercoat product, Rage Gold Ultimate or Ultra. This stuff spread easily, great sanding properties, and if you did not ABUSE it very little or zero pinholes. It is expensive, I think in the range of 50$ or more per gallon.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2020
    Dino 64 and flynbrian48 like this.
  2. flynbrian48
    Joined: Mar 10, 2008
    Posts: 6,435

    flynbrian48
    Member

    Great info in this thread, thanks! I can't add anything, aside from I always mix on a sheet of old laminate glass. I've had the same side window from my Diamond T pickup that I've been using for over a decade. Before that, a cracked w/s glass from my Chris Craft! Gotta have quality tools...:p
     
    Torchie likes this.
  3. As I mentioned I am not going to get into specific products as that was not my intent with this thread others are certainly welcome to add their experiences. I will say in general you get what you pay for with fillers and putties from all companies.
    Heat, especially cyclical heat like an oil pan is tough and I wouldn't recommend using any polyester based products for that type of application. You would need to look into fillers used in powder coating like LabMetal's high temp filler or Tiger Drylac's epo strong or something along those lines.
     
  4. earlymopar
    Joined: Feb 26, 2007
    Posts: 1,173

    earlymopar
    Member

    Yep. LabMetal and other powder-coat fillers are exactly what I had been considering. Thanks much.

    - EM
     
  5. I have no direct experience with these products so I would suggest contacting them to confirm. The cycling of the heat is my biggest concern as it can work things loose over time.
     
  6. earlymopar
    Joined: Feb 26, 2007
    Posts: 1,173

    earlymopar
    Member

    I worked with and for companies that used Labmetal filler as a means to salvage die-cast parts when working with the powder coating industry. The only experience I don't have with it is in applying it and working it to shape. But, I know it's quite a bit harder than regular body filler. The temperature capability however is over 2X what the oil pan will see.

    - EM
     
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  7. gene-koning
    Joined: Oct 28, 2016
    Posts: 1,821

    gene-koning
    Member

    Unless there is more then one choice of Bondo on the shelf, in my opinion, leave it there. There is a higher quality of Bondo available then the cheap stuff on most store shelves, but my experience with the cheap stuff makes me unwilling to try even the better stuff. Sanding the cheap stuff seems to be a lot like sanding on concrete, not much seems to happen very fast. You will eat up more the difference in price between the cheap filler and the best filler in sandpaper costs.

    Now, how about that sanding tech? Gene
     
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  8. chopolds
    Joined: Oct 22, 2001
    Posts: 5,741

    chopolds
    Member
    from howell, nj
    1. Kustom Painters

    Great post!
     
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  9. blowby
    Joined: Dec 27, 2012
    Posts: 6,596

    blowby
    Member
    from Nicasio Ca

    Bump & grind, must add to cave & pave and scuff & puff repetoire.

    Used Rage on my heap at my auto body class (free) but had to buy a pint of Bondo at Oreillys for some minor work at home. No comparison.
     
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  10. Flathead Youngin'
    Joined: Jan 10, 2005
    Posts: 3,661

    Flathead Youngin'
    Member

    Yes, excellent thread!
     
  11. Ford blue blood
    Joined: Jan 4, 2009
    Posts: 622

    Ford blue blood
    Member

    Best info would come from an automotive paint store/supplier. Both of the big ones here will talk at what ever level you want, from beginner to expert. Mostly they make there money off the pro collision shops, but it has been my experience that they enjoy sharing knowledge and helping the novice. Stay away from the "drug store" filler, it is junk at best and only God knows how long it has been sitting on the shelf!
     
  12. overspray
    Joined: Jan 14, 2003
    Posts: 1,232

    overspray
    Member

    Good job--K13!
     
    K13 likes this.
  13. jvo
    Joined: Nov 11, 2008
    Posts: 220

    jvo
    Member

    Very interesting thread. My question if for the grit of the sandpaper. I only do metal work. I only do drywall work on my own stuff, not on anyone else's. I grind the welds down with 3M green corps 01991 wheels on a die grinder. I have been using 36 grit 3 inch roloc discs for the final finish on bare metal, once all the weld bead is gone.
    The only negative feedback I have ever gotten was by one painter who bitched that the 36 grit marks were hard to cover up. My response was that he obviously didn't need any filler in those areas, BUT, perhaps I should be going to a finer grit to make everyone's life easier. I always figured the coarse grit scratches were a good thing, to enhance the surface grip.
    I do pretty much zero bondo work, but everyone knows you are still going to need a little filler. I use 24 inch stainless steel ruler, laid flat on the panel surface. If I can see light under the ruler I bump up the lows, and/or take down the highs with shrinking disc. (I find it much more satisfying to do metal work than to sand the filler)
    I don't promise anyone that they won't need a little filler, but it will be damn little, so that is why I ask about the coarse grit sanding paper on bare metal before filler application. Your comment on body shops wanting to use 80 grit made me think about that. Thanks. Great thread.
     
  14. I can't think of a primer that is designed to go over 36 grit. The minimum is usually 80 and more often than not 180. Rolocs put in the worst kind of scrartch to try and cover because they are straight line scratches that require a lot of primer to bury and can often lead to problems like sand sctrach swelling or die back. Now having said that the standard procedure should be to sand the bare metal before applying anything anyways so a shop should be doing at least one step of sanding prior to any product being applied. Probably best to ask whoever you are doing the work for what they prefer. Lots of old school guys down in the Lethbridge area that are hard to convert to new ways. Believe me I have tried.;)
     
  15. jvo
    Joined: Nov 11, 2008
    Posts: 220

    jvo
    Member

    Thanks. Biggest reason I use 36 grit is that after about 2 minutes they are 60 grit, and another 2 minutes they are 80 grit it seems. I am a cheap sob, I guess. I think I'll try some 80 grit next time I buy a box. Appreciate the info.
     
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  16. lostone
    Joined: Oct 13, 2013
    Posts: 1,205

    lostone
    Member
    from kansas

    When I managed a body shop I wouldn't let my guys use anything coarser than 80 grit. It may take longer but I didn't want issues later with primer/paint shrinkage and sanding marks showing back up later.

    If im shaping I'll use 36 grit but I come back with a body file and then finish of with 80. I actually enjoy using the metal body file.
     
  17. RottonRon
    Joined: Aug 22, 2005
    Posts: 105

    RottonRon
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Filler use after a fresh bead blasted body? I should'nt prime first? or 2part primer and then filler ? I'm just getting my blasted body back and begging for the correct procedure ?? I have to stop surface rust and do body filler at same time ! thanks for advice ron
     
  18. You’ve got to get it clean and get a decent coat of epoxy primer on it. Then you have some breathing room.
     
  19. 61art
    Joined: Jun 11, 2012
    Posts: 359

    61art
    Member

    I like to lay it on thick to cut down on the remixing and re applying. I recently switch from icing to dolphin glaze, it seams to dry faster and sand easy. In general with all fillers: I don't know how they make them so good and sell so cheap.
     
  20. 61art
    Joined: Jun 11, 2012
    Posts: 359

    61art
    Member

    try the dolphin glaze, its inexpensive and user friendly. after you apply primer, let it sit for 2 weeks before you sand.
     

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