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Big block Mopar newb valley pan question

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by lrs30, Aug 21, 2013.

  1. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    Ok so I'm big enough to admit it! I don't know shit about big block MOPARS!
    I'm updating my 2 barrel intake to Weiand aluminum 4 barrel. And under the original intake was the metal valley pan with the integrated intake gaskets, now my question is, I have a Fel-Pro metal valley pan gasket just like the original, and I also have Gasket material intake gaskets. I know it's needs a valley pan cover, not that dumb, well ok maybe. But my question is should I just use the new original style metal one , or does it need the individual gaskets also, because when I removed the old intake there was no evidence of the individual style... Man I hope I'm making this clear....haha Thanks.
     
  2. brandon
    Joined: Jul 19, 2002
    Posts: 6,324

    brandon
    Member

    I just used a felpro 1 piece deal on my last 440....but that was probably 15 years ago....;) could have been a mopar performance but thinking it was a felpro....
     
  3. el Scotto
    Joined: Mar 3, 2004
    Posts: 4,350

    el Scotto
    Member
    from Tracy, CA

    The valley pan gasket is the seal, it should have a raised crush bead around the ports. :D
     
  4. rosco gordy
    Joined: Jun 8, 2010
    Posts: 648

    rosco gordy
    Member

    I always use the tin one
     
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  5. stimpy
    Joined: Apr 16, 2006
    Posts: 3,547

    stimpy

    when I did my 413 it was the felpro piece only , unless you can find a company that made the 3 piece set so you can pull the manifold but leave the valley cover alone .
     
  6. I used thin gaskets on both sides of the valley pan. I believe it was the way six packs were set up, seals great. Fel pro sells the complete set up. Mancini Racing is a great source for parts and great advice.
     
  7. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    Thanks guys, this 383 is a whole new animal for me... Same basic principal, but whole different bag of tricks I'm learning....:rolleyes:
     
  8. They never included the fiber gaskets with the pans till a few years ago. Since then I have used the pans with and without the gaskets with no difference in sealing or performance. I did put a dab of silicon on the corners when I used the fiber gaskets.
     
  9. Hemishovel
    Joined: Mar 18, 2013
    Posts: 614

    Hemishovel
    Member

    I have had many big block mopars just sold 440 out of my coupe they only use steel cover a little sealer on the ends never had any problems
     
  10. el Scotto
    Joined: Mar 3, 2004
    Posts: 4,350

    el Scotto
    Member
    from Tracy, CA

    Think of the Mopar 383 as a Chevy 327 with an assload of torque. They have virtually the same stroke so they're a "revvy" engine with a huge ass bore, deep rooted "y-block" crank placement, larger lifter diameter and most of them had fully forged bottom ends.

    Mopar big blocks are my favorite engine family! :D
     
  11. db300
    Joined: Oct 16, 2012
    Posts: 98

    db300
    Member

    I just took apart my 413 that hasn't run since 81, and it's valley pan was just the tin, no gaskets.
     
  12. All 383's were forged, 400s were mostly cast, though a few did get a forged crank. The low deck big block mopars are a great engine and will really rev with just a little bit of work. For a buget stroker, you can have a 440 crank machined down to fit the 383/400 mains, with off the shelf pistons from a number of major companys.

    A 383 will net you a 432 and a 400 will net you a 451.
     
  13. Watch out for mice crawling in on that valley pan and building a nest, the little bastards will piss all over it and rust it from the topside, then the next generation comes along and crawls through the rust hole and builds there nest down in the guts of the engine. I have 2 440s out in the shed like this.
     
  14. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    Well I was lucky this go round, now mouse piss! It's a running engine, out of a 70 New Yorker. But the carb was junk, and a 2 barrel...;) so on goes the new intake and carb in hopes of making it a bit more reliable.
     
  15. GregCon
    Joined: Jun 18, 2012
    Posts: 689

    GregCon
    Member
    from Houston

    The paper gaskets are great for people who want to double the number of potential leakage planes in the engine. Or, if you really want to go high tech you can just make sure your intake mates to the heads properly and use the steel valley tray.
     
  16. I guess i'm just low teck, but I had problems sealing when using aluminum heads and intake. The thin gaskets solved that problem and I started using them on iron heads as well. I believe they were standard on 6 pack motors because of the aluminum intake. I don't have a milling machine so I use what I can.
     
  17. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    It's an aftermarket aluminum intake and original steel heads. I'm heading out to the garage now in hopes of figuring it all out..
     
  18. 41GASSER
    Joined: Aug 2, 2009
    Posts: 188

    41GASSER
    Member

    I have had many many 383 and 440 motors. I used the thin paper gaskets once with the tin pan when running a six pack and it leaked. I recommend the tin pan and maybe a thin film of gasgacinch, torque evenly and all will be fine.

    Dave
     
  19. sport fury
    Joined: Jul 25, 2009
    Posts: 593

    sport fury
    Member

    felpro used to have a can of aerosol adhesive to apply to the gasketed areas.
     
  20. scootrz1
    Joined: Apr 16, 2011
    Posts: 268

    scootrz1
    Member
    from usa

    just use the vally pan seal around the ports
     

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  21. studebaker eric
    Joined: May 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,514

    studebaker eric
    Member
    from Diablo Ca.

    I always used the tin gasked, with gascacinch around the ports, never had a problem.
     
  22. GregCon
    Joined: Jun 18, 2012
    Posts: 689

    GregCon
    Member
    from Houston

    If mill my intakes to fit, but if you don't have a mill you can still do it if you have a machine shop you trust to do a good job.

    I put the clean intake on the clean engine with no gasket or valley pan. Then, use feeler gauges to 'map' the 4 corners. Using that information, you can get the intake cut to make all 4 corners even.

    When you put the intake back on, you can tell the difference just in how it feels as it meets the heads. I usually spray some Copper Coat on the valley pan faces for good measure but I'll guarantee even with no sealer it will not leak. The only reason leaks happens is because there is a gap somewhere.
     
  23. Hemishovel
    Joined: Mar 18, 2013
    Posts: 614

    Hemishovel
    Member

    Mine had tunnel ram all I used was the tin cover I used to paint it engine color used sealer on the ends fighter evenly never any leaks
     
  24. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    Cool thanks guys, I'm not going to go the Mill route this time... Just don't have the budget for that, but I do have the gaskasinch budget. So do I gaskasinch bout the intake and the head openings? Sorry for the dumb question, but this is my first go round with a animal of this color....
     
  25. Hemishovel
    Joined: Mar 18, 2013
    Posts: 614

    Hemishovel
    Member

    Gregcon what kind of intake were you using all the sons I've seen had gap below them even the factory ones tin cover covered the valley factory used some kind of insulation between the two for heat so intake would run cooler
     
  26. Big_John
    Joined: Mar 28, 2006
    Posts: 327

    Big_John
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    The six-pack aluminum intakes used the thin fiber gaskets from the factory. Rule of thumb is don't bother with them for cast iron and use them with aluminum.

    Think of it this way, the aluminum will expand/contract at a different rate than the cast iron. The fiber lets it move more and stay sealed.
     
  27. studebaker eric
    Joined: May 9, 2008
    Posts: 1,514

    studebaker eric
    Member
    from Diablo Ca.

    put it on the ports on the heads, and on top of the gasket surface, and set the manifold on top. Easier to keep it all in one area .
     
  28. lrs30
    Joined: Jan 30, 2007
    Posts: 2,202

    lrs30
    Member
    from Kentucky

    Thanks guys, I got everything lined up for tomorrow I hope to be driving it by Saturday... Fingers crossed!
     
  29. 57JoeFoMoPar
    Joined: Sep 14, 2004
    Posts: 4,586

    57JoeFoMoPar
    Member

    I just clean the surfaces up real well, apply a decent bead of silicone to both side and bolt that bitch on. Never had an issue.
     
  30. Slimmey
    Joined: May 7, 2013
    Posts: 87

    Slimmey
    Member

    You guys are killing me here, I love my big block mopars. Years ago I was going to put a 440 in my '57 chevy, dad said not in my shop. I am getting ready to do a 34 chevy, got the old 301 sbc cleaned up and ready, now after seeing Scootrz1(nice car, well done, damn you).... I do have two 440's left???? Ah hell, I ain't going to get any sleep tonight.

    Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
     

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