Register now to get rid of these ads!

Hot Rods best oil for early OHV V8s

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by vetteson, Apr 7, 2020.

  1. vetteson
    Joined: Oct 7, 2010
    Posts: 183

    vetteson
    Member

    I have built at least two early US OHVs, '53 Dodge 241, and '55 Cadillac 331, with rockers mounted on shafts. What I have seen is that these engines do not get a lot of oil to the rocker arms. Is there a consensus (here we go) as to what is the best grade/weight of oil available now for these engines.
     
    2OLD2FAST likes this.
  2. Get ready,,,,the flood gates are about to open,,,,LoL.

    Tommy
     
    31hotrodguy, Truck64, reagen and 3 others like this.
  3. 6sally6
    Joined: Feb 16, 2014
    Posts: 1,107

    6sally6
    Member

    I would guess any detergent oil 10W30.....maybe 20 weight.(Walmart brand is good oil!) Any way to open up the oil feed holes to get more oil up to the shafts?! Maybe a high pressure oil pump would help.
    6sally6
     
  4. vetteson
    Joined: Oct 7, 2010
    Posts: 183

    vetteson
    Member

    Yes, a man has got to know his limitations, oh my!:rolleyes:
     
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. 6Sally brought up a good point ,,,I assumed you were just asking about oils .
    The oil passages in these engines are not perfectly aligned usually .

    I go through all the oil passage locations on engines I do .
    I start at the oil pump mount,,and go from there ,,,,,,a lot of connections are off location a quarter of the diameter,,,they still work,,,just not to top flow .

    Tommy
     
    anthony myrick likes this.
  6. derbydad276
    Joined: May 29, 2011
    Posts: 1,310

    derbydad276
    Member

  7. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 5,735

    anthony myrick
    Member

    I use t4 rotella.
    15/40
    Along with Walmart’s diesel oils.
    No issues.
    But make sure the oil passages are lined up. Especially on the top end.
    Asking oil preference will get ya a million responses.
     
    Baumi, Dave Mc and Truckdoctor Andy like this.
  8. AldeanFan
    Joined: Dec 12, 2014
    Posts: 552

    AldeanFan

    Rotella 15-40 for my y block


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
    Baumi likes this.
  9. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 4,671

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    A mid 50's OHV V-8 engine with the stock valve train doesn't require anything special, including high zinc levels. The oil available at that time did not contain high levels of zinc. If you're running an aftermarket camshaft with high lift and aggressive ramps, then maybe you should be concerned about it. If not, don't worry, any 10W-30 will be fine. For those in hotter climates you might want to go with 10W-40 or 15W-40 diesel engine oil.
     
    Truck64 and Truckdoctor Andy like this.
  10. tubman
    Joined: May 16, 2007
    Posts: 4,982

    tubman
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Not this again! The correct answer is "anything on sale at the discount store (10-30 or 10-40) that has an 'API' seal on it". It is all so far superior to what was available back then that there is no room for controversy. You guys need something else to occupy your time. "Diesel Oil"? OK, go ahead and waste your money on something with a mismatched additive package.
     
    X38 and Desoto291Hemi like this.
  11. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 4,671

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    Mismatched additive package? Do tell...
     
    Truckdoctor Andy likes this.
  12. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,459

    RmK57
    Member

    Whatever name brand 10w-30 is on sale. 70 lbs. of valvespring pressure won't be taxing cam and lifters in any way.
     
  13. The problem is the API classifications. The new classification is SN. SA thru SH is obsolete. New metallurgy and emissions has required the oil manufactures to remove additives that were beneficial for anti wear to be reduced and in some cases removed entirely in order to keep catalytic converters from being damaged or destroyed.
     
  14. Nicholas Coe
    Joined: Jul 5, 2017
    Posts: 1,450

    Nicholas Coe
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Tontitown

  15. I am not familiar with said engines. I suspect they were designed that way. The straight Buick was. To the point of having an orifice with a , I believe, .060 opening to RESTRICT oil flow.

    I use Rotella 15-40 in mine.

    Ben
     
  16. scrap metal 48
    Joined: Sep 6, 2009
    Posts: 5,928

    scrap metal 48
    Member

    PennGrade 10W30...
     
  17. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 4,671

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    This is partially true. The level of zinc/phosphorus in passenger car engine oils was reduced, or limited to 800ppm in modern oils, but how much zinc/phosphorus did the engine oils have in the early 1930's when these engines were developed? The answer is: It was much less than 800 ppm, more like ~500 ppm. Plus, the ZDDP additive has been under development for almost 70 years, suffice it to say todays ZDDP is far, far better than the additive that was available in the early 50's. 800 ppm of zinc in today's oil is more than sufficient for one of these engines.
     
    Truckdoctor Andy likes this.
  18. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 4,671

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    See my reply to dry lakes wheel man, and my first post above. And yes, you can have too much zinc in the oil. Not only that, but blending up your own batch of oil by mixing in additives is generally not a good idea.
     
  19. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 4,018

    Boneyard51
    Member

    I went to those sites and could not find where Valvoline stated that there was any detergent in this racing oil! Back in the day, they removed the detergent in racing oils, figuring the engine would blow up before it sludge up!
    I had a bad experience with Racing oil back in the previous century, I put strait 40 weight racing oil in my 289 HiPo, to raise the low oil pressure. It worked but about six months later it started drinking oil! I tore it down , at close to 100,000 miles, and the oil ring was complete ly clogged with a grey looking gooey substance, similar in appearance to wet ashes from a fire. I quizzed some oil guys, and the said “ kid, was your engine a racing engine, or a car engine?”. They told me then to never use a racing oil in a car engine, as it has no detergent. I don’t see any detergent in this oil. I thought non detergent oils we almost a thing of the past. Any thoughts?






    Bones
     
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  20. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 6,528

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  21. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 6,350

    jimmy six
    Member

    I’ve got a Y and since not much is needed and they don’t “splash” like SBC’s. When warm I took off the rocker covers and looked. Both the left rear and right front over flow tube had oil coming out so I knew mine was OK.
    At one time I owned a 65 Sprite; it did not have a “fed” oil to the rocker arm system only using the internal vapor of the engine. Never had a problem. Sure it had low spring pressure and tiny valves but it worked.
    I did run 5-20 for one oil change in my Y but normally I run 15-30 and a Wix filter.
     
    Desoto291Hemi and stillrunners like this.
  22. Arominus
    Joined: Feb 2, 2011
    Posts: 391

    Arominus
    Member

    I’m a big fan of Mobil 1 0-40, it’s got 1100ppm of zinc and you can get a 5 qt jug of it at Walmart for $24 usually. It has excellent flow at low temps and does well in the heat too. If you need more than that, the 15-50 is 1300 ppm and is the same price. I’ll be running 0-40 in my 392.

    also, make sure the inside of the shafts and the rocker arm oil feeds are clean on the Hemi, mine were really bad and it wiped out a few tips. This is a big thing that needs to be checked/done on Hemi’s that have been rescued and fired back up.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  23. Molybdenum Disulfide, along with Phosphorus and Zinc are the three components that make up an anti wear friction modifier. Phosphorus and Zinc are the components that attack catalytic convertors and have been reduced in oils API SE and later. Any thing over 1250 ppm is not going to have any additional value to the oils capacity to reduce friction and wear.
     
    Arominus likes this.
  24. Truck64
    Joined: Oct 18, 2015
    Posts: 4,056

    Truck64
    Member
    from Ioway

    I dived down this rat hole a little while back. The standard dead dinosaur VR1 racing oil has just about everything going for it to keep the OCD types from insomnia, and it doesn't cost $19 a quart.

    Till you get to the fine print. It says "3 months/3000 miles". I was curious about this, because 3 months is a little excessive if it isn't driven much? I called them up to specifically ask about that, and they didn't provide any additional information other than "3 months/3000 miles". No help there.

    A little more internet sleuthing and come to find "Break-in" oils are similar to "Racing" oils in that there's little to no detergents or dispersents in the additive package.

    The way I read it, this is because the standard engine oil additive package with detergent/dispersents can't distinguish between the protective zinc and sludge or gum varnish. Don't know how true that is, but it sounds right. I decided not to worry about it. Use good oil (and filters!) and change it once in a while, before it gets completely loaded up, and spend the difference on beer.
     
  25. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 4,018

    Boneyard51
    Member

    48C59235-0590-42D1-8FD9-ADEB6071A3A3.jpeg





    Truck64! I like the way you think! I just bought ninety cans of beer today, to add to my seventy or so cans in my shop fridge! Now I’m ready to “ shelter in place” !












    Bones
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2020
    scrap metal 48 and Truck64 like this.
  26. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,238

    George
    Member

    As has been stated in the many ZDDP Threads already on the Board, real racing oil's additive package, if there is one, is dead by 1,500 miles where race engines blow up or get torn down frequently. No detergent oil usually says that on the label. Wal-Mart used to carry SA oil that said not for use in engines made after 1930.....
     
  27. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,152

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    Zinc additives were first put in oil around 1951 to protect the valve lifters and camshafts of the new OHV V8 engines then coming out. I know Studebaker and Chrysler had some issues at first because the weight of the valve train and spring pressure were higher than their old flatheads. In recent years the zinc was taken out to prevent poisoning of catalytic converters. Today there are hardly any pushrod engines left, everyone makes overhead cam engines with flathead like light valve trains.

    So do you need special oil for old OHV V8s? Or do modern oils get resistance to high pressure loadings in a different way? I don't know but if I had a high perf pushrod engine with stiff valve springs and a hot cam I would be picky about the oil I used.
     
  28. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 2,344

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    I have never understood why the cam/lifter manufacturers/suppliers do not specify What oils are acceptable for use with their cams, it would certainly stop much of this blind speculation !!!
     
  29. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 7,238

    George
    Member

    The problem is the oil has changed over the years. 10W-40 made in 1975 is different than now. And whiners have ended stocking of SH-SF that you could find until recently.
     
  30. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 2,344

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    I'm sure the manufacturer s know we,and sites like ours , are here , would an every 90 day update be too much to ask , hell every 6 months would work OK. In fact. For that matter , how about the oil manufacturers , The lack of accurate info is deafening !!
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.