Preface : 1930 Model A Pickup. I would rather have side steer. I have a Toyota box that would do side steer, a Vega box for cross steering and getting a Mustang box for side steer would be very, very easy I have a 289 engine, stock front crossmember, flipped the firewall twice (it is still just tacked). As I position the engine . I'm trying to figure steering box and exhaust. Pics show some hugger headers I had hoped to use, and also some 289 Hipo manifolds. The original location for the side steering box is exactly where my frame mounts for the engine want to be located. So even a F1 box would not mount there. Have I just pushed the engine back too far? Once I remove the huggers, the Hipo manifolds give me much more room for steering linkage. If you can see well enough in the pics, what are your thoughts?
My experience, the Vega is great with a pan hard rod but it is so far forward that it affects the column being straight to clear the engine so the steering shaft clears the headers. The mustang is great too but it hangs down so low but it clears the engine well. It keeps the column from being real straight too so you can clear the engine and it doesn't need a pan hard rod. Don't be afraid to make some headers to fix things the way you want them to fit. I find most things out of the box, need to be altered some. Good luck
shorten the steering shaft and mount the box inside something like this and you can get side steer like you want - just a thought - jaxx
Are you using split bones? If so you want to keep the box near to the same pivot. That’s not going to be easy with the Mustang. Not a problem with (gasp) 4 bars. I put one in my ‘33 50 years ago and with a solid shaft it put the column between my feet. I’m putting a Vega in it with it’s resurrection. Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
Yes, split wishbones. For the 60s look, I like the side steer. But it seems even with the Vega box, I'll need some articulation to the steering shaft. So I'm open for anything at this point.
I think I would start with what can’t move, commit the engine, trans and exhaust. Then engineer from there. Maybe even get the front axle and bones mocked up. Get some dowel rod and a universal joint too, might take some guess work out. Good luck.
That I am afraid of doing. Once the engine is planted, it's planted ( sure anything can move, but I don't want to move it ). So I just want to make sure I haven't chosen a bad locating for the engine mounts. Anyone else have theirs right where the original box mounted? Seems weird . .but?
Single U-joints operate up to 35 degrees, doubles U-joints operate up to 70 degrees, all you require is a support bearing. They can solve clearance and steering issues.
Have you trial fitted the Toy box? The early solid axle FWD boxes are compact and might fit. I have a power version that is in my plans for the 54 dodge PU.
Well, I have held it at different locations . like I'm doing in the pic with the Vega box. I "think" it would be best mounted up top, as was mentioned with the Corvair . .but the Toyota needs nothing done to it. It's a manual box, 72- FJ or such. When I place it up on the frame, it's a sharp angle to get the steering wheel right . . it seems. No experience . so maybe it's not that bad. I've seen 2 joints in columns . .would rather just have one.
That's a good picture of what I'm trying to figure . . for sure. They have filled the holes in teh frame, so can't tell exactly where they planted it . .but I think it's close to where I am. But damn . .how many joints in the shaft?? yikes
With a boxed frame, do you set the Vega box "into" the frame, or mount it on the engine side of the boxed frame ?
Reversed Corvair box is pretty narrow. Might sit essentially on top of your frame without pushing the pittman arm too far out.
First off, you need to build "mock-up mounts" for the engine and transmission; the mount for the engine can be a simple piece of heavywall tubing bolted to the front of the engine and is long enough to lay across the frame rails, the one for the transmission bolts to the transmission and is clamped to the bottom of the frame rails. These allow the engine/transmission to be slid back and forth as needed, properly centered, then clamped into place so you can build the actual engine/transmission mounts. (Oh, by the way, there's no way of telling if the engine is in the right place until you mount the special shortened water pump, upper and lower pulleys, fan, and radiator.) If you really want side-steer, my advice is to use the F-1 box and move the engine mounts forward as needed. To do this you may have to make new engine mount plates (that's the plate that is bolted directly to the block) so the biscuit mount can be moved out of the way of the steering box. You never mentioned what front axle you will be using, or front spring setup, ect, but my advice is don't split the bones unless you have to, and if you have to, try to use the kit that keeps the bones under the car near the transmission.
I have the engine mocked so it can slide as it is right now. The height is where the mounts would be sitting once welded. The crossmember I mentioned is stock. The axle is stock. I don't want a dropped axle. The axle is built, painted and ready So with the stock crossmember and axle, I need the engine back. That is why I took the time to double flip the firewall. There's no way a steering box is going in the stock location . I just can't see it.
Perhaps a redesigned engine mount.Move the mount forward 6 inches,and run it straight back to the rubber biscuit.It would look like a L .That would open up the stock location.Then its a matter of will the exhaust clear a shaft? Im not a SBF guy so this is just off the top of my head.....Take a passenger side manifold,and install it on the drivers side.Now the exhaust dumps forward.Make a header pipe that doubles back,and down.
Well the Hipo manifold I posted a picture of definitely opens up clearance. Issue I see with your engine mount is it is levering all the force off the end . . like a diving board . . unless you came from the other direction with a brace . . no?
Your motor is way to far back. Run the Toyota box side steering in the original location. Weld a flange on it like an F1 box. It works mint. You will have to move the motor up and right a very small amount. I have a Desoto hemi in a 34 frame and the engine is centered but sits up pretty high.
The critical dimension is fan or water pump clearance to the radiator. Install those two things, and deal with the rest. You currently have too many dimensional unknowns to proceed. As to the left engine mount, I had a situation like yours once. I fabricated a new mount that located the biscuit to the rear several inches. That cleared up space for a low hanging alternator that I wanted to hide.
Correct, but some of those things have been figured, into where it is now sitting. I know you can't tell from my pic . .but I have allowed space for the fan to where the radiator mounts. I do not have a radiator, yet. I know that would be best. But I have done a lot of measurements and I'm pretty sure I am in the ballpark as it sits. I don't mind buying a radiator now. Which radiator would you recommend?
Pete: You have been given some really good suggestions and direction to use so far. Note #1: Personally, I would not use those biscuit type engine mounts, as we have seen them "crush" in a short time frame which changes engine location and everything else. I always use factory side mount engine mounts and fabricate to the design needs. #2: Where are your radius rods going to attached to the frame at? #3: Have you mocked up everything on the engine, ie: fan,alternator,radiator,hoses, belts, water pump, oil filter, etc. for proper clearances? I have used Reversed Corvair and Reversed early mustang steering boxes on my fenderless Model A's.... the choice is all based on where everything else ends up at. The pitman arm needs to be at the intersection point of the radius arm attachment point. In most cases there is not allot of front suspension travel in a straight axle Hot Rod, so not being perfect "can be ok", but you must be sure. This is how I did the steering on my Coupe. My chassis design is allot different that what your doing, but the principals apply: I used a reversed Corvair steering box and a pitman arm I got from speedway motors. I designed and fabricated a mount to position it in the correct area and location to meet all my needs. This design also allows for more foot room inside around the pedals as I go through the firewall much higher than with a mustang under chassis mount. Here are some pictures I took this morning for you: Here is a picture of the custom mount I designed for my application:
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