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Hot Rods axle studs backing out.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by RmK57, Jun 7, 2020.

  1. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    31 spline Dutchman axles with 1/2" thread on the studs. The first time it happened I thought it was a fluke so cranked them up tighter. The second time a couple backed out I used Thread locker and still had a couple back out. It made a bit of a mess on my brake hardware with a backed out stud swinging around in their.

    Would it be ok to hit each one on the backside with a spot weld? Or anyone else have any other solutions.
     
  2. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 13,663

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Use Loctite Kleen N Prime first then their #263 hi strength threadlocker.
    Can probably use lacquer thinner but you need to make sure there is no oil, antiseize, etc. on the threads.
     
  3. hemihotrod66
    Joined: May 5, 2019
    Posts: 197

    hemihotrod66
    Member

    I think you may have the type of stud that is a bolt that screws into the axle flange from the backside...I would get a regular stud with a thread no longer than the axle flange is thick and if it unscrewed it would be from the front of the wheel with the lugnut....Put some red thread locker on the the flange threads and maybe this can be a fix...
     
  4. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,405

    squirrel
    Member

    I check that they're tight, every now and then. Not much work to pull the drum.

    I guess I could add locktite, but that would be cheating.
     
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  5. flamedabone
    Joined: Aug 3, 2001
    Posts: 4,770

    flamedabone
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I use regular old lock washers on mine, no issue in 18 years. But, if you are still having trouble with them, a small spot weld on the backside will do the trick.

    -Abone.
     
  6. 1946caddy
    Joined: Dec 18, 2013
    Posts: 1,676

    1946caddy
    Member
    from washington

    Re tighten your lug nuts about once a month and you can vary the time depending how long it takes for them to loosen up. I've had mag wheel lug nuts loosen up after a month of first being installed but never a regular lug nut.
     
  7. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    Yes, their just a regular grade 8 bolts with star washers that thread into to back of the flange.
    So your saying studs that thread into the front. That actually might work.
     
  8. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,405

    squirrel
    Member

    If the threads on the stud or lug nut are not super clean and smooth, then when you're putting the nut on, it can catch on the stud and screw it in. Just gotta make sure everything is smooth, and take your time installing the wheels. And go back and tighten the studs every now and then, too.

    I've had a couple get loose, I just tighten them again, they're good for a while. On Drag Week two tire changes a day, this stuff gets to be old hat.
     
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  9. hemihotrod66
    Joined: May 5, 2019
    Posts: 197

    hemihotrod66
    Member

    Back in the 40's and 50's some GM cars had lug bolts instead of studs....I had a 1950 Buick that had lugbolts not studs....
     
  10. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 27,180

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My 98 BMW and 02 VW passat still have lug bolts rather than studs. Pain in the butt to deal with. I finally made a couple of installation studs out of a pair of bolts that I screw in, slip the wheel on and then put the other lug bolts in before unscrewing those.
    Still I wonder how those bolts are backing off if the lug nuts are tight.
    If as Jim suggested the stud has a burr on it or the nut has a messed up thread it could turn that bolt after a while or if the guy installing the wheel on the car is not threading them on the studs several turns by hand and jambing them on with the air wrench. I had to replace a few studs that a tire buster ruined when he thought he could stick the nut in the socket and jamb them on the stud rather than threading them on the studs by hand one time. He may have been watching too much Nascar on TV though.
     
  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,405

    squirrel
    Member

    This is racing stuff.

    Sent from my Trimline
     
  12. Mike VV
    Joined: Sep 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,980

    Mike VV
    Member
    from SoCal

    I've got Dutchman stuff on my Winters Quick Change axle.
    Similar fastener, installed in from the back side of the axle flange. Many miles on the street with no problems (aluminum wheels). I didn't use any sort of lock washer (split lock washers are almost usless), just blue LocTite. Clean the fasteners and the flange well, screw in the fasteners, and torque them in place.

    Mike
     
  13. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    That's what I did the last time . Blue Loctite and 80 lbs. torque and one still came loose. Last year I ran Centerline auto drags which use a shank style nut that makes it worse because you cant see from the outside if the bolt has backed out unless you take the wheel off. I have my steel wheels on now and from a glance you can notice if one is shorter than the rest.
    I'm going to clean the threads up and bolts and use the red Loctite.
     
  14. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,405

    squirrel
    Member

    I have long studs, and open nuts (shank type for the old aluminum wheels). Easy to see what's going on.

    Hopefully the red will fix the problem. Degrease well before use.
     
  15. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 6,523

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    Make sure there is sufficient shamfer of the threads that will clear the corner radius of the head of the bolts where the threads end. I used SAE .060 thick washers with a shamfer facing the bolt to clear the radius. Loc tite should be enough but have to figure out whats causing the bolts to loosen. Could also get a bolt head drilling tool and drill the heads for safety wire. https://esco.net/products/esco-wheel-nut-shamfer-gauge/ Lol.
     
  16. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    The bolts have "Strange" embossed on them with star washers. Fairly thin head compared to a regular bolt and they are grade 8. I thought about safety wire also but that sounds like a ton of work. I'll try the red loctite and keep an eye on it. Tires I'll be using are 275 m/t radial pro's.
     
  17. Mike VV
    Joined: Sep 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,980

    Mike VV
    Member
    from SoCal

    I also have open ended lug nuts.
    Actually mine are custom made for me by a machine shop nearby. The studs are out past the end of the nuts by about four threads, so I know very close how much stud I should see at all times.
    It's an quick, simple check.

    My wheels are a "no name", Halibrand (aluminum) copy. Dimensionally, they are very close to actual Halibrand wheels. The center is solid (one piece of material), unlinke Centerline wheels that are two pieces of aluminum.

    RmK - What torque do you use for securing the wheels?

    Mike
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
  18. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    I use a cross type wheel wrench. 60-70 lbs. guessing.

    Cleaned everything today and used the red Loctite and torqued the studs to 90 lbs. It should hold now, I hope.
     
  19. jaracer
    Joined: Oct 4, 2008
    Posts: 377

    jaracer
    Member

    This thread makes me want to go and see what my Dutchman axles have. I assumed they were press in studs.
     
  20. Years ago I had Strange Engineering, nearby, redrill the wheel lug pattern on some axles I had. I took them press in studs for my application. They did indeed spot-weld each lug head after pressing them in.

    Phil
     
  21. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 1,516

    RmK57
    Member

    Mine are thread in. But as a last resort I'll spot weld them. For now loctite and keep an eye on them.
     

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