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Technical Ax15 behind a 318 poly solved

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Burkedore, Sep 5, 2016.

  1. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    I am contemplating putting an ax15 out of a 94 Dakota behind the poly in my Dodge d100 and I have hit a bit of a bump in the road. The input shaft is not long enough to make it in the pilot bushing. Is there an off the shelf solution for a pilot bushing? Thanks for the help.

    IMG_20160612_062717728_HDR.jpg
     
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  2. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,983

    gimpyshotrods
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    I personally don't remember seeing an extended pilot bushing for an LA engine in the catalogs, but it might exist.

    Any machinist with a stick of Oilite Bronze can make one, in a jiffy.
     
  3. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,983

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    My question is, what are you planning on using for a clutch setup?

    There is a native setup using the 318(5.2l) and the AX15, in the later model trucks, but it has a hydraulic clutch. If you could get the master cylinder onto your pedal, you could use that.
     
  4. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    The flywheel, clutch, and pressure plate from the 94 are used as well as the starter. The real mess begins when you start looking for an external slave that has some kind of fitting and bleeder that could be used with the stock master cylinder. I circumvented this problem by making my own slave cylinder from aluminum that uses the cup and seal from the '66 slave cylinder.
     
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  5. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 42,682

    squirrel
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    those trucks came with a hydraulic clutch. The bellhousing mounts to the frame crossmember, and it's a rather large bellhousing. If I were trying to do this, I think I'd use the bellhousing that matches the transmission, put a crossmember under the back of the transmission, use the later model 318 flywheel and starter, and connect the hydraulic clutch (not sure how that will work, do they use funky modern fittings on the new one? ) and be done with it. But that's just a guess....I've only worked on the old trucks, not the new ones.
     
  6. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
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  7. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
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    That is essentially the plan, the problem is the input shaft is flush with the end of the bellhousing on the ax15 and the pilot bushing is not reachable when bolted to the engine.
     
  8. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
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    It looks like I will turn something up on the lathe tomorrow (I am a machinist) I was just hoping I could find an off the shelf solution (time is at a premium right now). Thanks for the help guys.
     
  9. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,983

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    By how much?
     
  10. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 42,682

    squirrel
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    sounds like you can fix it....

    what does the later model pilot bushing look like? like this? does it fix your problem?

    NATIONAL FC69907

    bearing.jpg
     
  11. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,983

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    You sir, have the key, and my envy. I am only really good at running the cutter or end mill into the jaws/clamps.
     
  12. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    About 3/4"
     
  13. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
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    I am going to pick one up on my way to work tomorrow to measure, I wonder how similar the crank flanges are between the poly and 3.9v6?
     
  14. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 42,682

    squirrel
    Member

    should be the same, they sort of standardized it by the early 60s. But you never know with old Mopars, they sure screwed with things way more than necessary. Might be that the crank has the small pilot. I seem to recall they changed the size of the pilot hole that the automatics used, some time in the early 60s, and that messes up engine/transmission swaps.

    If you want better help when you're asking questions like this, it really helps for you to add some photos, because some of us just can't remember what stuff looks like, that we worked on 30+ years ago.
     
  15. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    I don't know seems like you are doing fine so far.
     
  16. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 42,682

    squirrel
    Member

    I know there was something different with some of the crank flanges, but I don't remember what. I think the early torque converters used a pilot that was deeper and smaller ID than the later ones. I know we tried to stick an early engine in a later car, and decided to get a later engine, because there was no way to make it work...this was on an engine swap I worked on in the mid 80s.

    Anyways, hopefully that bearing will fit your crank, and solve the problem. If not, you can make a new sleeve from aluminum (?) that will fit your crank flange.
     
  17. Bert Kollar
    Joined: Jan 10, 2007
    Posts: 898

    Bert Kollar
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    I'm not a machinist but I made two of them for friends and they work fine
     
  18. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 42,682

    squirrel
    Member

    When I'm standing in front of my old lathe, I'm a machinist :)
     
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  19. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 15,983

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    When I'm standing in front of my old lathe, I'm trespassing.
     
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  20. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    Well I picked up a pilot bearing for a 94 Dakota (donar vehicle) the o.d. measures 1.815". The I.d. of the crank flange is 1.775", close but that would be one hell of a press fit.

    While I was there I picked up a slave cylinder to compare to the one I made. I liked it better so I threaded the end for 1/4 pipe and used an adapter to inverted flare.

    IMG_20160906_162000485_HDR.jpg
     
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  21. jack_pine
    Joined: Jan 20, 2007
    Posts: 343

    jack_pine
    Member
    from Motor City

    You need to get with Gary Stauffer (73rr here), or at least his website http://qualityengineeredcomponents.com. he has the early hemi/poly to AX15 fully mapped out. Also, Paul Unterstein @American Powertrain has the right clutch, plate. My AX15 behind 392 hemi took one of Gary adapter kits and a 3.7L flywheel redrilled for early crank flange
     
  22. 73RR
    Joined: Jan 29, 2007
    Posts: 6,203

    73RR
    Member

    Jon, thanks for the nod!
    I'll assume that the OP has his package sorta out by now....but I'm real curious about his pile-o-parts.
    All of the post-62 A engine, LA engine, and the new 3.7, 4.7, 5.2 and 5.9 all have the same bits and pieces for that he is working with. Something very odd that his input shaft would be short.
    Perhaps he'll let us know how it all worked out.

    .
     
  23. Burkedore
    Joined: Nov 9, 2013
    Posts: 145

    Burkedore
    Member

    What blanks can I fill in?
     
  24. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 8,958

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    Chrysler makes a pilot bearing for special cases like yours. It is a ball bearing in a cage that bolts onto the flywheel bolts. Dodge dealers should be able to get one. I think it was made for adapting manual trans to an engine made for auto trans that did not have the crankshaft machined for the bearing.
     

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