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Projects Austin Somerset Gasser Build (DragNasty)

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Dueced Up!, Jan 22, 2014.

  1. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 2,341

    Deuced Up!
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    It is kind of sneaking looking since it is the exact same housing and scoop as the mechanical...Probably be a bit more conspicuous when we finally plug the crazy harness in.

    Resized_20170331_125444.jpeg
    They actually have a base plate that conceals the injectors for most gas applications but mine were too big and too many so we get the Frankenstein treatment! :D
     
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  2. swade41
    Joined: Apr 6, 2004
    Posts: 7,527

    swade41
    Member
    from buffalo,ny

    I didn't realize it was efi, thought it was mechanical and was questing the street ability of it.
     
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  3. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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  4. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 6,837

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    That looks like the crap I have to work on every day.
     
  5. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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    Okay traditional HAMB folks, we are about to go off the rails here from a traditional standpoint. I thought about skipping out on this part of the "re-build" but I have had a good number of members that have expressed interest in the HILBORN EFI system so I am going to go ahead and show the install etc. Hopefully this thread has been around long enough that this new fangled stuff won't get it shut down.

    Honestly, it was my only choice for a traditional injected fuel system. Being such a small car, we had zero room up front for a traditional pump. Plus we hit the streets every once in a while and for both purposes, the EFI system seemed a perfect answer. As you have seen the four port injection unit is exactly the same unit Hilborn has been making since the beginning as is the scoop. The big difference for me is the fact I am running e85. For that reason we had to have eight 120 lbs. injectors and because of their size and number they have to be exposed. As I mentioned before for most other "gas" applications the injectors, up to six of them, can be hidden inside the plate between the injector and the supercharger.

    Resized_20170401_131834.jpeg
    I don't think that is going to be too bad, we are plugging the injectors in from the bottom and the kit came with several extra feet of the small braided split conduit. I think when we are are wired up for real, cover up the currently exposed injector wires and tuck them up under the fuel rail it will look pretty good. My hope is to follow the fuel lines off the rear to help hide the harness even more.

    Resized_20170402_125759.jpeg
    So after measuring how far the injector harness was going to reach etc. we confirmed where the main harness would exit the firewall. We removed the injection pieces and the supercharger to get to work. I think this is going to work really well as the original over sized firewall indention for the distributor will now not only be the exit but also hose the MAP Sensor just above the exit hole. This is certainly not a "traditional" install for this unit as along with the MSD Box, it is going inside the car so as to give us a more traditional look by not having it all mounted to the firewall etc.

    BUT FIRST - DON'T JUDGE ME - I HAVE TO DEAL WITH THIS! :eek:

    Resized_20170401_094650.jpeg

    That is what happens when at the very last minute you have to completely change the wiring for a dual fan set up, ad an oxygen sensor and reroute the wires to the rear to a new fuel pump relay because you stole the original up front for an extra fan (all the day before you are supposed to be on the dyno etc.) :p So the rest of the afternoon is spent right here untangling this mess and ensuring all the wire splices are soldered, heat shrinked, and tucked neatly away under the dash!:rolleyes:
     
  6. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 6,837

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

  7. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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    I know, I know....but it is all killer clean and tidy now (photos later). Here this should get your mind off of it.:cool:

    Resized_20170403_102452.jpeg
    FedEX man was extremely nice to me this morning......AND there goes the day! I might as well just go home and set this shinny pig up top...that is all I will be thinking about anyway! LOLo_O
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2017
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  8. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 6,837

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

  9. wiring is lots of fun isnt it? it is the most important part of what you are doing. grounds are critical. put a ground from head to head to the frame. run the ground out of your ignition box directly to the engine. alot of mysterious noise issues can be eliminated doing this. i mounted my map sensor on the inside of the fire wall leaving just the hose exiting it. its protected from the elements and fires that way. with the new bigger blower make sure you hose clamp your map sensor hose on both ends. I have blown the hose off the barded fitting under boost conditions without the clamps. I routed the injector wires under the rail secured in place with two black zip ties to the bars that hold the rail in place. it sure helped clean things up. for those out there looking to do a similar set up. hilborn makes a newer casting that allows the modern injectors to go directly into it. the new one looks the same it just has bigger injector holes machined into it. this way the polished spacer is not needed. they also offer two bore sizes depending on horse power needs. don't forget to put oil in the new blower. have fun.
     
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  10. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 6,837

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    Try and mount the Map so that fuel can't run down the hose and get in the sensor.
     
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  11. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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    So we popped the new blower on tonight to make sure we still had clearance with the radiator etc.
    Like a Glove!

    Resized_20170403_190314.jpeg
    Looks pretty good up there.

    Resized_20170403_190434.jpeg

    Resized_20170403_190444.jpeg
    As you can see we dropped the distributor in place and changed our firing order for 7/4 swap. We had to play around with the current plug wires but finally got the right lengths in the right holes etc.

    Resized_20170403_190452.jpeg
    Here is that same area that used to hold the rat's nest of cobbled up wiring. Just a few stragglers that I am not finished with. As you can see, this is where we mounted the Holley ECU.

    Resized_20170403_191646 (1).jpeg
    The only issue we have is the 3/8" spacer that I had machined to extend the top pulley out to match the bottom pulley after the crank trigger wheel is on behind it needs some help. The issue is the boss on the new 8-71 with 8mm pulleys is smaller than the 6-71 .5" drive. So I am going to have to have the machine shop create me a ring to put on the boss to install the spacer on...etc. etc. etc.
     
  12. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Posts: 2,341

    Deuced Up!
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    AND...while shopping for fuel line today I discovered the fuel pump has the wrong fittings in it which also means we got the wrong inline fuel filters. We are supposed to go from the fuel cell with a 12AN, through a 74 Micron filter and then to the pump. Then out of the pump 10AN, through a 24 Micron filter to the fuel regulator, then 8AN to the fuel rails and 8AN return line back to the cell. So sending the filters and fittings back tomorrow and Alkydigger is trading them out.
     
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  13. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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    Remember this little spacer? When we installed the MSD Flying Magnet Crank Trigger Wheel, it moved everything forward 3/8". I looked all over the country for one a 3/8" spacer with 2.25" boss (nada!). So I ended up getting a .5" spacer with 2" boss, took it to a local machine shop and had them make me one.

    Resized_20170404_101745.jpeg
    Well believe it or not the 6-71 took the 2.25" but 8-71 needs a 2" hole. That's right! So I walked back in there this morning and said you remember me? ...I was in here about two years ago and you took some material out of this spacer and made the hole bigger. He smiled and said yes. I said well I need you to put it back. LOL:eek::D

    So he is making me a bushing for it this week.:cool:
     
  14. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Speaking of Blower Pulley's, the new 8-71 came with 8mm pulleys (a 61 for up top and a 54 for the bottom). This would make it around 11.5 percent under driven. So using the same chart, if we flip the pulleys to overdrive it, we should be almost 13 percent over driven. Looking at standard boost charts for 8-71 supercharges it appears with our cubic inch we will be around 15 to 16 pounds of boost at WOT. That is a bit more than we really want on paper but all those charts and calculators are just estimates. So we are going to the Dyno with this pulley configuration and see how it goes.

    20170404_132535.jpg
    A straight 1 to 1 on the chart expects about 12 pounds of boost which is where I think we will want to be but you never know, we shall see.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2017
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  15. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Man we struck gold last night when RacerX called to help us sort out all the crazy sensors and harness needs for the new EFI system. It has been fairly comical in the shop reading the extremely vague instructions that came with the Holly ECU and Hilborn EFI unit. It said things like, "Insert the MAP Sensor plug from the harness into your 3 bar Map Sensor." Dad was reading it out loud. He stopped and said, do you have a 3 bar Map Sensor? I said yep right there in the box on the work bench. He looked over in that direction and said I don't think the harness will reach that far! :eek: LMAO!

    Resized_20170404_202320.jpeg
    But that is exactly how it has been going. I have been Googling Sensor names to find out what the heck they do which I hope is going to tell me potentially where they go etc. Then RacerX (Brian) says he would be glad to help. We talked on the phone for a while and he is like put that there, hose clamp this, don't use that one, put a line on it and drop somewhere out of sight etc. etc. In a matter a minutes all our questions were answered and we are ready to finally do this thing. Brian thank you so much, you have know idea how much we appreciate the assist.
     
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  16. I cant wait to see it run. good luck on the dyno.
     
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  17. Your THE MAN, Brian.:D
     
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  18. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    I had a great idea last night. There are several remote sensors (MAP, Idle Air, MAT etc. etc.) that in my opinion need a special place so they do not stick out on a vintage looking car. I thought about trying to direct them back into the car but I hated to put more holes in the firewall etc. So I decided to put them in the alcove area behind the distributor.

    Firewall1.jpg
    (WAY BACK) when we were cutting out most of the original firewall I was worried we might be a little tight with the distributor so we fabricated that alcove to give us some room. In the real world after we were finished and installed the motor etc. the distributor was nearly 2" from the alcove. But in retrospect, that is going to work really good as I am going to fab up an aluminum plate with large slot at the bottom. Something like this (slot not shown as it is lower than the intake).

    Firewall2.jpg
    Then I can keep the access harness and all the remote sensors out of sight etc. How about that Photoshop work there. Hopefully the real thing will look that good!...:rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2017
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  19. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Spent half the day Saturday at MOKAN Spring Hot Rod Reunion. Good time. The other half we spent at a large cruise-in. It was fun day with Dad but basically meant we didn't touch the Austin. Sunday afternoon I finally go motivated.
    Friday, I finally got to speak with Hilborn and found out the MAT sensor has to be installed under the blower. Which means we have to drill and tap a 3/8" hole in the intake (yuck)!

    So late Sunday we kicked around trying to do it with it in place but just too risky (stupid) and hard to get at anyway. So we pulled the intake off which sucks and then popped over to our local farm brother's store where we buy all our bolts etc. Not one single NPT tap in the building. So disgusted to have to go there, we headed over to Lowes. I am searching through the tool section, aisle by aisle scanning for taps. Finally a guy working in that department asked if he could help me find something. I said a 3/8 NPT tap. He said what is a tap?
    carbon_steel_npt__86476.1407865927.1280.1280.jpg

    Come to find out there is a very good reason he didn't know what one was, as they don't carry any, not even in the plumbing tool aisle. So went to both Auto Parts Stores...no go. So I went home and watched Barrett Jackson off the DVR from Saturday. I wondered how much I could actually get out of the Austin down there in Palm Beach if it were towed across the stage on a flatbed....LMAO!
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2017
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  20. wrenchbender
    Joined: Sep 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,171

    wrenchbender
    Member

    Man you live not far away from the center of Orielly's and I know they have them or if I had known you needed one I would have sent one home with you


    Chrome don't get ya home
     
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  21. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Deuced Up!
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    It was just the limited places open on Sunday. I picked one up this morning in Springfield.
     
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  22. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    I also picked up a diaper for it. Along with helping me sort out the wiring harness (RacerX) also gave me a good safety lecture (which we all need to hear once in a while). So from that conversation, I ordered a diaper for it. With such a short wheel base and the new crazy horsepower, it is going to be enough to handle all on its own, let alone anti traction agents that might spill out along the way....Thanks again Brian. 821-7809a.jpg
     
  23. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    I have started laying out the fuel line requirements. All of the fuel lines are going to be standard wall 100 R14 PTFE stainless steel braided hose. This is more for the e-85 than anything but they are good for high pressure as well, not that the Weldon pump is going to put out 3,350 psi but if it does, we are ready...LOL

    As recommended from Hilborn we are leaving the fuel cell in 12AN, through the main fuel filter and into the Weldon pump block. Then 10AN from pump through the second filter to the regulator. Then we go to a fuel block on the firewall 10AN in and dual 8AN hoses to the fuel rails. We will be using an 8AN return line and upping our fuel cell vent to 10AN...

    FlexFit_Hose_B_Flex_ptfe_hose.png
     
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  24. Deuced Up!
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  25. David Gersic
    Joined: Feb 15, 2015
    Posts: 1,188

    David Gersic
    Member
    from DeKalb, IL

    Weird. Lowe's here sells some taps and dies. Don't know if they have 3/8" NPT, though.


    Sent from my iPad using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
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  26. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Look at that pretty little bushing! :cool:

    Resized_20170411_085710.jpeg
    Like a glove baby! :p

    Resized_20170411_085724.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2017
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  27. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    Lucky Break - pun intended! Monday night after drilling and tapping the intake I found I was out of black RTV to seal up the ends and no teflon tape to install the sensor...par for the course. Last night I remedied both situations and installed the intake. I am torquing the bolts (just 35 ft/lbs.) as required. I start with 20 lbs. in the correct tightening pattern and then return to go round two at 35. No issue, another half turn or so and the torque wrench clicks....all accept one of the bolts. It keeps turning. I am thinking what is up with that...I am carefully advancing it and you guessed it...POP! :eek: And it wasn't the torque wrench.

    Resized_20170411_190540.jpeg
    I about went ballistic...I just broke a bolt off in my brand new aluminum head! Anyway I reached down to retrieve the broken half sticking out of the intake and it seemed to have friction still holding it in place. So I grab a ratchet and start carefully turning it out. Believe it or not the whole crazy thing came out in one piece. Thank goodness for anti-seize!

    Resized_20170411_171326.jpeg
    I replaced the bolt and finally got the intake down and in place FOR GOOD...lets hope! Then with a piece of .25" plate steel with sandpaper attached I sanded the intake in one direction to make sure it was not warped. Then we cleaned it all up and installed the supercharger.

    Resized_20170412_065336.jpeg
    Shinny! :p
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
  28. Deuced Up!
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
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    What in the wide world? Installing the bracket for idler pulley. It came with four 5/16-18 bolts to attach the bracket to the four tho thymus. However the threads in the end of them is not the right thread. Not sure what they are...we tried everything we had including metric...no dice. Stupidity.

    [​IMG]

    Sent from my SM-G930V using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
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  29. loudbang
    Joined: Jul 23, 2013
    Posts: 7,011

    loudbang
    Member

    Man nasty doesn't want to go faster it is thwarting you at ever turn of a wrench. :(
     
  30. Deuced Up!
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    Deuced Up!
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