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Technical ***August 2021 Banger Meet Thread - Hot August Bangers!***

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Jiminy, Aug 1, 2021.

  1. Part of the problem putting the valves in the head same as the Ardun is the pushrod locations.
    The intake side is easy as a long rocker can be used, not so easy for the ex.
    Now, if you make a SOHC or DOHC, it is possibly easier but the drive mechanism may not be so...
    IMG_0279.JPG IMG_0508.JPG
     
    Old Dawg, Jet96, ottoman and 3 others like this.
  2. hardtimesainit
    Joined: Jan 24, 2009
    Posts: 602

    hardtimesainit
    Member

    I had an alum Riley 4 Port, until month ago.. that FRICK made. Had it for many years. Wanted it on my D, but was advised that it would not be powerful enough for that good base.
     
  3. Crazydaddyo
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 3,205

    Crazydaddyo
    Member

    I saw a set up once that used ball bearings in a tube that actuated the valve. Transferring the movement of the push rod via curved tube to the end of the valve. The valve on the opposite of the pushrod could be operated this way, but it is only good for 1:1 movement limiting lift. SOHC would be better using a rocker with a ratio for more lift. Wow, now my sprockets are humming.
     
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  4. noboD
    Joined: Jan 29, 2004
    Posts: 7,731

    noboD
    Member

    The head with the ball bearings is in Speedy Bill's museum. As you said you only get 1:1 lift.
     
  5. Kevin Pharis
    Joined: Aug 22, 2020
    Posts: 206

    Kevin Pharis

    Y’all are referring to the early Harry (Hal) Hosterman designed overhead for a model T, the “Akron-Hed”.
    FD0C965E-AE15-4224-A986-31E405A52AEA.jpeg


    Here is a pic of the Akron-Hed that have built a rocker system for as the ball bearing tubes are a poor design. Not only is there no ratio advantage, but the internal friction and pressures cause the tubes to fail in very short time. There is a reason nobody else has ever tried it since!

    39688684-24FE-45FC-ACEA-53A4FE94207B.jpeg
     
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  6. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 34

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    Finally had a chance to take my cutdown banger project out to an event last weekend. Went to the #estranged_cc drags up in Toutle, WA at Riverdale Raceway. It ran really surprisingly strong for a warmed up B engine - 63 mph in the 1/8!

    I'm having problem with a heavy and pretty constant drip of oil coming out the bottom of the "bell housing"/oil pan hole where the bent over cotter pin lives - what I'd call a rear main leak. Any suggestions on how to fix or at least slow it down? I've pulled the pan and flywheel off. The drain back tube is not plugged. The slinger looks to be in good shape. I don't think it was leaking down from the rear of the cam shaft. I do have a lot of blow by as the engine has seen a lot of miles/hours (came out of an old farm truck). I am not dis-assembling the engine any time soon - so the grinding the slinger down and adding a one or two piece seal is not an option at this time. Any tricks or suggestions? I'm intending to get it back together and head to the RPM Nationals with it in a few weeks.

     
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  7. Need help on an inserted B block. My builder, who has done some A motors, but not an inserted B, says the block side of the inserts is wider than the insert is. The reccomendation is to put shims on both sides of the insert bearing. Does this make sense?
     
  8. Dan,

    I started and abandoned this using the mod motor roller rocker arms, I like the bucket design better.
    Especially if I can get some radius top Offy ones!!

    Assem1.JPG
     
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  9. I am not sure what type of shims they might be talking about.
    I typically place two bearing shells next to each other to lengthen the bearing.
    Do you know what bearings they are attempting to use? Some are getting tougher to find.

    John
     
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  10. hardtimesainit
    Joined: Jan 24, 2009
    Posts: 602

    hardtimesainit
    Member

    “I think not cam end leak”.
    You have the flywheel off Now is the EASY time to remove flywheel cover, and to ensure that the proper gasket is in there… blocking/ preventing oil leak. It happens. Guys neglect to install that important gasket. good luck.
     
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  11. I know the bearings came from Falluca's and he recommended the shims. If I recall correctly he said they need about 4/100's on either side.
     
  12. Sorry, have not used Ricks bearings.
    J
     
  13. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 34

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    Thanks for the reply @hardtimesainit I neglected mentioning it, but I had removed the flywheel cover and there was a gasket there that was sealing and not leaking oil out from the back of the cam.
     
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  14. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 34

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    Here is a pic of the flywheel cover. Gasket is there. Quite thin and stained, but there. There was not any wet leakage on the back of the block from this area.

    I'm also providing a few images of the rear main "seal" and oil slinger area. Is there supposed to be a gasket or seal of any kind here?

    rear main 2.jpg Flywheel cover.jpg oil slinger 1.jpg oil slinger 2.jpg
     
  15. Kevin Pharis
    Joined: Aug 22, 2020
    Posts: 206

    Kevin Pharis

    Did you check clearance on the rear main bearing...? You might find that it only takes a few tho of bearing clearance to overwhelm the slinger...
     
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  16. You may be on to something , the crank looks like riding only last 1/4" or so on the babbitt.
    Also, there should be some sealant on the cap back edges. I took one apart last year that did not leak a drop, the last person to assemble JB Welded the shims in place and the rear of the cap. What a bear to seperate...

    J
     
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  17. Fabber McGee
    Joined: Nov 22, 2013
    Posts: 1,024

    Fabber McGee
    Member

    I can see the crankcase vapor coming out the fill tube in your video. Perhaps a road draft tube or some sort of crankcase evacuation system would help. A negative pressure in the pan to suck the oil back in.
     
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  18. Fun duel! Surprised to see the pre-WW1 guys get their own event and with mechanics! was the turnout low?

     
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  19. hardtimesainit
    Joined: Jan 24, 2009
    Posts: 602

    hardtimesainit
    Member

    Well, if you know that it was sealing… well. But, it doesnt look right to me. Look ragged where “dirty” colored (oil stain?) area above gasket.
    Do you have high pressured oil …. that can come past that gasket… such as it is ?
    I’m just getting a B back near running. It had a bad leak right at that gasket. I put new gasket with smear of non- hardening permetex.. on gasket.
     
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  20. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 34

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    @hardtimesainit that dirty area above the gasket is caked on dirty/grease from over the years that this was in a farm truck. I hadn't previously had the cover off before this. When installing the engine I scraped and wire brushed most of the exterior of the engine prior to painting, but couldn't reach behind the cover.
    The oiling system is not high pressure, its as Ford made it in 1932. It looked to me like the gasket was sealing, but its an area I'll definitely pay attention to - and use a bit of sealer on.

    @Kevin Pharis & @johnneilson - I like what you are saying about bearing clearance and sealing the main cap. I'll check clearance and then the cap seal during re-assembly. The cap had just one shim.

    @Fabber McGee Interesting idea about the road draft tube or other evac system. I hadn't considered the negative pressure idea. Will draft tube make that big of difference?
     
  21. Fabber McGee
    Joined: Nov 22, 2013
    Posts: 1,024

    Fabber McGee
    Member

    Beavermatt, I've never experimented with road draft tubes, but I would think you'd want a lot of volume to make much vacuum. Perhaps a big diameter tube, maybe 1 and 3/4 or 2" and get the end out in as much airflow as you can. With the end of the tube 90 degrees to the air flow and a baloney slice on the end to build vacuum.
    With an old piece of tailpipe for material it won't cost you much but your time to see what happens. If it doesn't help you're not out a lot of dough.
     
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  22. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,946

    97
    Member

    Sardine can hanging under the drip hole on 4 wires , empty before each trip...is what I read in a Model A Club bulletin somewhere.
    :eek:

    Eat the sardines first!:D
     
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  23. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 658

    railcarmover

    Crankcase pressure doesn't affect rear main bearing oil flow on a B like it does on an A engine.

    Pushing an unknown used engine is dicey.The B is less likely to hammer out center main like an A but why take a chance? Right now you could probably get away with an old fashioned overhaul..adjust bearings,lap valves,hone and ring cylinders and change timing gear..couple hundred bucks and labor,cheap peace of mind..
     
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  24. V4F
    Joined: Aug 8, 2008
    Posts: 4,199

    V4F
    Member
    from middle ca.

    stupid but need info ................. when installing a headliner in my '31 coupe , does piping go first ??
     
  25. Welp, got the engine closer to running! Still need to get safety wire for the flywheel, and to paint a few more things. Is the yellow TOO bright? Screen Shot 2021-08-30 at 9.14.17 AM.png Screen Shot 2021-08-30 at 9.14.24 AM.png
     
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  26. noboD
    Joined: Jan 29, 2004
    Posts: 7,731

    noboD
    Member

    You better get permission from Rich Fox. That's his patented shade, but I doubt he would ever work on a Ford.
     
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  27. My banger isn't even 1/10th of the power of his builds! I'm a big fan of his plymouth banger
     
    Jet96 likes this.
  28. Side note, I'm looking at this front timing cover, and trying to understand how someone would run a mag or water/oil pump off the cam. Anyone have any input on this?
    Screen Shot 2021-08-30 at 10.21.28 AM.png
     
  29. Maybe like this?

    IMG_0307 crop.jpg
     
    Jet96, Dustyp489 and Old Dawg like this.
  30. That's what I'm thinking. Are you running a coupler on the cam gear?
     

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