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Featured Technical ***August 2019 Banger Thread Hot August Nights***

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by Jiminy, Aug 1, 2019.

  1. Jiminy
    Joined: Oct 25, 2012
    Posts: 315

    Jiminy
    Member

    Coming Events: (PM Jiminy with additions/corrections)
    Saturday, September 7, 2019
    16th Annual North Central Region F.A.S.T. Speed Meet
    Worth County Fairgrounds, Northwood, Iowa
    4 miles south of the Minnesota Border, 7 miles east of I - 35
    September 13-15, 2019 The 5th Annual Hot Rod Hill Climb
    Central City, Colorado

    October 4th, 5th and 6th T.R.O.G. Wildwood, NJ
    2019 SCTA El Mirage Race Dates:

    All events are held at the El Mirage Dry Lake in Southern California.
    July 21st ***CANCELED DUE TO CRACKS IN THE LAKE BED***
    September15th
    October 20th
    November 9th - 10th
    2019 SCTA/BNI Bonneville Race Dates:

    The BNI has two major events each year at the Bonneville Salt Flats outside of Wendover Utah.
    August 10th - 16th, Speed Week
    October 1st - 4th, World Finals

    For the HAMB banger newbies, here are some links to a lot of banger info:


    Jim Brierley's book 4-bangers! And me! is a must read book for all banger enthusiasts. US customers send $34.00 all color except for the oldest pictures (includes S/H in the U.S.A.), PayPal welcome, to:
    Jim Brierley, 39480 Colleen Way, Temecula, CA 92592.
    email: jimb4e4@gmail.com
    phone: 951-695-7313.


    Here is a list of most of the prior monthly banger meet links:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=161498


    Banger basics. another info link list:
    http://www.fordgarage.com/


    http://www.plucks329s.org/index.htm

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=251717

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=42480

    The link below shows flywheel lightening dimensions
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/may-bang-er-thread.470853/page-4#post-5212157
    and this link shows the missing image from the above post
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...-work-on-bangers.1010716/page-3#post-11427055


    The 4 Banger hot rod picture thread.
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/the-4-banger-hot-rod-picture-thread.997051/


    Model B rod bearing insert numbers
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6992484#post6992484


    Engine tuning with a Vacuum gauge
    http://web.archive.org/web/20120415...e.com/tuning-with-a-vacuum-gauge-spg-148.html


    Adjusting dual Strombergs:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6638461#post6638461


    Helpful Model A tools and tips:
    http://www.maurer-markus.ch/ford_a/tipps.index.en.html


    Gary in MN's late model Malory distributor conversion for A/B engine:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=9147025&postcount=109


    Elrod's stuck head tech:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=218487


    Model A generator to alternator conversion:
    http://ejwhitneyco.com/automotive.html


    Gear ratio / speed and RPM calculator:
    http://www.accuautoparts.com/calculator.php


    Model A master cylinder mounting bracket ideas:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...73#post4953173


    Go here to read the 1931 edition of Harry Ricardo's book "The High Speed Internal Combustion Engine"
    http://www.scribd.com/full/40610101?access_key=key-w2bcjicdancrnxypd05


    Chevy Banger Stuff
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=463465


    Post 198 starts a great discussion of the shape of a flat head combustion chamber
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=470853&page=10


    T-5 5 speed in a Torque Tube:
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=256226


    New Banger Block in the Works
    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/new-banger-block-in-the-works.616056/


    Model A & B Style Cast Iron Cylinder Head Compression Ratios.
    http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/headcompressionratio.htm
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  2. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,446

    97
    Member

    Yesterday in the last post of July anger Meet
    Glenn,
    Edoardo Weber started in business in 1923, marketing an aftermarket hop up kit for Fiat cars. Weber pioneered the use of two-stage twin barrel carburetors, with two venturis of different sizes, the smaller one for low speed running and the larger one optimised for high speed use. The 28/36 DCD was (and still is) a staple of of Weber's lineup. Sure the DGAV and DGV carbs commonly fitted to Model As are a later development, but they too are now a 50 year old design. The DCD which as I said is still available from Weber is much older and bolts on to the same manifold.. It was always a performance carburettor, but was factory fitted to many cars including some 4 banger Fords...
     
    Dannerr and Old Dawg like this.
  3. JT1930
    Joined: Jul 1, 2018
    Posts: 143

    JT1930
    Member

    I like the Winfield look. Just got the new gaskets for it and intake came in yesterday. 7F47F788-A146-4419-8E76-AA7DC46044A5.jpeg
     
    Dannerr, Jet96, waxhead and 1 other person like this.
  4. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    Folks with model a's praise the weber 32/36,folks with volkswagens hate them..Winfield porn? yeah,I got some..not going the full period route though,its sexy as hell but spendy. thumbnail - 2019-07-30T172357.940.jpg
     
    Dannerr, Jet96 and waxhead like this.
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  5. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 3,220

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    IMG_0051.JPG

    I'm a big 32/36 Weber fan. Adapter for an "traditional" air filter is a must
     

    Attached Files:

    ROCKER77 and MJW like this.
  6. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    I set one up on a cragar ohv for a friend..its not really a 'set up',its plug and play..looks alot better with a round air cleaner. Ive got all it takes to set up a pair of weber ICT's,34 mm throats that flow at 80 CFM each,diaphragm type accel pumps..Italian ones from the 60's.going to invert an ansen dual intake with adapters..gonna look like hell,but they should work good..they didnt work well with single runner manifolds,need a plenum.. thumbnail (38).jpg
     
    Dannerr, Jet96 and Old Dawg like this.
  7. Bigcheese327
    Joined: Sep 16, 2001
    Posts: 6,593

    Bigcheese327
    Member

    Webers can definitely look just as good as a Winfield, but a lot of them seem to just look like driver-level retrofits instead of vintage speed parts. When I was considering Webers (I'm using Stromberg 81's now), I was going to copy the setup from a '30s Fiat 508 Balilla Sport:

    Single Weber.jpg
    1935 Fiat 508 Balilla Sport

    Dual Webers 1934-fiat-508s-balilla-sport.jpg
    1934 Fiat 508s Balilla Sport
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2019
  8. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    When you free yourself from vintage speed constraints the path is easier...and cheaper :)
     
  9. Bigcheese327
    Joined: Sep 16, 2001
    Posts: 6,593

    Bigcheese327
    Member

    So's buying a late-model car. I suspect even a Kia will outrun most bangers--but that's not really the point, is it?
     
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  10. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    Modifying a model a for increased performance without using period correct parts is blasphemy? I thought only MARC and MAFCA had purists..
     
    Dannerr likes this.
  11. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 3,220

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Hot rodders in the mid fifties were always looking for the new best thing. Same with customizers. While I certainly enjoy the exchanges on the HAMB, it's really not indicative of how it really was! Where's the tech thread on using coat hangers for welding rod? As soon as we could afford real rod, we left the hangers in the closet. The hot rod industry has always been built on innovation, whether it's from companies or individuals.
     
    Old Dawg likes this.
  12. Bigcheese327
    Joined: Sep 16, 2001
    Posts: 6,593

    Bigcheese327
    Member

    I think you are improperly feeling attacked. It's a big tent, do what you want. It's just not for me. I like the history.

    Some people enjoy pushing an obsolete cylinder block to new heights of performance by utilizing the very latest in technology. Some people enjoy improving performance within specific constraints.

    It seems to me the HAMB was founded on the latter proposition, but I think it’s all interesting. I just choose the latter because it’s more appealing to me.

    I certainly don’t begrudge anyone wanting to do the other thing and even am open to learning things from them. But I definitely don’t view period correctness as something from which I or anybody else needs to be “freed” to properly enjoy the hobby.

    The point of the post about the Fiat carbs was actually that Webers can look period with a little effort--not to persuade anyone not to use them.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2019
  13. noboD
    Joined: Jan 29, 2004
    Posts: 6,824

    noboD
    Member

    I had a Weber 32-36 on a VW Rabbit and loved it.
     
    firstinsteele likes this.
  14. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 3,220

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    E1081CD7-F69C-48E6-9E21-E27ABADB2123.jpeg
    Here’s my Weber on a B motor with an original CRAGAR head. This is a newer intake than the one on my roadster engine in post #5.
     
    Old Dawg and burl like this.
  15. Big cheese, gotta ask. What are the small items in the air filter in your first photo.
     
  16. Bigcheese327
    Joined: Sep 16, 2001
    Posts: 6,593

    Bigcheese327
    Member

    That's an excellent question and I don't honestly know the answer. I think they're small pieces of tube designed to make the air change directions on its way in so the dirt falls out, but the image came from a Bonhams auction and had no further information about the air cleaner. Maybe if I spoke/read Italian I'd be able to research it.

    Also, I note that this is actually a 1935 car. I'll edit my caption appropriately.
     
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  17. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    It's a good carb,no doubt.the air cooled guys didnt like them.
     
  18. winduptoy
    Joined: Feb 19, 2013
    Posts: 1,487

    winduptoy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Checking in
    @Jiminy , the Hot Rod Hill Climb is the 13th - 15th 2019
     
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  19. Binger
    Joined: Apr 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,571

    Binger
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from wyoming

    Checking in for the month. Getting excited for the Hill Climb also!!!
    As far as those Webbers go I have one and an intake that I haven't installed yet. I think I will put it on my Stock roadster that has a hood. it does look a bit modern for my taste. They don't look so bad when you adapt it to a traditional air cleaner like Dennis did above. Not much new in Cheyoming but I have however been working on a cute 26-27 T roadster for a friend. He needs me to get it running and fix a few small issues. The car will eventually be up for sale. So if anybody wants a stock T roadster let me know. I will post a couple of pics later when I get home later tonight or perhaps tomorrow.
     
    Dannerr likes this.
  20. burl
    Joined: Nov 28, 2007
    Posts: 560

    burl
    Member
    from Minnesota

    Checking in for the month got my beater running and driving getting ready for the hill climb next month.Purchased my next ten year project a couple of weeks ago 28 8-1.jpg mopar roadster.jpg
     
  21. railcarmover
    Joined: Apr 30, 2017
    Posts: 135

    railcarmover

    Anyone can open his wallet,buy what he desires,build a 'look' and hold it up as a mantle of success.To me the joy is in the build,the unique innovations that come from hours of trial and error in the shop.Its how the parts the guy uses for a 'look' came into being,Ed Winfield spent long hours in a shop chasing dreams..
     
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  22. winduptoy
    Joined: Feb 19, 2013
    Posts: 1,487

    winduptoy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    For reference, I've been using this fuel pump successfully on Stromberg 97, 81 and Holley 94 carburetors with no fuel pressure regulator. Downside is that it is in 12V only.
    25 GPH Holley Mighty Mite Electric Fuel Pump, 1.5-4 PSI
    Part #12-426
     
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  23. rwrj
    Joined: Jan 30, 2009
    Posts: 424

    rwrj
    Member
    from SW Ga

    My contribution to the carb discussion. I use an SU HS6, which is a 1 3/4" single barrel, variable venturi carubetor. It took some fiddling around, but it runs really well now. That model is from the 1960's, but the design has been around forever. The earlier ones were pretty much the same, just fewer plastic parts (and a lot more money, nowadays). I guess, if you were worried about period-correctness, you could find one from the 20's that would give similar performance. It would cost you, though.

    IMG_20190711_150936159.jpg
     
  24. I think that for the most part, HAMBers are NOT constrained by the occasional "purist"! What I find intriguing on this thread is things all you guys come up with (new or old). With my "Banger" I'm constrained somewhat by the Vintage Racing Regs, But what the Club inspectors don' know, won't hurt them! We'll be running again this year at Laguna Seca, Hopefully I can keep all the parts going the same direction at the same time!

    millergilmore (2) (2018_02_11 18_51_06 UTC).png
     
    Dannerr, MJW, Shutter Speed and 4 others like this.
  25. Bigcheese327
    Joined: Sep 16, 2001
    Posts: 6,593

    Bigcheese327
    Member

    I'll be covering the Monterey Historics this year. I'll have to look for you in the pits!

    I have a buddy looking for a copy of those Vintage Racing Regs. Do you know where I can get them for him?
     
  26. Midnight Rider
    Joined: May 13, 2010
    Posts: 24

    Midnight Rider
    Member
    from Australia

    rabbit injection badge.jpg bobs a project.jpg rabbit injection badge.jpg bobs a project.jpg
    Checking in from Downunder where winter has slowed things a bit.
    Here's our twin SU's setup we put on brothers car in 1990. Everyone laughed at it then, so we added the VW Rabbit Injection badge on the bonnet top. Setting up on new RPU project now.
     
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  27. Shutter Speed
    Joined: Feb 2, 2017
    Posts: 403

    Shutter Speed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Checking in. Too busy playin to be wrenchin on BNGR! (Except quick brake adjust).

    2 dudes, 2 tubes, 2 bikes, 1 truck, 1 river. Life is good. Hit the road! DSC_0407.JPG
     
  28. We'll at Laguna Seca run Thurs. Fri. and Sat. We're the 1st Group on the track on each day in the morning during the week and also in the afternoon on Sat. We don't run on Sun.

    Your friend should go to the website of each sanctioning Club to find the basic regulations and any specific regulations to that individual Club. My car has run mostly in the West so it's set for CSRG, HMSA, SVRA and VARA. Most have regs. specific to "PreWars"; others don't invite "PreWars" AT ALL!

    gezzers2019.jpeg
     
  29. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 14

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    Hi Gents - I have a model B banger out of a 32 truck. Runs ok (on a test stand). Getting it mounted in my speedster project. Trying to push in the clutch and it won't budge. Pulled the clutch out to take a look. While worn and a little dirty, nothing appears abnormal, broken, or excessively worn with the pressure plate, disc, or flywheel. Disc not rusted or corroded to the pressure plate or flywheel. On the bench I can push (with effort) the fingers of the pressure plate, so they aren't locked up. After cleaning it all up I reassembled and still have the same problem. While tightening down the pres. plate bolts I can see the pres. plate fingers move inward quite a bit - like about an inch. That seems like a lot. Any ideas?

    FYI - I will eventually get new parts. I'm just assembling as is to see what works, what fits, etc.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
  30. BeaverMatt
    Joined: Jun 17, 2013
    Posts: 14

    BeaverMatt
    Member

    Looked over on the Ford Barn and found out about adjusting and setting the finger height. Had another old pres plate off of an A engine and tried it. The fingers on it were at the correct height. Bolted up the tranny and I have clutch action! Next question is a Model B throw out bearing hub (the piece that holds the bearing) unique to the B engined cars and trucks? I know it is different than A throwout bearings. Are they the same as the flathead V8 bearings? If you can't tell, I'm new to the banger world so I'm learning a lot everyday. Been following the banger meets for a while an learning quite a bit. Thanks
     
    Bigcheese327 likes this.

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