Anyone have a Pole Building for a shop?

I am looking at building a shop myself this summer and it looks like a pole building is the cheapest way to go. It might not be the best but its what I can afford. I plan on pooring a 5 inch floor and insulating it.

I have some questions. Is it a good idea to use a frost barrier around the outside? I Have heard that if you bury styrofoam sheets 4 foot down that it will keep the frost from under the concrete and make it easier to heat and keep the concrete from cracking and heaving. Should I do this or just plant the poles without the frost barrier? Tell me about your pole building if you have one!

Thanks for your input

 

http://www.garagejournal.com

It's a sister site where you will find plenty of info on pole barn type garages as well as just about every other thing garage related!

 

Yup, what Q said. My shop/house is pole based. But in the Hills we dont have the freezing you do......I thought I saw you were from East River?

 

Nothing wrong with a pole building,especilly for DIY type. I built mine with used phone poles. Put down 8 mill plastic under concrete (6 inches with gravel base). Make sure you have drainage around building. I traded 6cyl chevy for lumber used for Purlins. Sawmill cut poplar girts. Insulated with white faced 8 ft wide commercial fiberglass (roof and walls). A shop can never be too big, but consider how you will heat and costs and try not to make it like a airplane hanger or make it too tall that it costs too much and takes too long to heat. Trusses are on 8ft centers so car lift clears. The rest is up to your taste in what you need. If you are on a budget do not have any overhang on roof,trim is expensive. If I had to do over I would use spray on foam insulation. I don't have windows-xtra cost and just an invitation for break-ins. 36 X 66 with floor,4 overhead doors, 2 slider doors and 1 entry door for about $13,000.

 

Thanks Q !

 

If you plan on spending a lot of time in there, you should keep it heated. Once the concrete gets cold it takes a looooong time to warm it back up. Your feet will freeze. I keep mine at 40 degrees in the winter and turn it up to 50 or 60 when I'm going to be working in there.

 

Thanks ko-lec-tor, I have a dozen phone poles but they not the straightest. But I"ll consider that!

 

I had a pole barn built (6x8 timbers) w/ a poured concrete floor. In hindsight, it would have been better for me to have a conventional stick-built building constructed. I ended up framing in between the posts and finishing the walls. Would have been quicker if it were stick built.

Maybe you've already considered these points, but here's my list of musts:

Insulate the floor, both under the floor and up the sides between the concrete and the rat wall. I didn't and regret it.
12' ceiling min.
Install fixed windows high on the walls. I did and love it.
Spray in foam insulation in the walls....esp in a pole barn..really seals up all those weird cavities. However, it is not fire rated and must be covered, which leads back to my comment in the opening paragraph.
In floor radiant heat. If you're going to be in the shop a lot, you'll love it.
Ceiling fans. Put a couple in.
Bathroom.


Good luck.

 

You may want to consider installing radiant heat in the floor of your shop. I put it in mine and I don't have to deal with cold and cracked concrete. No hot then cold temp swings, very even heat and extremely comfortable and efficiant. It cost more to install but in the long run it is well worth the investment. Just something to think about.

 

I have a 30' x 54' pole barn with a 14' ceiling. I'll second the suggestion to insulate! We had it insulated with 1" foil backed foam when it was built, & it was the best decision we made. I have an 80,000 btu propane space heater & can comfortably work in my shirt sleeves in sub 20 degree weather. Another bonus of the foil backed foam is the shiny backing makes the barn nice and bright. I have 10 8' fluorescent fixtures on the bottom of the rafters that easily light the whole building.

 

I had a pole barn in the late 70's eary 80's in Northern Illinois.
When we built it I found a boiler from an old apartmentt house they were tearing down that fed all the radiators in the apts. We laced the concrete with 1"-2" pipes (whatever I could find) and pumped hot water thru them. Worked great. Never needed any other heat. Was an oil boiler, so fuel woud beprohibitivbe today, but there are other ways to hear water.

INSULATE INSULATE INSULATE. The shit pays for itself in 1-2 years.

 

Mines a pole building and I have no regrets except I didn't make the ceiling high enough for my new lift, I just didn't think I'd ever have one when I built the garage. Otherwise it's warm and comfortable and sometimes the big posts come in really handy for attaching heavy stuff. They're relatively cheap, quick, and easy, with no serious drawbacks that I can think of.

 

We have a Morton pole building. We had them do the inner liner with there insulation package. It's tight, and heats cheap. More money but it's a nicer building with better resale.
Jeff

 

good idea ,but make sure the dancers are warm .

 

Having worked in the HVAC industry, and having spend a few years working every day in a hot rod shop that operated in a pole barn, I would seriously consider installing radiant in floor hydronic heat. The initial cash outlay is more, and you need to put it in before you pour the floor, but it is totally worth it. The comfort is way better and you'll save a ton of money on heating bills. I mention this because you are talking about insulation and frost barriers, and there is no amount of insulation that will make a pole barn feel warm and cozy inside on a northern winter day if you are trying to heat it with forced air.

 

I put down styrene and plastic under the slab, but not 4 foot down. Then put 2X4's in between the poles with insulation and plastic and blew in the ceiling. White steel inside on the walls and ceiling works out great. I use an overhead Reznor and a couple ceiling fans. Toasty for me and a great place to hide.

 

My friend had a 30x30 wood/metal bldg. put us about 3 years ago with a conc .floor. He framed the inside with 2x4's and insulated and sheetrocked it he heats it with a wood stove I have been in there a near zero temps and it is very warm.

 

Thanks for all the feedback. The frost barrier i've had described to me is to put foam sheets vertical in the ground just on the outside of the floor and that keeps the frost from going under the floor. Also the barrier should be down at least as deep as the frost line.

 

Toast has a nice one with a loft on once side and an office upstairs!

 

What size is your shop T Hudson? I have a Resnor also. Do you heat yours all the time? Whats it cost to heat if you don't mind me asking?

 

...if you put heat pipes in the concrete, you can heat the water (anti-freeze) with a simple house-type water heater. It costs a bit to put the system in, but heating is very reasonable. Had a friend set his up so he could even heat with a wood stove in case the power went off for days.

 

Thats how we did it when I worked construction in Brookings. You can also lay it out away from the foundation at an downward angle the backfill. The thought is it creates a "zone" around the building to stop frost and not just a barrier right next to the wall.

 

Thanks Tman, I did some research and found what they call a northeast frost barrier and thats where they go down 2 feet and out 2 feet. That goes along with what your describing.

 

Just had a 30X50 built. Waiting on warm weather for the floor. Didnt cost much and it accually makes for a nice looking building. I plan on finishing about half of it inside with a dividing wall for haet and painting. Its a good way to go on a working mans budget. GarageJournal.com has lots of photos of peoples Pole Barns

 

Mine's a 45 by 45 pole building. Standard framing would have been my preference, but I bought it this way. Just be sure to insulate the hell out of it. I've hung the whole building with sheetrock , and it has never cracked or buckled. Its pretty stable to my amazement.
Tman has a great idea with that insulation. My codes department requires 4 feet of ground insulation. It can be 1 foot down and 3 feet horizontal, 2ft down ,2ft horizontal. etc. any combination that equats four feet. Mine is kept at 45 degrees when I'm gone, 66 degrees when I'm working. Power in the worst months here in Montana has never exceeded 170 dollars,



Obviously I went overboard on mine, but it does demonstrate that a lot can be done with a pole building. They are not just an unstable "shell"

 

I even hear some crazy fool insulated his with straw?!

 

Yeah, some people do really crazy shit.

 

I too installed a frost barrier on the concerete of my pole barn and keep my work bay heated to 48 degrees all winter until I am ready to use it. The floor always stays warm. I too have a 20 ft high ceiling in that bay with forced heat.
Do this....I would suggest totally separating the work bay from the storage bays with a wall and insulation. The garage bay warms up to 68 in 30 minutes.

this one was built from a design I made to match the other out building. The roofing is call ondura or endura and is designed to hold its on weight without an underlayment of plywood sheets. Three years now and works great. The siding is actually a real tongue and groove.
I built this for 22 big ones for everything but the drywall. 36 x 24 with a loft. The work bay is the one door side that you see on the left.

 

I put one up last year 32x30x12. went up in 2 days. I heat with a 75k cieling heater from northern tool ($425) it heats up in minuits.
Taxes are usually cheaper because its a barn not a garage.

 

I bought a newer home a year ago that included a 30' x 40' "Morton" pole building. Poured a floor early spring of '08 (after thaw, the contracter said). There's already some random cracking. If it doesn't get worse, I'll be OK. ... but who knows? Anyway, make sure you get a good, solid floor poured. Any pre-pour insulation you can afford will pay off later.

Nobody has mentioned a floor drain. I think that's a good idea. I live on an acreage, so I just ran mine out behind the building into a rock-filled pit. Don't expect any kind of heavy use or nasty chemical waste, so no worries about connecting with the sewer line.