The Jalopy Journal
Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by dlotraf, Feb 5, 2012.
I would have to buy a chain hoist and find a suitable tree.
You guys and your fancy tig welders. I'm keeping mine period correct and only using a heliarc welder
my period of build is 2012.
it allows me to do anything from the past and not be picked apart by nostalgia cops
Yeah and I can't even afford all the real parts. It wasn't meant at all as a suggestion that it's Not Period correct if it was built with ebay or a MIG welder. For me it would be the challenge of doing it without the modern tools. And without the talent or patience it certainly could end up with a compromise in finish quality. IE: brackets and the like could end up in a cruder design.
Just like restoring a painting the person doing the work will use same materials, brushes, paint, and technique, or as close as possible to restore or repair the work of art. And I figured there probably were some car nuts that might take it to that extent. I would find it very rewarding to build one like that. I just don't believe I have that type of dedication or talent. I refer you back to an earlier post " I can't cut a straight line with a hack saw"............
I have a chain fall that I'm not using heavy duty 12 inch wheel
I paid $2300 for my Mig 35 years ago. back in the 60's my local welder that did all my chassis work (John Radu) had a wire feed he used over all the other welders in his shop. said he couldn't get it certified for construction even though it passed all the shear tests of the time.
This one came damn close...The Amocat roadster.
Good thread. I'm trying to finish a project that I started when I was 18 and use the stuff I had in mind at that time ( 64). Presently I'm patching the rear fenders; both from rust and hidden collision damage that was repaired before I purchased the the car (62). On several occasions, I have looked for parts I needed. Not available! I can't go to the boneyard and just buy better fenders, or alt/gen brackets to use on my sbc with no tapped holes in the heads. My point is: my "advanced" tools allow me to repair sheetmetal That I would have thrown away when I started and the internet allows access to people with parts that I would never meet otherwise.
Your premise is interesting, but time and progress have made it almost futile. JMHO
Reading thru the comments its "majoring in the minors" both of my cars are built out of used re-crafted parts... but, I would never be concerned with the type of welder used... I trust the folks working with me to use the best tool available for the job... craftsmen who have multiple options don't even use the same welder for everything... some have advantages over others depending the task at hand... never had someone look at my cars and proclaim they aren't period correct because of the welds - its usually is someone noticing the vintage parts and how they were used...
yup! but my version of a period correct car is that you pick one year so mine is a 1950 32 roadster (work is in progress)
If you wanted to be real period all welding would need to be done with a torch and stick... MIG was out in '49 but wasnt practical or affordable until much much later, similar to laser welding is now...
Internet doesn't count as off limits. That's just information. I'd say style, materials and technique are the factors. You can do it in the exact same style, using the exact same techniques, but materials will be a problem. Mainly with paint...unless someone has some really old paint they've saved. Glass may be an issue too. You could use non-safety glass, but who would? How 'bout brake-lining material? Not many old radiators used either...do they reman them exactly?
That said...I don't know that my "citations" really matter.
Yep. The internet is where you can learn from millions of people what high school kids learned from a handful of friends and a monthly little book in the 50s.
I don't think you cheated, those technologies did exist and there are plenty of cases where they were used. I have heard so many stories of people sneaking things into work so they could do something they couldn't do at home.
Wow you guys are really hard core. To me welding was just melting an electrode along with the 2 parent metals until they are fused. Where or how the necessary heat is generated to accomplish this isn't nearly as important as the end result...a good penetrating weld. You all would throw rocks at me with my electronic converted period correct looking Mallory distributors. I personally don't think that I am "cheating" but it seems many may disagree.
All that being said we all really enjoy the sight of a period correct car and the joy that we feel when we find that perfect part for our particular project.
Did I ever tell you about my ballast resistor?
Great thread, I'm in my early twenty's and live in an old war time house with friends. I have a single detached garage with man pit and wood stove. My goal is a post war hot rod, standard coupe. Close to having all period correct parts (need 33-34 front axle) for proper mock up, with the expiation of Vern Tardel front engine mounts, cut down K-member made by HAMBer, and trans mount (e-gay). The only welder I have is gas, body will be done (has been) with hammer, dolly and files. I know couple old timers in the area that have lived it, One fellow is willing to teach me to lead work. I do have a grinder.... I'm not going out of my way to build like this, this is the only things I have available to me, and trying to keep parts finding local.
Where is Burt Munroe when you need a teacher of old ways to do things??
Good for you, on both the rod, and trying to build it the old way. A lot are missing my point or rather question. In my opinion you can still build a period correct car and use a MIG welder or whatever. I just thought there would be some out there obsessive enough to go the extra mile. With a lot of guys it's almost, and maybe mostly about the build. Sure it's harder, so is finding that perfect part made before 1950. I have known guys that love the hunt almost more than the build, and it's swap meets and such no internet. But when they find that perfect part you would think they hit the lottery. There was a guy in my neighborhood when I was younger who built sail boats like that. He only used old hand wood working tools. I think they may have been his Grandfathers. So there might have been more to it than just old tools. But he wanted to do it just like his Grandfather had. I personally think it could be a rewarding challenge.
Tig was still not refined to a modern style welder until after '69. Typically used helium instead of argon until 80s? Helium is still prefered for many on site tig welders. Pre 69 it was more or less a complicated mig machine with a tungston and the filler rod coming in at the end of the nozzle... Mills how ever have been around for ages and ages...
I agree, to me a correct period build is one using a time frame and sticking to it. If its a prewar build then no T5's or FS ignitions. I want to go thru the feeling of the time period. If a condenser fails and leaves me along the side of the road thats all part of it.
If it was to be a truly period perfect build you wouldn't be on here asking about it. The internet didn't exist. You'd be writing letters and licking stamps and mailing them to all of us.
^^^^^^^^^^^ And so it begins.............................
Some cars have a different tack. My car is a '64 Studebaker Daytona. I set the 'build date' as 1968. Yes, maybe a little past the build dates most on here have. It also means that most of my changes fall into minor stuff.
A friend in the Studebaker Club had a great build of a '53 Starliner hardtop. His inspiration was to build the car the way he would have in high school if he had a little money. Easier to do if you graduate in '64 vs being born in '64. I've decided to go in a similar vein, only that I doubt a high school kid would have been able to buy the car new. But I figure a car that's 4 years old was fair game, hense the 1968 date.
The car has factory disc brakes that I'll use, but I'm using a '66 Avanti dual master cylinder. I'm cutting a coil off the front springs to drop the nose. I'm pulling the bumper guards and removing the sail panel 'V-8' emblems. The tires will be reproduction redlines on Cragar S/S mags. Most likely the rear end will be a Dana 44 with 3.54's
I'm getting a hotter cam and bumping the compression in the engine. The intake is being changed to a four barrel and I'm looking for an original Carter 4V for an R1 engine. I'll get a set of the factory headers and a set of Cherry Bomb mufflers. Also looking to get a '62 Corvette Air Cleaner.
The interior will be mostly stock with the factory buckets and console. The car is an original 4-speed car and I have a Hurst shifter for the T-10. I have the factory guages and an aftermarket set of Greenline guages (vacuum, volt guage) and I'm still looking for an oil temp guage. The only part that will look completely different is the new A/C compressor from Vintage Air though it will be painted and detailed to look 40+ years old.
My Hi-Teck stereo system is the factory AM push button radio, an aftermarket FM converter and an aftermarket 8-track tape player. I haven't decided on what to do with the speakers yet. Still looking for old style 'high beam' fog lamps.
I gave it an honest effort. Most of the mods were done in brass like “back in the day”. I tried to capture the period with an alternator hidden in a generator housing. The “hard line” line custom paint. Metallic instead of pearl/candy. The body color “sprayed in” the closed glove box door jam. Unrubbed “sprayed out” enamel under the hood. These were unique to the period (mid 50’s).
Unique to the car- Underside “all scraped up”. This will be an ongoing process. Miss-matched kick panels in the interior (lack of funds). Rear gravel shield not molded in like the front.
The quotes are Juniors. I didn’t want to get into a position where someone could get one of the many pictures that are now available and say “hey, wait just a minute…”.
My poor ol model A has a late '50's vibe to it, but is really a mash up of what the previous owner could get his hands on cheap. I would love to have all late '50's genuine parts on it, but in reality I don't have the time off work (active duty) or the money and knowledge(to know whats period correct) to go running around the country to hit swap meets or sit on ebay all day looking for the genuine parts. There are many changes I want to make for a more "period correct" car (like 3x2 intake and a drilled I beam and wish bones up front), but like me or hate me I'll have to use repop parts for alot of things.
Anyone who has built a "period" ( pick a year & stick to it) car knows there are some things that will be updated because of safety or unavailability or price... safety glass, hidden dual master cylinders, newer gauges... the newstalgia craze has made old style wiring and repro speed items easier... but, even though I've stayed closed drive train - I couldn't fault even later trans & open drive train as long as its not easily detected for a car that sees a lot of miles... let alone types of welds... if they don't get driven then they won't be seen to keep the torch burning... a friend has a classic car museum and the appreciation for these cars is dwindling... I truely appreciate an honest effort to maintain "period correct" but, I'm a realist... Keep the next generations involved or our "period cars" will be in museums that few care about
57 Chevy BelAir 2 door sedan; fashioned after an actual car I remember from 1964. 327/300 horse 4 speead, 64 Impala SS interior complete with 4 speed console; wide whites, 59 Vette hubcaps, 60 Impala steering wheel, Rochester tri-power; authentic medium metallic blue true to the era, and black bucket seats;....oh yeah, Hurst linkage on the 4 speed.
Hell ya! Just got back from picking up '36 front suspension, there's my axle and buddy mite have tires for me too. From mock up to roller! Next up new gears and get the banjo back together!
I am going to build a period -correct APPEARING car. I have garnered up '48 hydraulic brakes, 48 bones, an A axle, etct. I don't have a body yet, but that is the goal. However, to build an absolutely period correct car is beyond my financial means- this stuff is getting expensive! I think a number of people are in the same boat as I am. I love them, but you need deep pockets and/or a lot of connections with people with parts stashes to do it now. Also, something to keep in mind is that while the 1970s' dont seem that old to some of us, that was fourty years ago. That is pre-historic to some people in this hobby now!!
Went by quick, didn't it?
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