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Hot Rods Anti Hot Rod & Muscle Car Enforcement by Wisconsin State Patrol

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Blues4U, Apr 26, 2019.

  1. jazz1
    Joined: Apr 30, 2011
    Posts: 1,397

    jazz1
    Member

    We have "fair weather" rule here although. Our police have bigger fish to fry than pulling over old coots who are trying to make a fenderless fashion statement.
     
  2. a boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,884

    a boner
    Member

    I don't think the Wisconsin State Patrol wants any out of state people to visit.....spend your money back in your own state! Cancel your hotel reservations and blame the WSP.
     
    milwscruffy and Speed~On like this.
  3. Suppose " burden of proof" and "probable cause" are court related also. In the meantime Barney Fife is writing tickets for whatever he can make up on the spot and the higher ups are promoting it. A sad state of affairs going on for a ridiculously small group of part time vehicles.
     
    PBRmeASAP likes this.
  4. Actually, yes. Probable cause is the lesser standard that need to be met for the traffic stop. That would be that the officer/trooper/deputy saw a vehicle violation of the law/statute/ordinance, etc. Burden of proof is what the prosecution must present in order to win the case which must be proved beyond a reasonable doubt in the courtroom. This would include all the elements of the offense and especially whether or not it fit the applicable charge.

    I think you have that backwards. The management of any agency sets the policies. The officer/trooper/deputy follows the directives. The law enforcement official is not "writing tickets for whatever he can make up" and your attitude, i.e., "Barney Fife" is probably making your lot in life worse. More people talk themselves into tickets than talk their way out of them. I'm guessing you are one of the latter group.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
  5. a boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,884

    a boner
    Member

    About the "from out of state" question, I wouldn't drive into Wisconsin with any sort of modified vehicle, until this "problem" is corrected. You would be like a sitting duck.....as it would be pretty inconvenient for you to fight the ticket. It would be like easy access to your wallet for the WSP.
    Paying the fine is a win for the WSP.
    Fighting the ticket is the only way to turn his B.S. situation around.
     
    milwscruffy likes this.
  6. woodbutcher
    Joined: Apr 25, 2012
    Posts: 3,052

    woodbutcher
    Member

    :( Most interesting thread.I`ll saddle up and go along for the ride.
    Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
    Leo
     
  7. MMM1693
    Joined: Feb 8, 2009
    Posts: 392

    MMM1693
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    a boner I'm afraid you are right. Really wanted to take my coupe to Wisc. HRH on the 18th but now thinking I might have to take my sedan. This whole thing is a sad state of affairs.
     
    i.rant, pprather and milwscruffy like this.
  8. [QUOTE="lonejacklarry, post: 13071693, member: 230716"

    I think you have that backwards. The management of any agency sets the policies. The officer/trooper/deputy follows the directives. The law enforcement official is not "writing tickets for whatever he can make up" and your attitude, i.e., "Barney Fife" is probably making your lot in life worse. More people talk themselves into tickets than talk their way out of them. I'm guessing you are one of the latter group.[/QUOTE]

    I know I have it backwards which makes it even worse. The officer is now writing tickets for what he was told to do from their superiors, not having a clue if said citations are legit or not. Seeing I haven't had a ticket in 30+ years I think I know how to play the game. The problem being, this shouldn't be a game.
     
    raven likes this.
  9. Mike
    Joined: Mar 5, 2001
    Posts: 3,379

    Mike
    Member

    I've lived my entire life in California and Arizona. Both states are governed by statute law (as are most states), this means that a person cannot be arrested for (traffic citation is a form of arrest) or charged with an offense that is not written as a statute in the state penal code (vehicle code is part of the penal code). If a person is issued a traffic citation, it will contain the statute number and description for the offense(s) of which they are accused. Police officers carry a copy of the penal code and/or have access to it via computer in their vehicle, so finding the appropriate statute number is not difficult. It's true that the officer has no obligation to show the arrestee the text of the statute, but the arrestee will come away from their encounter informed of the exact statutes they are accused of violating. The arrestee can then research the statutes and decide whether to plead guilty or not guilty.


    How can a person be expected to come to court and make an informed decision about whether to plead guilty or not guilty without being given the opportunity to know exactly what they are being accused of? That doesn't make sense.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2019

  10. Larry,

    Starting in the 1970’s, a person sent in an application for a Wis. “Collector” plate with the fee and received the plate as long as all WISDMV requirements were met. No photos of the vehicle required.

    Some time ago, WISDMV began requiring photos of the vehicle as part of the application process. A few years ago, WISDMV stopped requiring photos.

    Although WISDMV has stopped requiring photos of the vehicle as part of the “Collector” plate application process, they are able to request photos after application because of Wis ss341.08 (2) (e)

    WIS ss341.08Application for registration.
    (e) Such further information as the department may reasonably require to enable it to determine whether the vehicle is by law entitled to registration or to enable it to determine the proper applicant or registration fee for the vehicle.

    If WISDMV is requesting photos of all vehicles as part of the current “Collector” plate application process, I don’t know. If your vehicles were purposefully or randomly selected for sending in photos only DMV knows.

    Your comment “My 36 Plymouth , 51 Merc and 55 Chevy are all modified body and drive train wise that they are beyond the scope of collector plates. I have never been bother by the police for any of them, just don't want to make a mistake if I decide to reregister them with hobby plates. “ can lead you to applying for “Hobbyist” plate which will require you to chose how you want your title branded “reconstructed”, “homemade”, “replica” or “street modified”. When you have applied for a “Hobbyist” plate, the WISDMV “special titles” processor can request an inspection of your vehicle by Wis State Patrol, just because they can and have many times. At the time of the inspection WSP will inspect your vehicle for proper vehicle equipment, VIN location and accuracy and did you chose the proper “title brand” for the vehicle. If the vehicle fails any part of the inspection or the Inspector disagrees with your choice of title brand, your current registration can be suspended meaning the vehicle can not be operated on Wisconsin roads and highways, legally, anymore.

    You said “reregister” means to me those 3 vehicles are currently registered and can be driven. Applying for a “Hobbyist” plate may change that situation.

    If WSP can prevent a modified vehicle from getting a title or license plates, they have kept the vehicle off the road.

    Curt R
     
    0NE BAD 51 MERC likes this.

  11. Wis ss347.05  Reciprocity agreements as to equipment.
    (1)  The secretary, with the approval of the governor, is authorized to enter into reciprocal agreements with the duly authorized representatives of other jurisdictions exempting the residents of those jurisdictions from details of vehicle equipment requirements of this state which are particularly burdensome to residents of such other jurisdictions operating vehicles in this state, provided the law of such other jurisdiction requires vehicles to be equipped in a manner rendering them substantially as safe as those equipped in the manner required by the laws of this state. The agreements shall provide substantially like exemptions for residents of this state when operating vehicles in such other jurisdiction.
    (2) This section does not authorize reciprocity agreements as to laws governing the size and weight of vehicles.

    Curt R
     
  12. hotrod428
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 260

    hotrod428
    Member

    It is mainly the state police, I live on a state highway and there is hardly a day that I don't see a patrol car along the road.
     
  13. GTS225
    Joined: Jul 2, 2006
    Posts: 1,065

    GTS225
    Member

    RE; Curt R's last. Whether or not there are reciprocity agreements, the LEO's could still issue citations, and the vast majority of the cited will just pay the fine, rather than return to fight it. That makes it a fund drive. As for me, I will come back up and present my case, if nothing else to let the judges know that the practice is, or will be, costing Wisconsin a fair amount of dollars in lost tourism revenue.

    Roger
     
  14. Below is Trans 305.04 Penalty section.
    I don't know if the fine would be up to $200.0 per fender or up to $200.0 for no fenders. The Dodgeville court will determine the fine if Brad is found guilty of a fender violation.

    The first guy, Mark, was given a 10 day fix it ticket for no fenders. He did not put on fenders and WISDMV suspended his registration meaning no plates, no driving.

    Usually if you don't comply with a 10 day fix it ticket the leo changes the ticket to an actual violation then comes the $ fine.

    Curt R


    Trans 305.04 Penalty. Unless a different penalty is provided by statute, any violation of this chapter shall be punishable as prescribed in s. 110.075 (7), Stats.
    Any person producing, manufacturing or using an inspection sticker or causing the same to be done to subvert the provisions of this section shall forfeit not less than $100 nor more than $500. Any persons otherwise violating this section, s. 110.06, ch. 347 or rules issued pursuant thereto, unless otherwise provided by statute, shall forfeit not less than $10 nor more than $200.
    History: Cr. Register, February, 1996, No. 482, eff. 3-1-96.

    Oh yes and they have.
    If you are out of state and coming to Wisconsin copy the Reciprocity Statute I posted above keep it in the car. Curt R
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
    racer-x likes this.
  15. Kan Kustom
    Joined: Jul 20, 2009
    Posts: 2,205

    Kan Kustom
    Member

    Going to Wisconsin to visit the Harley Davidson plant and museum has always been one of the few things on my bucket list and I am sure there are many others that were planning this as well. I just now checked it off. Will not go now. I feel for you guys up there. Seems to be a very narrow minded and poorly ran state.
     
    racer-x likes this.
  16. a boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,884

    a boner
    Member

    The city of Madison, the state Capitol and headquarters of the Wisconsin State Patrol, is often referred to as 25 square miles surrounded by reality.
     
    Kan Kustom, justabeater37 and racer-x like this.
  17. scoop
    Joined: Jul 4, 2001
    Posts: 1,171

    scoop
    Member

    I was planning on going Mississippi Mayhem again this year, maybe not.
     
  18. Chainsaw chipper
    Joined: Nov 29, 2007
    Posts: 62

    Chainsaw chipper
    Member
    from Illinois

    Looks like a nice drive to Iola in my hot rod is off the table for now along with my plans to retire up there,for now at least.Better to know now than after I get too far a long.I have'nt worked my whole life planning to enjoy my cars on the back roads of Wisconson only to have our stuff taken away.Hope the powers to be see what they are doing.There are other places to spend time and money without getting harassed.
     
  19. Are there more recent cases like Brads? Is this just a one off case that some hot headed WSP wrote a ticket for?
    Do we really believe that WSP is telling all the troopers that the weather is getting warmer and them horrible hot rodders will be out driving there fenderless cars and we need to ticket them.
    I see the need to follow Brads issue, show support if possible, and get the situation of fenderless cars defined. But I gotta say, I can't believe fenderless cars is that much of an issue that the WSP is going out of there way to ticket them.
     
  20. 0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Joined: Nov 12, 2010
    Posts: 859

    0NE BAD 51 MERC
    Member

    Curt , Thanks again for the additional info. The three cars I mentioned are registered with Vanity plates and have been for years. Those plates as everyone knows , have an annual renewal fee. I was think of switching to the hobby plates to save some money in the long run. The Plymouth and the Merc are chopped and have some other custom body mods. the 55's body is basicly stock. But all three have had major drive train and chassis modifications done to them. Looks like I best leave sleeping dogs lie and pay the annual renewal on the vanity plates. Thanks again Larry
     
  21. I know of a elected official who is hot rod friendly. his name is van wangard. he represents my area. he is a retired city of racine police investigator. maybe he can get us some help with this? When he was putting his re election sign in my front yard last fall he told me if I need anything to give him a call. maybe that time is now. yes he was a cop but also one of the best traffic investigators out there. I used to ride along with him. he got me out of some problems with the da when I was a young hot rodder
     
    David Gersic, Blues4U, Curt R and 3 others like this.
  22. Speed~On
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 1,116

    Speed~On
    Member

    I contacted my State Rep this afternoon in regards to this issue. I was going to make a post on this thread, but have commitments this evening. I will update this thread when I get home with very useful information. My conversation went very well with my Rep. They said this is an issue they will certianly assist us with.
     
    Curt R, Max Gearhead, racer-x and 3 others like this.
  23. GTS225
    Joined: Jul 2, 2006
    Posts: 1,065

    GTS225
    Member

    *****************************************************************************************

    Curt; thanks for that reciprocity statute, (post #133), but it only indicates that the secretary is authorized to enter into agreements with other states. It makes no mention as to whether there are agreements in place with say, Iowa, Illinois, or Minnesota. I suspect that may take a bit more research to find that out. I may just have to send an inquiry to my state house to ask.

    Roger
     
  24. chop job
    Joined: Feb 16, 2013
    Posts: 438

    chop job
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    Get over it and deal with it!!! It's not the end of the world. giphy (1).gif
     
    H380 likes this.
  25. We are dealing with it. We are starting to organize and get informed. As a group we are more powerful. Chop job if you have nothing to offer move on to another thread.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2019

  26. Roger,
    Your right.

    I jumped the gun on posting the Reciprocity Statute. I wanted to contact our Secretary of Transportation to see if their is an agreement with other States. I will make the contact.

    Good idea about contacting your State House, let us know what you find out.

    Curt R
     
  27. gene-koning
    Joined: Oct 28, 2016
    Posts: 1,137

    gene-koning
    Member

    I'll be watching this. Looks like I will be driving my coupe in WI rather then my fenderless pickup, until I hear of a favorable outcome.

    I have to wonder if this is not a case of the cop pulling the guy over for some other reason, but then wrote this ticket because the cop got po'ed with the driver and this ticket means more hardship for the driver then the 1st reason he was pulled over. Wouldn't have been the 1st time for something like that.

    Would be a great cash cow until it gets challenged in court, and makes it though the system. Even then, it may take several court challenges before a decision is made one direction or the other. Between now and then, many unsuspecting hot rodders will pay the ticket. Gene
     
  28. scoop
    Joined: Jul 4, 2001
    Posts: 1,171

    scoop
    Member

    Maybe shows like Mississippi Mayhem and Symco should jump on the bandwagon and talk to their local reps,This could possibly hurt their shows.I hope not. I'm thinking twice about it.
     
  29. GTS225
    Joined: Jul 2, 2006
    Posts: 1,065

    GTS225
    Member

    ********************************************************************

    Thanks again. I'll get a message sent off, or make a phone call. It might be even better for us out-of-state rodders to have both the WI and our home state agreements with us. If we get stopped anyway, the trooper is going to understand right off that we are prepared for just such a problem, and he or the court will have a full plate making the citation stick.

    Roger
     
  30. a boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,884

    a boner
    Member

    There are 2 car show going on at Wisconsin Dells on May 17-18-19. I would assume that the WSP will be there. We should be able to see how the DOT rules are getting enforced. This weekend might give us a clue on how intense things will be on the roads in Wisconsin this summer.
     

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