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Technical another over heating issue

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Karl M, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Well I went to OReilly's and checked out their pressure tester. I pumped it up to 11 psi. The rad cap says 7psi on it so I was afraid to go any higher than 11 psi. Not sure if that is the correct psi cap. Any way it dropped 1 psi in 21 minutes. What do you think? One psi could be do to a ware and tare on the seals of the tester maybe...? Not sure if I should pump it up to 15 psi, don't want to create a leak...
     
  2. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 25,888

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My thought when you said it heats up and pukes at road speed. That looks like a real new or fresh rebuilt water pump. Do you know what year model of engine it was bought for?
    First time I saw it happen someone had stuck a 327 in an 81/82 Camaro and sold it and someone else put a water pump for the 82 Camaro on it while the engine had V belts. Got hot the minute you got on the road but It would idle for a bit before getting hot.
    Just thinking, if you can read the casting number on the pump that may give you some indication.
    Easy to see what the coolant flow from it is if you drop the coolant level down closer to the top of the core, That radiator needs expansion room in the tank anyhow or it will puke coolant when it it starts to build pressure and there is no air to compress in the tank.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
    Karl M likes this.
  3. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 25,888

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I don't see an issue with 1 psi in 21 minutes.
     
    Karl M likes this.
  4. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 43,943

    squirrel
    Member

    the important thing is that you don't smell exhaust gas in the radiator. They usually stink when the head gasket pops.
     
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  5. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    The pump that came with it went bad or was bad. This is the same replacement pump I bought and put on it. I'll pull the old one apart and take a look.
     
  6. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 43,943

    squirrel
    Member

    what is the part number? you must still have the box or the receipt? :)
     
  7. jeffd1988
    Joined: Apr 12, 2016
    Posts: 536

    jeffd1988

    That shroud sux... Take that pusher off put a better shroud should help alot. Vapor lock is obvious on that thing. Reroute that fuel line more toward the front than having it above the exhaust. Problem should be solved. If still over heat go back to timing like Jim says. 34' at 3k rpm.

    Sent from my Z981 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    Karl M likes this.
  8. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 3,092

    southcross2631
    Member

    Just did the 350 engine in a 57 Chevy. Ran perfect ,but could not keep water in it. Had the late model lightweight # 624 casting heads and when it got warm the cracked head starting pumping exhaust into the coolant and it got hot. No bubbles in the radiator. Tried every trick in the book. finally gave up an pulled it apart and found 2 small cracks in the combustion chamber.
    Built a new short block with fresh 882 heads and same water pump ,radiator, electric fan, thermostat and it runs for hours at 180 in Florida. It is hot every day here.
     
    Atwater Mike and Karl M like this.
  9. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    No smells. Here are a few more pics of the rad, best I could get. Thanks for every ones help. IMG_2192.JPG IMG_2194.JPG IMG_2197.JPG IMG_2198.JPG
     
  10. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 43,943

    squirrel
    Member

    It's a short water pump, and it's not aluminum, so it should not be reverse rotation. afaik.

    The radiator looks kind of small, to me. But I live in AZ, so I see things a bit differently.
     
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  11. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Las Cruces NM here. Finally got some rain to get us out of the triple digits. I could fab a bracket for a bigger rad if needed, not a lot of room there. There is a bit of sludge in the overflow bottle. If I pull the electric fan off and relocate the tranny cooler I may as well run some clr through it...what do you think?
     
  12. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 43,943

    squirrel
    Member

    I don't know. Do the tubes in the radiator look plugged?
     
  13. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    No I took it to a shop and he pressure tested it and back washed it and he said it had great flow. I am wondering if the water ports/jackets on the heads are plugged... Coarse it could be several things combined I guess.
     
  14. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

  15. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 25,888

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I don't like running them with at least the gutted shell of the thermostat in them to slow the coolant down a bit but if you drop the level down to about 1/2 inch off the top of the core can you see a good coolant flow when you run it? If everything is working and the pump is pumping right you should be able to see good coolant movement on top of the core. Years ago I saw a rebuilt pump that had the impeller spin on the shaft and not pump water but that is pretty rare. Some Joe Cheap new or rebuilt pumps don't have much of an impeller in them either.
     
  16. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 43,943

    squirrel
    Member

    normal 1960s style short pump. normal rotation.
     
  17. jeffd1988
    Joined: Apr 12, 2016
    Posts: 536

    jeffd1988

    I wonder if the heater core is plugged ? Have you looked at that? Also have you replace all your hoses. And that radiator looks small because of that bootsie band strap shroud. With that 18 inch fan. Sheesh also I'm looking at the pics and the bottom radiator hose looks like it could be kinked right were the water pump is. or I'm seeing it like that because of Shadow. Escuse me I'm using my phone so pics are smaller no zoom. Also when the motor warm up those hoses get soft and I'm wondering if it kinks out on you and your not noticing the hoses. Also if those are fine. Take your temp sensor off the intake and test it or if you have a spare one laying around hook it up and see if it read the same. Could be bad temp sensor.

    Sent from my Z981 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  18. Karl, if it has not been done, take the radiator to a radiator shop and have it rodded out. They remove the top and bottom tanks, run a rod of some kind through each tube and reassemble. The ONLY way I know to be CERTAIN the radiator is clean.
    Earlier, someone suggested using a "laser" thermometer to measure the radiator temp. If you have not done so, please do. Check top and bottom in several places. Post the temps here.

    Ben
     
  19. A little off the subject... but the gas filter gives me the "willys". I never use plastic ones and never route one across the exhaust manifold like that.
     
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  20. Given how tight the engine compartment is, and we haven't seen photos of the lower rad hose...is it possible that it is collapsing?
     
  21. Joliet Jake
    Joined: Dec 6, 2007
    Posts: 485

    Joliet Jake
    Member
    from Jax, FL

    Speaking of "willys", see the $2.00 glass one below the plastic one? Had that exact type break while my car was running inside my garage, almost cost me 3 cars and a house. Never plastic and never glass.
     
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  22. justpassinthru
    Joined: Jul 23, 2010
    Posts: 219

    justpassinthru
    Member

    Unless I missed it in one of the posts, what size pulleys are on the crank and water pump? Its hard to tell from the photos but the water pump pulley looks somewhat large in diameter.
    We run into this quite a bit. Folks will use performance ratio pulleys (smaller diameter crank and larger diameter water pump) and the car will overheat due to the water pump not turning fast enough. Always use stock diameter pulleys.
    We will change them back to stock diameters and 99% of the time the cooling issues go away.
    Just a thought.
    Bill
     
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  23. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 5,930

    BJR
    Member

    Take a good look at the lower radiator hose, rev the engine with it hot and watch the lower hose and see if it gets sucked together. Should have a spring inside of the lower hose to prevent it from collapsing.
     
  24. Good eye, I missed it. I did a lot of stock car racing and became keenly aware of what can give you a DNF for the night. I bring that mindset into anything I build for the street.
     
    Atwater Mike likes this.
  25. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Thanks for all the great input. To much fun going through and fixing the PO modso_O. Yes the fuel line/ filters will be remedy soon. I watched the radiator shop guy pressure test the rad and no leaks. He back flushed it and said it had great flow. He said it did not need to be rodded out. He did say old antifreeze globs came out, like little bbs of jello.
    I am wondering if the PO put in orange anti freeze and I topped off with green, hopefully not. The bottom hose and top are new. They both have wire in them. Bottom one is not kinked, just a very tight fit. I am not sure on the size of the of the fan pully? Any ideas on what that should be? I did back flush the heater core when I flushed the entire system before taking the rad to the shop. Maybe I need to do it again.... I do see fluid movement in the top of the rad with cap off. It does not seem to make an difference with or without the new thermostat. Supposedly the water pump is new and not rebuilt... And we go...
    .
     
  26. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Thanks, I will try this. It did not have a spring in it so I inserted one before I installed it.
     
  27. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Great, good to know, how do I figure what is stock for this set up?
     
  28. justpassinthru
    Joined: Jul 23, 2010
    Posts: 219

    justpassinthru
    Member

    If the water pump pulley is larger in diameter than the crank pulley, the water pump is under driven. Hence the term "under drive pulleys".
    Generally small block Chevys have a crank pulley around 7" in diameter and a water pump pulley around 6 1/4 ". Under drive pulleys are around 5 3/4" for the crank and 6 1/4' for the water pump.
    I'm sure there are other diameter setups also, with ac/without, different years etc.
    Most factory setups have the water pump overdriven, (larger crank pulley-smaller water pump pulley).
    Hope this helps.
    Bill
     
  29. robtlor
    Joined: Dec 7, 2010
    Posts: 118

    robtlor
    Member
    from Lincoln NE

    Probably not the problem, but 7 lbs cap seams low. Maybe a 14lbs. This would raise the boiling point of coolent.
     
    Karl M likes this.
  30. Karl M
    Joined: Jul 19, 2017
    Posts: 99

    Karl M

    Did a quick measurement this morning...Crank pulley aprox 6 5/8, water pump pulley 7 inches. I'll take a closer look tonight, but the h2o pulley is bigger. will check Oreilly's tonight for a smaller one or junk yard. Go figure just put a new belt on.
     

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