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Projects ain't roller paint great

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by himjively, Sep 28, 2009.

  1. i know the car is a late model an not hamb material, but i hope this is worth a look, I had been reading a lot on the internet about roller painted cars. My daily driver was really starting to bother me with it's blochy worn out factory paint job, bad primer in the 90's i have been told.
    Not wanting to pay $400 bucks for an average looking paint shop job, i looked to a homemade job. Since blowing paint with a compressor in the driveway seemed a little uncomfortable, I opted to try the hand painted method.
    I could not find a local shop that carried John Deere tractor black and I did'nt know if i wanted to bother dropping 40 bucks on good car enamel. I've painted my metal shed and my oil tank with Rustoleum. So I opted for a quart of satin black Rustoleum outdoor enamel at 8 bucks.
    Rain was forecast for 9 pm on saturday so i got started wet sanding the old finish at 8 am. note to Scarry Larry - your Jalopy Showdown stickers are very durable. I had to sand them and the car lot logo down to bare metal. I primed the bloches with 2 sprays of black rattle can primer. After more sanding I put down the first coat with foam brushes, my next coat and all the other coats i will do will be by foam roller (much better plan). But keep some brushes handy for tight corners and body indents. The first coat was thinned with acetone (about 30 percent acetone to 70 percent rusto) which went down a little thick, but i am not shy about sanding and i wanted good coverage to protect against the elements. My second coat was about 40 percent acetone to 60 percent paint. My next coats will be about 60 percent acetone.
    The Rustoleum dried very quickly in the overcast 60 degree weather and I was able to get the primer and 2 coats of paint down before i had to go to work at 5.
    i think it looks a lot better than the old paint. sorry for the small photos, i am having trouble with my photo bucket link. On close inspection you can see the over lapping strokes, but i hope more wet sanding and thinner layers will eleviate some of the strokes.
    If you have the garage to use a sprayer, it is still most likely a smoother job, but so far i have about 40 bucks in the job, including the thrush sticker I got for the window. add another can of Rustoleum that I will most likely buy. But if you want a little adventure, I testify that the roller paint jobs on the internet are not urban legend.
    We will see how it holds up to another tuff Philly winter, but by spring i will be looking for a late 50s early 60s beater with bad paint to park in my driveway for another paint job.
    Will post more when I get another day to lay more coats.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Old61
    Joined: Sep 20, 2008
    Posts: 268

    Old61
    Member
    from PA

    Heat decals with a hairdryer then peel them off. Any citrus based cleaner will dissolve the residue. Tuff to say from the pic, but it looks like the hood needed more sanding. Paint is 99% prep.
    If the base is failing, the new paint will fail too.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2009
  3. BigChief
    Joined: Jan 14, 2003
    Posts: 2,042

    BigChief
    Member

    Do a search. You can do professional level paint jobs here for 300 bucks. MAX. ;)

    Looks like you still need more prep work, cut down on the acetone and try switching to lacquer thinner....it'll dry faster than if you use enamal reducer but not so fast that it won't flow out a little bit (acetone dries very fast and makes the paint look dry). Mix a small amount and do a test panel before using the thinner....back in the old days with older enamel formulations you could use this trick on things like tractors/farm impliment and ,uhhhh, OT cars like yours and get away with something reasonable....but not with a roller.

    Good luck with it.
     
  4. Goozgaz
    Joined: Jan 11, 2005
    Posts: 2,557

    Goozgaz
    Member

    I love posting this.

    100% roller painted. Been sitting outside with no cover for at least 6 months now. Never even buffed/polished the final coat... just some wax in a can like any other paint job.

    Looks great, super durable, hasn't lost it's shine. And when I dropped my garage door on the hood (stupid) it scratched but I was able to repair the spot in about 1hr with a little scuff and roll.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I would never do it again on a large project becuase it was time consuming ... but I did it purely for the experience. It was well worth it for me.
     
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  5. american opel
    Joined: Dec 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,222

    american opel
    Member
    from ohio

    i have done this a couple of times and they dont turn out bad.just make sure when you use lac.thin. dont use too much because it likes to fisheye!!acetone dries too fast and you will lose some shine.also make sure you dont wax it for a lOOOOOOONG time,it will stick to the enamel.if it does fade i use to spray some wd40 and it looked great till the dirt stuck but man did it make it shine.have fun!!
     
  6. bobj49f2
    Joined: Jun 1, 2008
    Posts: 1,786

    bobj49f2
    Member

    Don't use lacquer thinner if you have already applied paint to the car. The lacquer thinner will lift the paint. I worked in a body shop that we used lacquer thinner to thin acrylic enamel but only over factory baked on paint. We used the lacquer thinner for quickie panel repair jobs we wanted to turn around in a day because the lacquer thinner would make the paint dry faster. Once in a while we'd spray it on a car that we thought were factory original only to find out the panel was repainted and the paint lifted.
     
  7. the truck looks great, my paint job was easy because i used black over black, i think white was a more ambitious job, what color was it?
    You guys are right I have a lot of sanding to do. What I like about this method is i can work on it and drive it, than work on it more. Now I know how I maintain the finish will be important. After giving it months to cure, can you use paste wax on satin finish or will it suck up too much wax?
    thanx for all the info
    that's what this website is great at.
    please post more hand painted projects
     
  8. bobj49f2
    Joined: Jun 1, 2008
    Posts: 1,786

    bobj49f2
    Member

    This subject was kind of covered in a recent thread about spraying Rustoleum. To speed the drying time and increase durability you can add a hardener, I use Valspar hardener in all the oil based oil I spray. I would also suggest if you haven't already bought your paint to use Valspar paint. They make a John Deere satin black. I have found Valspar dries a lot faster than Rustoleum and is more durable.

    One major warning if you use the hardener, even if you roll it on, use a respirator. The vapors given off by the hardener will screw up you lungs. It's somewhat like super glue and does some very nasty things to the tissues of your lungs.
     
  9. flynbrian48
    Joined: Mar 10, 2008
    Posts: 6,147

    flynbrian48
    Member

    I don't really mean to burst your bubble, but that Bonneville doesn't really look any better in the after photo. I learned how roll enamel (and spar varnish) once I got a Chris Craft. I use tractor enamel on the bottom of my boat, rolled. You need to use GOOD reducer, no more than 10%, not laquer thinner, not acetone. One coat will cover, it'll dry slow enough to flow out, you'll have a job that has no more orange peel than a sprayed job. Roll it, black foam rollers, not napped ones, tip it IMMEDIATELY with a foam brush. ALWAYS roll to a wet edge, and as with any paint job, it's only as good as the prep. I'm not say'n, I'm just say'n...
     
  10. zman
    Joined: Apr 2, 2001
    Posts: 16,557

    zman
    Member
    from Garner, NC

    yep... :rolleyes:
     
  11. MarkzRodz
    Joined: Sep 12, 2009
    Posts: 533

    MarkzRodz
    BANNED

    Thats funny I'm still looking for the "After" picture,,,did I miss something?
     
  12. again thanx for all the suggestions
    this was a good practice before starting on a project car
    i will save a lot on sandpaper next time
     
  13. Shifty Shifterton
    Joined: Oct 1, 2006
    Posts: 4,965

    Shifty Shifterton
    Member

    A satin black late model looks way worse than a peeling paint late model. You also just tagged it with a big sign asking to be pulled over. Cops don't like road warriors, car thieves, & tweekers, and you just identified yourself as one of those groups

    The whole point of sanding roller paint is to get a smooth base to allow a gloss finish to come thru without texture. By using satin finish you're completely missing the point and doing a shitload of sanding for no reason. The non-gloss surface won't show the orange peel.

    Switch to a gloss finish and you might be onto something. Current path is an exercise in futility. Just an opinion from a guy that's done a bunch of similar shortcut paintjobs. Good luck either way
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2009
  14. OldsGuy
    Joined: Aug 12, 2005
    Posts: 425

    OldsGuy
    Member

    My son has painted part of his OT '71 Olds 98 so I cut/pasted this thread for his information. He asked me to cut/paste his questions here since he is not a member, so here they are.....

    "That is interesting. Can you respond to this post for me?

    I want to know what a "reducer" is. Flynbrian48 mentioned it. Is Odorless Mineral Spirits a reducer?

    Plus, Shifty Shifterton mentioned to use a gloss paint but was sort of unclear (maybe I'm just reading it wrong). Do you want to use gloss, or do you want to use flat/stain? I'm using Rust-O-Leum primer and it looks horrible after 6 or 7 coats and lots and lots of sanding in between coats. If I need to use a Rust-O-Leum gloss color then do I need to spray normal primer on it first, or do I just put the gloss Rust-O-Leum straight on the bare metal?

    That truck Goozgaz did with a roller looks awsome! Is he sure he didn't use a HVLP gun? I've seen numerous pictures like that on the internet. However, from my experience so far I don't think it is attainable. I've sanded, sanded, and sanded. Oh, by the way, did I mention I sanded? If they say preperation is 90% of the job then apparently I'm applying the paint wrong because it still looks WT. It has horrible orange peel after each coat.

    I've been mixing the Rust-O-Leum with a 50% mixture of Mineral Spirits (50 mL paint, and 25 mL Mineral Spirits). Is this too much or too little Mineral Spirits? Plus, I've already used half a can of Rust-O-Leum primer on my nose piece alone. At this rate it will take at least 15 cans of paint to cover the entire car.

    Plus, are you supposed to use a new roller for each coat or can you use one roller for the entire car? I've been rolling out the excess paint of my roller once I'm done and letting it sit lightly in the paint tray. Then I use it again the next evening (I average 2 or 3 coats per evening).

    Thanks,"
     
  15. I think it will take good sanding and thin coats of gloss to get a totally smooth surface. I don't think I will get a nice sheen with the satin, I'm not a big fan of shiny black, so I will live with the imperfections.
    What I really like about HAMBers is the willingness to do things a different way
    and to be more creative.
     
  16. cruzn52
    Joined: Apr 17, 2007
    Posts: 9

    cruzn52
    Member
    from Missouri

    Here is my recent 50 dollar roller job. I read about it somewhere and decided to give it a go. I am quite pleased with the results. I have not even wet sanded yet and could do that to knock off some of the peel but I am happy with it. [​IMG]
     
  17. what paint and what did you thin with?
     
  18. cruzn52
    Joined: Apr 17, 2007
    Posts: 9

    cruzn52
    Member
    from Missouri

    In response to Oldsguy's questions here is my experience.
    At first I tried using a set percentage of mineral spirits to rust oleum. I found this did not work and was hard to keep consistent. What worked best for me was to put a little paint in those 1 dollar measuring pails and then add thinner until the consistency was about the same as water/skim milk. It takes some time but you can get the feel for it. When stirring also you get the feel for what is too thick.
    I used a new 4" foam roller per job with a new tray for each coat. I did a total of 6 coats.
    1st step I sanded the car with 330 grit with just a ryobi orbital sander and then cleaned off with mineral spirits.
    I then applied the first coat very thin like water. It is thin enough where it just wants to start to run but does not.(sometimes it will though if pressing too hard)
    After each coat I let it dry 24 hours. The directions said to sand but my 52 is a big car and I did not want to sand. I wet sanded the roof once after the 4th coat but that is all. I also wet sanded a few areas where dog hair my have landed.

    When applying the paint I would roll it on with light to firm pressure and do an area about 12 inches wide. I would then go back over the area a few more times to try and smooth out the application as much as possible. I did try using a brush at first after I rolled it on to smooth out the bubbles but I do not advise this, it shows some streaks and is hard to get coverage.
    Here is my car before the paint.
    [​IMG]

    All in all I am very pleased with the results and this is with no wet sanding except for once on the roof. I could wet sand to get a smoother finish but I am happy with it.
    I am by no means a professional body man and this was my first attempt at ever painting my car. I only spent around 70 dollars for all the materials. The big part is labor, each coat took me about 1.5 hrs to apply.
    The paint will thicken up some in the tray as you roll so I only did enough for about one body panel each time
    side note**Different color paints thicken at different rates. I practiced with the sail blue and it was very hard to keep thin. The smoke gray was very easy to work with.
    Sorry for the long post but just want to share my experience with people looking for a cheap alternative that you can do in your garage. Also the smell was not bad at all.
     
  19. cruzn52
    Joined: Apr 17, 2007
    Posts: 9

    cruzn52
    Member
    from Missouri

    i thinned with ace hardware 100% mineral spirits and used basic rust oleum smoke gray. Not the professional series.
     
  20. I'm seeing some nice results, back to more sanding
     

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  21. onlychevrolets
    Joined: Jan 23, 2006
    Posts: 2,307

    onlychevrolets
    Member

    A buddy in out club has a 35 Ford painted black with a brush and it looks good...its not perfect but for what it cost it looks fine. You can see it on the Redneck Rumble thread.
     
  22. SlowandLow63
    Joined: Sep 18, 2004
    Posts: 5,953

    SlowandLow63
    Member
    from Central NJ

    I think 29Nash has really made his mark on this board...

    Hahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D Made my day!
     
  23. Well another coat, sanding, I sprayed some of the blotchy areas with asatin black rustoleum spray can, then another roller coat of 60% thinner and 40% paint, sanding with finishing paper, then a final roller coat. The surface is very smooth and relatively streak free.[​IMG][​IMG]
     
  24. It was a fun project but NOT a replacement for a professional paint job. The surface does not seem super durable but will touch up pretty easy with a brush and some light sanding. The real test will be this winter with road salt.
    A lot of the sites I visited had pix of roller painted cars after a year but pictures can hide lots of flaws. I will add to this post after a year for an honest assesement.
    I have also heard that other paints will not adhere to the surface of rustoleum unless you strip off all the coats.
    Again sorry for the late model car, this summer I may get an older car and try a more ambitious color and some better car enamel. If there are any old threads on how to care for semi gloss or flat paint please let me know or if anyone has info I could use some help.
     
  25. jville_hot_skater
    Joined: Apr 9, 2009
    Posts: 1,001

    jville_hot_skater
    Member
    from jville

    dont appreciate the car you posted...but its a inspiring thread.
    i love brush paint look on classic cars, my coupe is brushed and personally i think its more traditional look.
     
  26. do you have to take any special care to preserve the finish?
     
  27. plym49
    Joined: Aug 9, 2008
    Posts: 2,798

    plym49
    Member
    from Earth

    I think you thinned the paint too much. The car looks more stained than painted. It's the pigments that provide protection so at this rate you might need quite a few more coats.

    Don't wax satin paint. If you want to be old school, wipe it down with a 50:50 mix of kerosene and water.

    Rustoleum probably will not hold up very well. Valspar or something like Benjamin Moore Industrial Coating Alkyd Enamel (available in satin black) might be a better choice.
     
  28. sorry I'm new to the whole self painting thing, is it unusual to add a new coats of paint thru out the life of a paint job, how much paint is too much?
    Can you expect to lose much of the layers do to wear and tear?
     
  29. Steelsmith
    Joined: Feb 5, 2007
    Posts: 581

    Steelsmith
    Member

    Hi Jimmy, just so you know, thinning paint is to be done only as much as needed to get the paint to flow/laydown without runs/sags. This varies depending on temperature/humidity, so you have to adjust accordingly. The comments you have gotten about your paint job looking a little thin, are due to over thinning. If you apply your paint, with less thinner you will get better coverage/richer color. You will find the thicker you use your paint, (less thinner added) the more texture you will end up with. Achieveing that balance between flow and coverage is what you are going for. Temperature will play a biger role as the temperature gets closer to 65 degrees. At that point the paint's cure cycle really slows down and you gain more flow. On the other end of the scale, temperatures above 90 degrees will make the paint setup too quickly, you will need a little more thinner, toulene to slow it down a bit.

    Dan Stevens
    dba, Steelsmith
     
  30. skullhat
    Joined: May 30, 2009
    Posts: 892

    skullhat
    Member



    apparently he has, lol...........these guys put him to shame though, much less money, and they look just as good

    i have to say, the pictured jobs dont look all that bad, at least in the pictures. and if the owners are happy, cool.

    at least nobody here is claiming they can match a $10,000 paint job with a roller,lol :eek:

    thanks for the response, these always bring a smile to my face




    skull
     

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