Register now to get rid of these ads!

A Dumb Ford pre-C4 question

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by need louvers ?, Jul 16, 2012.

  1. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,911

    need louvers ?
    Member

    Hi gang,

    Contrary to what many close friends will tell you, I am not a complete idiot! With that said, I have probably the stupidest question I have asked, 'cause I can't remember the answer.

    Some time around '64, Ford did away with that miserable excuse for an automatic trans, The Ford-O-Matic, and went to a 3 speed deal that was the precourser to the C4. I for the life of me can't remember what it was called. Even worse, instead of the shift quadrant having P,R,N,D,2,3 marking, this trans has a P,R,N,1,GREEN DOT,3 marking. I seem to remember that the green dot was "drive". I had one of these in the Falcon from '83 through about '91 when I mated a standard C4 to the weird bell housing (6 cylinder) and made it the standard pattern we know and love today. That's a long time ago, and I just can't remember the specifics. I really don't recomend that swap by the way, lots of weird machine work afoot.

    So am I right with the green dot being drive position on these? The girlfriend is looking at an O/T car, ( well, if you must know she wants a '65 or '66 6cylinder Mustang. Anybody got a nice one for cheap?!) and I saw the green dot the other night and it made me think.

    Thanks, Chip
     
  2. Fenders
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 3,922

    Fenders
    Member

    She wants a SIX cylinder Mustang?
    Quirky !!!
     
  3. TooManyFords
    Joined: May 21, 2008
    Posts: 553

    TooManyFords
    Member
    from Peotone IL

    I believe early C4s had that pattern.
     
  4. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,120

    squirrel
    Member

    Here's my really fuzzy recollection, I should look this stuff up because I probably have about seven mistakes here:

    C4 means 1964, that's the small 3 speed auto they came out with at that time. The predecessor was the 2 speed Fordomatic. There was also a 3 speed Cruisomatic some of them had only two shifter positions, L would get you 1st and 2nd, D would get you 2nd and 3rd.

    The green dot would start in 2nd and shift to 3rd, sort of imitating a powerglide.
     
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,911

    need louvers ?
    Member

    She's a quirky kinda gal... the Real reason is she is a damn cute 43 year old woman from Hong Kong. She drives very much like a 43 year old gal from Hong Kong... They don't make race drivers over there, so with her slower will be better. Mostly worried about how strong the left turn signal is!
     
  6. 40FordGuy
    Joined: Mar 24, 2008
    Posts: 2,908

    40FordGuy
    Member

    The "trade name was "Cruise-O-Matic" . The "starts in 2nd, shifts to 3rd" emulated the original Ford-O-Matics.

    4TTRUK
     
  7. When Ford first came out with an automatic transmission, it was called a Ford-O-Matic. It was an iron case transmission. It started off in second gear and shifted to third in the D position. You could shift to L for first gear manually. In 1958, Ford started using a sprag in the planetary and called the transmission a Cruise-O-Matic. The D position next to neutral started off in second gear and made a shift to third, just like a Ford-O-Matic, and you still had manual L for first gear. But, using the sprag, there was another D position (green dot) that started off in low, shifted to second, and shifted to third, all automatically.
     
  8. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 4,863

    Marty Strode
    Member

    If you shifted to the 'green dot', the vehicle would start in first and shift to second and to third. If you stated out in 'D', it would start in second and shift to third. I think it was intended for getting under way on slippery surfaces. Ford did the same thing in the pickups, my 65 f100 was that way until we installed a 67 "select shift" valve body.
     
  9. 58custom
    Joined: Jan 1, 2009
    Posts: 398

    58custom
    Member

    The Green dot C4 predated the 1967 Selec-Shift revision that gave you manual 1st, manual second and 1-2-3 drive.
     
  10. Kentuckian
    Joined: Nov 26, 2008
    Posts: 738

    Kentuckian
    Member

    When racing the cast iron Cruiseomatic the sequence went like this. Start in drive (green dot). As soon as the car moves place the shift lever manually into low position. Hold in low till desired RPM. Move shifter to drive and immediately put shift lever back in low position. This holds the transmission in second gear until desired RPM is reached. Move lever into drive and transmission would shift into high gear. Shifts were crisp and solid if the transmission was in good shape.
     
  11. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,911

    need louvers ?
    Member

    Thanks guys, it's nice to know I'm not loosing my mind completely!
     
  12. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,096

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Why not just start in L, then shift to green dot, then back to L, then back to green dot. Starting in green dot is same as starting in L, except you are using the sprag instead of the Lo/reverse band. Same 1st gear ratio.

    With the early Fordomatics 55 up, you could start in 1st by flooring the accelerator (while keeping the transmission in DR), keeping the accelerator floored it will shift up to 2nd, then 3rd. (They put the sprag in Studebakers that used this BW transmission to get a 1st gear start in DR) I believe the Ford equipped Fordomatics still used the Lo band for 1st, so they must have modified the valve body to get 1st with TV pressure at max.

    By turning the TV lever tighter, 1st gear could be had even at lower throttle positions. But it also moved the shifts up quite high.

    The later Fordomatics are 2 speed boxes that function more like a boat anchor, than a transmission.

    The 64-65 early C4's had the green dot pattern and functioned like the FMX Cruise-o-matic.
     
  13. junkyardjeff
    Joined: Jul 23, 2005
    Posts: 7,402

    junkyardjeff
    Member

    A 67 and up valve body will get a normal shift pattern on the 64 to 66 C-4s.
     
  14. big duece
    Joined: Jul 28, 2008
    Posts: 5,918

    big duece
    Member
    from kansas

    White is for snow, Green is for GO!
     
  15. jcm65
    Joined: Oct 8, 2008
    Posts: 31

    jcm65
    Member
    from Santa Rosa

    Cruise-o-Matic. It was P,R,N,White Dot, Green Dot, Low. White skipped 1st and started you out in 2nd. Green dot is the same as Drive and acts like a normal 3 speed.
    I had one and I bought a valve body for a '68 C4 and shifter. That fixes the whole green dot white dot and lets you downshift normally.
     
  16. Diavolo
    Joined: Apr 1, 2009
    Posts: 810

    Diavolo
    Member

    And here I was going to say FMX. I distinctly remember FMX not having all those buttons and stuff, so you other guys are probably right.
     
  17. need louvers ?
    Joined: Nov 20, 2008
    Posts: 12,911

    need louvers ?
    Member

    Sad to say, she went out and expressly to piss me off, bought a Honda... A fricken Honda!!! It's like driving an appliance at best. To her credit, we looked at about 23 '64-'66 Mustangs in the space of a month and found either way overpriced good stuff, or way overpriced junk. No in between. I however have gotten her '62 Falcon wagon on the road in the last couple of weeks, and her interest seems to be peaking a bit again. Soon I'll turn her loose for her first 30 mile one way commute in it and let's see how long that stupid Honda stays around. Wish me luck!
     
  18. wombat barf
    Joined: May 1, 2011
    Posts: 366

    wombat barf
    Member
    from oklahoma

    not to hijack the thread but can anyone tell me if this is a pre-C4 FoMoCo transmission that would bolt up behind the 260 in my '64 Fairlane? My '64 has a build date of October 24, 1963 so I know it it is pre-C4 and would love to replace the Ford-0-Matic 2 speed it's currently running.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Relic Stew
    Joined: Apr 17, 2005
    Posts: 1,123

    Relic Stew
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    That's an FMX, or FX, or MX, depending on year. Cast iron Cruise-O-Matic. Looks like the 5 bolt small block pattern. They have slightly less parasitic drag than the more popular C4, and a lot less than the C6. They are heavy, and harder to get performance parts for, but a good, durable transmission. The later AOD/4R70W overdrives were developed from that design.
     
  20. OLDSMAN
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,424

    OLDSMAN
    BANNED

    58 custom is correct. That is a C-4, the early ones had a valve body that allowed only those gears, and drive was a 1-2-3 shift
     
  21. wombat barf
    Joined: May 1, 2011
    Posts: 366

    wombat barf
    Member
    from oklahoma

    relic, thanks! are stocker rebuild kits & parts readily available for them?
     
  22. wombat barf
    Joined: May 1, 2011
    Posts: 366

    wombat barf
    Member
    from oklahoma

    here's a pic of the casting date on the bell housing if that helps....?

    [​IMG]
     
  23. wombat barf
    Joined: May 1, 2011
    Posts: 366

    wombat barf
    Member
    from oklahoma

    I had a rear man go out on my Fairlane. I'm thinking it's the ideal time to swap the Fordomatic for the FX. I got no clue as to how or why the previous owner pulled it out of the car but the remaining fluid doesn't smell burnt so I'm thinking put it in and try it out.

    is the Fordo linkage going to work at all on the green dot tranny?
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.