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Technical A-1 Cordone Parts Junk!!

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Beachboybob, Mar 18, 2020.

  1. town sedan
    Joined: Aug 18, 2011
    Posts: 1,290

    town sedan
    Member

    Years ago while working in a store that sold mostly to repair shops the conversation typically started out this way...
    "you want cheap or good?"
    -Dave
     
    Boss 302 Mustang likes this.
  2. You can run any CD ignition system, such as a Delta Mk10, without a condenser (capacitor), and it will work perfectly. The only thing you have to remember when you run the system this way, is that should it fail, you will not have the option of switching back to your original system.
    I have not tried running a points/condenser system without the condenser, but I would assume the current through the primary side would be approximately 2 amps, enough to pit the points fairly quickly.
    I have been using numerous point triggered CD systems for years, and point wear is virtually nil, (although they do require cleaning for oxidation) so you can operate the system with a clean old set of high quality points for a very long time. By keeping the points clean and greased, I used one set of points in a big block Chev for over 40 years.
    They performed flawlessly, and I tested them annually, by hooking my truck up to the scope of my auto analyzer.
    Bob
     
    VANDENPLAS likes this.
  3. bigdog
    Joined: Oct 30, 2002
    Posts: 564

    bigdog
    Member

    No one has mentioned the main reason the quality of parts has declined. It is you, the consumer. I've been in the parts business for 15 years now and most customers just want the cheapest part they can get. Cheap and quality don't go together. We sell an economy line and a name brand line on almost every part. Cheap outsells good twenty to one.
     
  4. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 4,216

    Budget36
    Member

    I kinda wonder about quality, there is only so many places that make stuff anymore, I assume most use the same stuff? If so (not knowing) I guess it's more of the assembly process?
     
  5. No offense bigdog, I don't mean to direct this specifically at you, but I'm so fking tired of hearing that bullshit story about how the customer is the problem with shit offshore parts.

    The customer wasn't in the board meeting when the company decided to offshore the production of their parts.
    The customer wasn't there when the company told its new manufacturer that absolute shit quality was "good enough".
    Once the parts are made offshore, does the board pass on the reduced manufacturing cost of the part? No.
    When you go online or into the parts store, and the clerk tells you $xx for the part do you pay it or cry and start bargaining like you're in some kind of street bazaar in India. I buy my parts and move on. Maybe the guy trying to patch up some front wheel drive pile of shit from 1985 wants the cheapest crap available. I don't. The problem is, these companies have sold their souls and now even their top level parts are offshore manufactured garbage.
    As far as the argument that china can make quality but we won't pay for it let's set one thing straight. NO company has their product produced in china because they're looking for higher quality. None, zero.
    What have these parts manufacturers received for their trouble? All of their intellectual property walked right out the back door of the chinese factory as soon as it arrived to be counterfeited and sold online as if it were a legit product. I remember several years ago the debacle with MSD crying that all the failures at the time were do to counterfeit product being sold out of china. What did that do to their reputation?
     
  6. primed34
    Joined: Feb 3, 2007
    Posts: 1,100

    primed34
    Member

    I've had issues with new brake parts lately and they were not cheap either. The have free replacement but why would I replace a shit part with another shit part. I've learned that just because you put on a new part and still have a problem doesn't mean that something else is wrong.
     
  7. lemondana
    Joined: Feb 21, 2009
    Posts: 108

    lemondana
    Member
    from Lincoln NE

    We have a shop here in Lincoln NE, called Fred's Auto Electric-they rebuild starters and alternators. I've never bought a Chinese one. Been very happy. Water pumps-I buy original equipment or NOS. I buy very little stuff from the big chain auto stores.
     
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  8. deathrowdave
    Joined: May 27, 2014
    Posts: 2,238

    deathrowdave
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from NKy

    When I was a line mechanic 40 plus years ago , my shop foreman would tear my azz up because , I would rebuild the starter or Alt. that came on the car or truck . I lost pay , because it took longer that just throwing on a rebuilt part . Even working in a dealer and working up to the parts counter did not get you a new OEM part . Same as has been discussed , the parts manager would , buy from a chain store and charge for OEM parts . I would get so mad , I said I’m done with cheating hard working Americans out of their money to install junk , to make a huge profit to the dealer’s managers bonus . I packed up my tools and headed to the Power Generation business . I think this business was near Uncle Sugar in business terms , unlimited funds so getting the best OEM parts was never a problem , the problem then became , no one knew how to work on the equipment . The bean counters , combined manager level jobs that were in charge of the budgets , so you end up with a boob that was in charge of a dispatch office telling a pipeliner , that he is costing to much money burning rods and tossing them with 3 inches remaining . Just cluster a F@##k x 10 . I had to be a licensed Stationary Engineer to operate or maintain any equipment , but my Boss telling me how he wants it done was nothing more than a Shit House Foreman ,answering to a $ sign . It all resorts back to $$ and how to cheat you out of your hard earned money to show a huge profit margin and gain a bonus . Good old America , is not as we remember it in the past , but it’s still a damn long way ahead of the number 2 inline to be the best .
     
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  9. town sedan
    Joined: Aug 18, 2011
    Posts: 1,290

    town sedan
    Member

    Unfortunately I've learned first hand that paying more for a part doesn't guarantee getting a better part. I've said it before and I'll say it again now, too many executives are more concerned with new furniture for the new lake house than selling quality merchandise.
    -Dave
     
  10. Pete Eastwood
    Joined: Jul 27, 2011
    Posts: 960

    Pete Eastwood
    Member
    from california

    Oh Great ! Yesterday I came home from the Auto Parts store with the master cylinder & calipers for my 34 truck project, & on the end of the boxes is " Cardone "
     
  11. anthony myrick
    Joined: Sep 4, 2009
    Posts: 6,146

    anthony myrick
    Member

    Been running their reman booster/ms assembly on my 67 for 4 years.
    The seal on the ms lid didn’t fit well. Other than that, works great.
    The autozone reman calipers on both my rides are working great. Got around 40k miles between the pair. No issues.
    The overseas wheel cylinders are doing the same.
    I have reman NAPA stuff in my bus, nearly 30k miles. No issues either.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2020
  12. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 4,414

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    It’s a crapshoot. I can buy a brand new Delco truck starter made in Mexico or China cheaper than I could have the original rebuilt. Matter of fact, it was the rebuilder that turned me onto that fact. He closed up shop for that reason. He told me he couldn’t make any money rebuilding them any more and sent me to the parts store. I hate it, I had used him for years, he was way cheaper for years on most starters and alternators, and could do stuff like my
    IH farm tractor that nobody else carried. Every one of the off shore Delco starters and alternators have lasted as long as the originals. So, you never know. All offshore stuff isn’t junk.
     
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  13. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 7,115

    jimmy six
    Member

    I've a little problem with what your saying after using my quote. I carry the points and condenser in the trunk of my car and could have them back in the distributor after removing the Pertronix ll unit in less than 30 minutes including retiming. If I dropped a screw maybe a little longer. I made no parts or altered any in the distributor as directed by Pertronix.
     
    uncle buck likes this.
  14. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 4,216

    Budget36
    Member

    One issue with buying rebuild kits locally when you need them (MC's/WC's, etc) is you kinda have to figure the parts used in the kit, are probably the same ones used in the MC/etc on the shelf.
     
  15. My comment did not have anything to do with the Pertronix unit, but with a CD ignition system using points. That is why I specifically referenced the Delta Mark 10. Other units where this method specifically applies are, the Heathkit, Tiger, and the Radio Shack CD boxes. If the capacitor is functional, and still in place, the system can normally be changed back to the standard system by a switch selection.
    I am not familiar with the Pertronix unit, but know it is not triggered with points, and therefore my comment does not apply to that system. There is more than one method of triggering a pointless electronic ignition system, such as Hall Effect triggering. Pertronix does not mention exactly how the system is triggered, except to state that it is a module.
    My comment does not apply to systems triggered by Hall Effect, or other electronic triggering systems.
    Bob
     
  16. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 7,115

    jimmy six
    Member

    you used my comment as a quote and I only mentioned a Pertronix unit. I understand CD units and using points as I raced with one in the 70’s.
     
  17. Beanscoot
    Joined: May 14, 2008
    Posts: 1,581

    Beanscoot
    Member

    "No one has mentioned the main reason the quality of parts has declined. It is you, the consumer. I've been in the parts business for 15 years now and most customers just want the cheapest part they can get. Cheap and quality don't go together. We sell an economy line and a name brand line on almost every part. Cheap outsells good twenty to one."

    Let's say I am looking at a particular tie rod end in Rockauto listings. There are for argument's sake twenty of them, cheap to expensive. Some are "daily driver" and some "premium" or similar terms. Nowhere is it stated what the difference in the parts is. If the "premium" one said that it has a grease nipple, hardened ball whereas the cheaper one didn't, then I may well buy the more expensive one.

    However with no detailed information, it's hard to justify spending more. I have the feeling that the same exact part is boxed in several different packages and logos at different prices, since the importer, reseller or whoever it is, knows that some people will feel they are getting a better part if they pay more.
     
  18. Rockauto is a perfect example. I just looked up tie rod ends for my off topic GMC daily driver truck.
    They list "Economy", "Daily Driver", and "Heavy Duty".
    The cheapest "Economy" brand was an "SKP" for $4.57
    The "Daily Driver" A/C Delco Professional was $28.79
    The "Heavy Duty" which was another off brand was actually a bit cheaper than the A/C Delco part.
    I bought the A/C Delco Professional parts. How could "SKP" design then manufacture a quality tie rod end, put it on a slow boat from china, truck it to a warehouse someplace in the US and everybody still make a profit?
    We all know the answer, they can't. In fact nobody could and that's why I won't buy it.
     
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  19. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 4,216

    Budget36
    Member

    It's all about volume, after cheap labor, shipping a container of stuff over, etc, all they want to do is make a few cents per part.

    Think of ordering a part/lamp/etc through Amazon. How do they get it to you in two days for the same price and anywhere else?
     
  20. I hear you on the volume thing but if my chinese amazon light bulb goes out I can screw in another one. If that Chinese tie rod end fails you've got an ass ache.
     
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  21. karl share
    Joined: Nov 5, 2015
    Posts: 103

    karl share
    Member

    cheap is not good
    good is not cheap
     
  22. Tri-power37
    Joined: Feb 10, 2019
    Posts: 510

    Tri-power37
    Member

    Working in a busy repair shop ( before the Covid outbreak) we go through a huge volume of auto parts. There is a large room full of delivered parts just waiting to go on customers cars. Most big shops have a agreement with their main parts supplier that all jobs that have to be redone because the part has failed - the parts supplier replaces the part and covers the labour on the re- do.

    So guess what happens - you get better quality parts but they are more expensive. And the amount of parts that fail is actually quite low.

    One thing I want to mention is that there is a huge amount of parts that are returned to autoparts stores either by auto repair businesses or over the counter sales and some people who have no morals will commit various forms of stealing or fraud with these parts and return them to the store. This can be everything from cleaning up a used part and returning it while using the new part or robbing some smaller part off of the part and returning it. Sometimes people just mix up parts - like left and right suspension parts and return them to the store.
    You just have to have a long hard look at the part when you pull it out of the box!
     
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  23. 49ratfink
    Joined: Feb 8, 2004
    Posts: 17,849

    49ratfink
    Member
    from California

    many moons ago I worked at the Grand Auto distribution center in Oakland. back in the core department it seemed there were just as many defective Cardone parts going back as there were cores. Grand Auto closed in 2000, and I can't see any reason they would have made it better since then.
     
    Tri-power37 likes this.
  24. Tri-power37
    Joined: Feb 10, 2019
    Posts: 510

    Tri-power37
    Member

    Yeah like we are all saying on this thread any auto parts salesperson must know what lines of parts are good and what are junk... just look at the return pile.
     
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  25. chucka
    Joined: Oct 29, 2018
    Posts: 16

    chucka

    China "can't" make quality? This virus thing seems to be working pretty good.
     
  26. town sedan
    Joined: Aug 18, 2011
    Posts: 1,290

    town sedan
    Member

    All you have to know anymore to be an auto parts professional is how to turn on a computer, be willing to work cheap and always be on the lookout for a "gig" that pays more.

    Before the bankers and wallstreeters collapsed the worlds economy for their fun and profit in 2008 auto parts sales was a good way to make living.
    -Dave
     
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  27. OLSKOOL57
    Joined: Feb 14, 2019
    Posts: 468

    OLSKOOL57
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Very Well Said! Thank You!
     
  28. I have a friend that worked in, and eventually managed, a large automotive parts outlet for over 40 years , and he was both happy and sad when he retired.
    He watched the industry evolve from a point where the parts man was a walking encyclopedia of parts information, to where the only thing the average parts person could do, was to look up the exact make and model of the vehicle, and fetch the part by its number, or press the button to order it. The new generation doesn't have a clue regarding what works and what doesn't.
    All our local parts stores have been either bought out by large name brand companies, so the local manager has very little control regarding what parts they can order. If the part isn't in the computer, unless you have the "old school" talents of my friend, the part wasn't available.
    One of the routes I flew a lot in the 80s and 90s, was to Beijing and Shanghai. It was the time when there was a steady flow of North American businesses were setting up manufacturing facilities in China to reduce labour costs. The stupid government didn't seem to realize that they were giving away all of our technology advantages to an authoritarian government that was still, essentially, our enemy.
    Just as the automotive industry changed when the Harvard business school bean counters took control of the industry from the engineers in the 70s, it was another step down the ladder to dependence on foreign markets, when the same types, outsourced all our technology to access the cheap Asian labour.
    The same thing happened in the electronics industry in the 80s, where most of the integrated circuit chip technology was transferred over to Taiwan, Malaysia, and eventually to China.
    We are now, essentially, a service economy, and it is our own fault.
    Bob
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
  29. OLDSMAN
    Joined: Jul 20, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    OLDSMAN
    BANNED

    No truer words have ever been said. I always knew off shore parts were crap, but it really hit home the two years that I worked for Speedway. I was so tired of dealing with their off shore parts when I was in their tech department dealing with mad customers trying to figure out how to make the shit work right for them
     
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