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82 year old rusty frame

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Runnin shine, Jun 27, 2014.

  1. Damn brother. Put it down for a bit. Take a breath. Something other then you is the culprit. Probably something simple too. Check everything again. You'll be pissed off with a renewed vengeance once you figure it out. May even be time to open up your welder....for a spot check. Good luck, and don't sweat it.....you'll be fine.....build will be too.
     
  2. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    CatFish, it's a non adjustable reg. straight Co2, maybe somewhere between 35 and 50 degrees depending where I'm at, I think the torch tip is off the metal in the range of 5/16 to 7/16 maybe, no fan currently.
    See what I mean by inside and crappy?
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1413642627.156397.jpg
    This is a tack immediately after doing the top out side corner in the other pic, this happens all the time and its pissing me off to no end. The front boxing plates are like this every other weld or so, it's disgusting. I'm probably going to grind it down and go over it again when I get a handle on this. I wish I had some pics to show of roll cage and chassis work I've done in the past to show that I use to be pretty good at this stuff(insert self-pat on the back here) but times change. Remember, your only as good as your last race. Wyatt.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  3. catfishdog
    Joined: Feb 20, 2014
    Posts: 140

    catfishdog
    Member
    from Miami

    Get closer on those inside joints, it's ok if the cup touches the metal as long as the tip is 1/8 to 1/4 of an inch away, the excessive splatter usually comes from lack of shielding gas.

    You are doing better than lots of folks.


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  4. 1951hudson
    Joined: Sep 22, 2014
    Posts: 93

    1951hudson
    Member

    You might want to try turning up the amount of gas pressure on your machine. I don't know what your running for pressure, but I use around 10-15 psi , and higher if there is any wind at all. I usually make sure the air has very little movement in my garage when I weld .


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  5. catfishdog
    Joined: Feb 20, 2014
    Posts: 140

    catfishdog
    Member
    from Miami

    My thought exactly, but Wyatt mentioned he had a preset regulator that does not allow for adjustments


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  6. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Yeah I thought it reassembled if you forget to turn the bottle on, which I've done once or twice before. I've also been in there tight with the cup touching but it usually gives me pattern troubles.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  7. catfishdog
    Joined: Feb 20, 2014
    Posts: 140

    catfishdog
    Member
    from Miami

    You can weld on a straight line, just manage your puddle


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  8. After reading all the post up to now I suddenly had a question pop up in my feeble mind. Are you running DC positive or negative? Inside the cabinet just above the wire drive me mechanism you should be able to change polarity. I can't remember for sure which setting is recommended for mild steels (DC negative possibly) but I remember having similar issues when I first got my Hobart Handler. Hobart is Millers lower end product offering and most parts don't interchange but the settings are similar so reading on Millers blogs might help you.


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  9. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Chief, I don't remember but I had to switch it when I went to gas. It was much worse before I welded a little bit and remembered to flip the wires, I must be looking pretty stupid after all these confessions.
    My good friend who I first started with building drag cars in our youth has gone on to much greater heights with chassis fabrication than I. He could be my best help with this stuff. My pride hasn't let me mention it to him. We live about two hours away now and he's just as busy as I am(he works at PrecisionTurbo) and has never seen this project, only been to my house once in the last 7 years. But I had wanted to do this PU all on my own. All the advice from my fellow HAMB'rs is like the library to me and a brotherhood of sorts. I don't know what I'd do without you great bunch of enthusiasts, thanks keep it coming please.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  10. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1413652572.641190.jpg
    I mustered this up for mocking purposes but it doesn't fit my F1 truck assembly, I was going to get a big truck MC later when it's coming together, oh well save it for "HubbaHubba" build.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  11. Not a pro at welding by any means, at all. However, I would make sure that the outlet is giving consistent voltage. I didn't see what voltage you are using, but of course 220 runs better and more consistent. Seems to me like you are not getting enough power. If you have the ability, try another outlet...

    Anywho, I really enjoy your progress. The design is pretty cool, and I cannot wait to see more!
     
  12. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Thanks Ben. I wired the garage up with 220 at the box for the air compressor, heater, and future Tig aspirations but the welder is is on 110. ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1413653566.608613.jpg


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  13. Well....not an expert either....but my Lincoln Handi-pak even with an upgrade kit installed......is supposed to be for an on the fly sheetmetal/exhaust pipe rating so to speak. That may be it brother. Again, your talents are a bit more versed than mine.....but that's what the welder told me, when I bought my little 110 to practice with. I'll bet a big banging 220 and what you know would fit that frame a bit better. Never disrespectful.....just 2 cents of shit for ya'. Sounds like there is better advice here, then me anyhow.
     
  14. fastrnu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2009
    Posts: 739

    fastrnu
    Member
    from shelton,wa

    Are you plugged straight into the wall or off an extension cord so you can get around? I ran into this once. Thought my Miller 140 was going sideways on me. Current drop on smaller wire. Did you wire your garage with 12 or 14 wire? Your cord probably 12gauge. Check your outlet, are you getting the full 115v that your machine requires?
     
  15. Mart
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 4,495

    Mart
    Member

    That's a good point re voltage. Here in the UK we run 240 volts as the normal supply. The welders are all 240 volt. Maybe that puts at an advantage over using a 110V supply. (115V?).

    Mart.
     
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  16. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Yes it's always been on extension cords to reach the chassis even though I added a bunch of boxes in the garage . Never checked the gauge of the cord it orange with decent insulation thickness and pretty new. I've checked before to see if it's getting hot. I think I used 12g and 10g to wire the garage was trying to think ahead. I think I should try the outlet closest to the breakers I know I wired those big was gonna put the compressor there than didn't.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  17. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Yeah what's with the 115 on the back of the welder with the chord being for 110 plug in?


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  18. jseery
    Joined: Sep 4, 2013
    Posts: 743

    jseery
    Member
    from Wichita KS

    Really not a good idea to run a welder on an extension cord unless it is a really heavy gauge cord.
     
  19. I noticed that last pic you posted of your tacking inside the rail, you're getting a lot of "browning" adjacent to the puddle. Seems regulated gas pressure might be off. What about possible bad gas/contamination?, bad wire?. I know with most 110V welders, everything needs to be cranked up for decent penetration, wire feed speed and voltage. Just my 2 cents.
     
  20. jseery
    Joined: Sep 4, 2013
    Posts: 743

    jseery
    Member
    from Wichita KS

    Ok, lots of issues, CO2 vs 75/25 gas, no gas pressure regulator, welder on an extension cord and you wonder why you might be having a problem???
     
  21. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    It's a Factory Set regulator, non Adjustable. The extension cord is not puny and there's no way to easily weld at one end of the frame and than the other with a 5' or so whip and maybe 5' power cord in the middle of my garage. I was told the Co2 would work better for the high heat welds I would be doing. I don't know if I remember using a welder without some form of long power cord to get to the work area in big shops, can't usually set a frame on a bench.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  22. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Thanks Prime. I've seen this blackening of the edges some with a corresponding poopy ass weld. It's like if you don't turn the bottle on. The gas is from Praxxair and is a couple months old in a shiny new aluminum bottle. Have know idea if its contaminated.
    Talked to my weld pro buddy and he's afraid I hurt the welder with maxing the duty cycle out all the time. The manual says it can run 85 amps for 2 minutes than needs 8 to cool down. Well I don't think I've welded a 2min bead but I have ran it for like a half to a full hour at full tilt inch or two welds sometimes with only short little cut the wire, clean the tip, or weld, and take a sip of beer, then weld again hundreds of times. Sometimes it gets a breather as I grind, cut, clamp stuff down into place, or the family interrupts me. The other deal is I made it shut off a couple of times bout a year or so ago and I don't think I was going for that long. Now it hasn't happened again and I'm surprised I haven't pushed it enough to make that happen again, seems fishy to me with doing a whole lot more intense welding.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
  23. fastrnu
    Joined: Feb 26, 2009
    Posts: 739

    fastrnu
    Member
    from shelton,wa

    Yessir i spent the summer workin outside my garage as my "Modified" has made a home in it.
    I tried using a standard orange 50' and experienced current drop. Very bad for the machine. Overheats it as it works its but off trying to build the power you need. A 12g 3 wire cord should be close to 9/16". I hope you get it figgered out i hate to see this thread slow down. Awsome work so far..
    Good luck partner!
     
  24. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Thanks everyone. After a good nights rest and all of your feedback I am reinvigorated to get a handle on this. I may need to sell some of my band equipment to upgrade but I'm invested in the task at hand, this is my priority. Now wether to go with a commercial shell or press on with making my stainless pines fake or not, ADHD, it's a mutha, Wyatt.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
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  25. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    Whoah! Look what I found buried in my garage today!
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1413747394.890604.jpg


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  26. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    So my welder is junk, literally, the wire feed motor died or as is at least dieing from a stroke. I was trying to get a handle on it using it on stuff I knew I would grind down, like my rear crossmember. You may have seen pics of it earlier in this thread. I bought it for $72,I believe, for I new I was going to flatten it. The low price was from the ends being torched out of its original frame. I first cleaned up the immediate damage a long time ago when I flattened it. But it had a long way to go before looking semi-factory ish for a clean install. One problem was that it sat deeper down into the frames side height than my Chrysler rear horns would allow, pie cut time..
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439399.166223.jpg
    Then I put on some scrap corner tabs to give it feet to later weld in some more fake rivets.
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439428.275095.jpg
    Then it needed the cut holes and notches filled.
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439476.941330.jpg
    I used a handfull of scrap that matched it thickness( all cutoffs from the frame or crossmember itself)
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439507.786823.jpg
    Plus I made some rear feet modeled after what I did on the front crossmember...
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439593.183662.jpg
    On both sides of course.
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439665.878468.jpg
    Part of the reason for the rear feet was to help establish a way of putting the member in there pitched in a fashion that would allow the spring to hang down close to parallel of the axle swing. I ground down the ugly but penetrating welds
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439857.819502.jpg
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414439875.400339.jpg
    Later they'll get a little Bondo before primer. I'm starting to run low on old rivets but I'll hopefully make it to the end of the chassis fab. Tried a test fit
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414440154.942977.jpg
    Gonna need some fine tuning but I won't put it in till I get a new bigger welder. Something in the 190-210A range that runs off of 220V. Until then I can pretend that it's coming together
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414440249.089393.jpg .




    "I need my mirror boy"
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2014
  27. joel
    Joined: Oct 10, 2009
    Posts: 1,986

    joel
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    The .024" wire can't carry the current ( heat ) needed to weld ii ga. frame metal. I have an old Hobart with a high and low voltage tap and on the low tap with .o24 wire it's difficult to tack frame steel consistently. However, with .030 or .035 wire it's okay still on low tap. The heavier wire should start easier also. I have a 40 ft. extension cord for my welder and I use it frequently, but it is #8 3 conductor stranded and the OD is about 1" dia. I wouldn't discourage buying a new welder. My $.02.
     
  28. I don't know if this has been asked already but i didn't see it in previous posts... what kind of welder are you using?
    Before i got my Miller Millermatic 180 i had an Eastwood 135 and it worked alright for about a year. All of the sudden it decided to start welding like a POS, i tried fixing a few things, called Eastwood for help and nothing worked. I got so frustrated that i went ahead and bought a Miller and i couldn't be happier. The thing welds like a dream and i've never had any issues with it to date. To me it seems like you are trying really hard to produce good welds but something other than you is holding back the good welds. Mig welding really isnt entirely to difficult so i dont see why its causing you such headaches. I'd also recommend using CO2/Argon mix with an adjustable regulator, your shielding gas flow rate makes a big difference in welding performance. Anyway i really enjoy this thread and i hope the welding issues get sorted. Best of luck.
     
  29. Runnin shine
    Joined: Apr 12, 2013
    Posts: 3,316

    Runnin shine
    Member

    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414692570.597315.jpg
    Knocked my kingpins out today
    ImageUploadedByH.A.M.B.1414692611.329695.jpg
    They came out pretty easy considering you couldn't hardly turn the spindles. Going to clean'm up a little and paint'm. I bent the arms up for the drag link to clear the bones last year. I need to shape the axle more and fill the boss area still but I'm welder less right now. Just trying to find things to keep me movin forward like finally getting tubes so I can mount and balance my tires.


    "I need my mirror boy"
     
  30. Every day an update pops we know you're moving! No sweat it for you amigo. Lookin' good.

    You did get me looking at some of the welding forums. Yikes! I will struggle just to catch up with your progress.....but some of those guys are Michaelangelo welders. Stacked dimes everywhere. Pulsed Mig, Tig specific, and even some yahoos with magic stick welders. Good GAWD man !! Boggling results the stuff people do.

    You my friend are in conquest! I dig it. That truck will always be yours. Personality in spades. Get it!
     
    Runnin shine likes this.

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