Register now to get rid of these ads!

700R4 FILTER issues

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Deyomatic, Jan 23, 2010.

  1. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,095

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    I'm trying to get the filter up into my 700R4 and it just doesn't look right. If I install it without the O ring (for fitment check) it slides right up close to the valve body and looks "right." When I have that cocksucking O ring on there it feels like it gets hung up and when it "seats" there's about a 3/4" gap between the valve body and the filter.

    Does this look right to anyone here? There is a very small recessed area around the filter intake (at least I think the hole in the filter is for the intake). Is the pan supposed to sort of hold it in place and that recession still allows it to suck? Or is this completely wrong.

    This fucking truck won't stop fighting with me.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,095

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    Nobody? Does this look right to anybody?
     
  3. 1959apache
    Joined: Nov 22, 2009
    Posts: 2,628

    1959apache
    Member

    looks correct to me... can you compare the old filter with the new and the old o-ring to the new? try it with the old o-ring if it isnt screwed up.

    and I am with you on cars fighting you... if you want a car to fight you try owning an MG Midget lol.... that car wanted to fight me until the day I traded it for someone else's project car.
     
  4. blt2go
    Joined: Oct 27, 2009
    Posts: 551

    blt2go
    Member

    i'm sure you checked already for the old seal. i had one that i bought used, changed the filter the o-ring stayed in tranny, picked it out, put on the new one and didn't seat properly. cussed a while and finally got a light and picked out another seal somebody didn't get out before.
     
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. Interesting - I just came from the 'yard, and I saw a Midget in there. Was yours 'resale' red, over OEM blue?? :)

    Cosmo
     
  6. onlychevrolets
    Joined: Jan 23, 2006
    Posts: 2,307

    onlychevrolets
    Member

    its right...make sure the old o ring is not in the case bore. install the o ring on the filter tube and give the filter a good bump with you palm. It should pop in place and stay in place so you can put the pan on. no cock suckers needed.
     
    1956 F100 likes this.
  7. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,095

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    We measured the depth of the pan and compared that to how low this filter stuck down, and this filter was about 1/4" farther. We whacked that filter a few times with a rubber mallet and it wouldn't budge. That filter came from NAPA, the one I took out came from NAPA...(read the WHOLE story below). We ultimately went to Advance and got one and it worked just as onlychevrolets said, it slid right where it needed to go (about 3/4" higher than the photo shows). Before we got the new filter, we kept taking the o ring off completely and putting the filter up there and it looked right, we were also comparing the depth of the hole to the stop on the filter and it just didn't look good.
    Oh...the fight continues: one of the bolts stripped putting the pan back on. It never ends with this truck.


    This tranny has been sitting around for a few years, I used it for 15,000 miles or so then pulled it when I got rid of that car. Before transplanting it into my '60, I wanted a fresh filter and needed a fresh gasket since I'd drained the fluid before pulling it from the car. I turned it upside down on the garage floor (made a HUGE mess in the process) and put a new NAPA filter in, but it didn't seem right...I kept pushing as hard as I could but it didn't seem like it seated correctly. (YES, this was after wrestling with the old O ring that was stuck in the hole). Well, we put it in the truck, put 5 qts of fluid in with it and my OCD kicked in...what if that filter is too low in the pan and it starves for oil and burns out the tranny...what if...I bet it's fine...but what if? Well, it only had 5 qts of fluid in it now, so I figured I'd take it apart and verify that it was correct. Wrestled getting the old O ring out again, wrestled with the new new NAPA filter...and I'm glad I did because it was not correct, before.
     
  8. 1959apache
    Joined: Nov 22, 2009
    Posts: 2,628

    1959apache
    Member

    nope.. lol, mine had $300 per quart red over bare metal... it wouldnt suprise me if it was in the graveyard by now (4 months after the trade) I have had to push that thing more times than drive it. I drove it for a week after a complete restoration and the blinkers stopped working as well as the carb. At that point I said "F you devil car, you are going in the paper tomorrow" and it did and I got rid of that nightmare.

    and I am glad that you got it somewhat worked out deyo... just be glad you didnt stripp those pan bolts on the engine... sounds like that truck needs an exorcism
     
  9. Deyomatic
    Joined: Apr 17, 2002
    Posts: 3,095

    Deyomatic
    Member
    from CT

    Well, I would say that putting a Chevy engine into a Ford IS an exorcism, but the issues are coming from the Chevy stuff!
     
    DHeep likes this.
  10. 1959apache
    Joined: Nov 22, 2009
    Posts: 2,628

    1959apache
    Member

    ford always had the best idea... by putting the distributor at the front of the engine... why the switch in the first place out of curiosity? I am not here to dog on you, just wondering.
     
  11. rpoL98
    Joined: Jan 10, 2018
    Posts: 2

    rpoL98

    Notwithstanding this being an almost 10yr old thread. ran into the same problem: none of the store-bought filters, regardless of brand would fit right, and yes, I sure as heck got the old seal out of there.

    went through a whole assortment of o-rings, settled on using two of 17mm x 4.0mm thk (from McMaster-Carr), I tried a whole bunch of different 11/16" ID, 3/4" ID, 5/8" ID, various thicknesses, and settled on 17mm ID as the best fit. I also made sure the filter contacts the pan to prevent it from dropping out. Since I used an aftermarket cast aluminum pan that was a little deeper (2-19/32" inside depth), had to JB-Weld some 1/4" thk x 1" square (appx) aluminum flat stock, under where the filter sits, 4 pieces near the corners of the filter, to keep the filter snugged up in the hole. The WIX filter I was using hangs down 2-5/16" from the flange surface. The o-rings provide a snug fit, it doesn't gravity drop out, but I wouldn't trust it just hanging there while bouncing down the road.

    This thread seems to have the best synopsis of the issue, brought here by my weak-ass Google-fu.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
    loudbang likes this.
  12. bedwards
    Joined: Mar 25, 2015
    Posts: 232

    bedwards
    Member

    This is an old thread, but maybe it will help someone. I had similar issues and yes I pulled the old o-ring out. Giving it a good hard rap with my palm is what took to get it to pop in place and seat.
     
    Mark Yac and Donuts & Peelouts like this.
  13. That's the correct method. Pull the old o-ring deal out. New one all the way down on the filter, give it a smack.
    200 4 R , same way.
     
  14. xlr8
    Joined: Jun 26, 2006
    Posts: 651

    xlr8
    Member
    from Idaho

    There is a mismatch problem with early and late filters and unfortunately it seems like only the later style filter is available now. I have run onto this too, you might try getting a filter from a transmission shop, they seem to have more access to the right parts. The late filters stick down too far and won't let the pan bolt up on the earlier transmissions and it's a maddening problem.
     
  15. rpoL98
    Joined: Jan 10, 2018
    Posts: 2

    rpoL98

    the problem I had, is that the orange o-ring (ribbed sleeve) that comes with the new filter is only about 2.5mm thick (about 17.5mm ID), so it doesn't engage the ID of the bore. on my '90 700R4 (code "0FUM"), the suction port that the filter seats in, is a stepped bore. Using the highly imprecise measuring technique of socket OD best fit, it seems the way-up higher section (deeper in the pump) has about a 20mm ID (where the bare filter tube extends into). the lower portion of the stepped port, where the seal seats, is about 24.5mm ID. the bare tube on the filter is about 18mm OD.
    if I squish my calipers real hard on the orange ribbed sleeve seal, I can compress it to about 1.5mm, so 18mm tube dia, plus 2x 1.5mm adds up to 21mm. so that doesn't fit into the higher up section, and it shouldn't.

    the problem is that uncompressed, the orange ribbed sleeve seal is at 2.5mm thk, so 18mm tube plus 2x 2.5mm comes out to 23mm, the seal doesn't even touch the lower bore ID that it's supposed to.

    that's why I went with the 4mm thick o-rings: 18mm tube, plus 2x 4mm comes out to 26mm, which compresses snugly into the nominal 24.5mm bore. in retrospect, not sure why I didn't try an 18mm ID o-ring. maybe that's next.

    so I don't know WTF is going on with the filters lately, the filter I pulled out of this trans was one I myself put in about 10 yrs ago (or more), and yes, if you get the old seal out, it just pops right in with a solid whack from the palm of your hand like everybody says, and fitted tight and snug, everything is copacetic. bolt everything up, add fluid and drive for 10 yrs (until finally the clutches, band wear out).

    ------------------
    I apologize for the edits to my original post, I went back to be sure and measured things again. the 4.0mm thk o-ring is a tighter (better) fit than the 3.5mm thk. just make sure it doesn't roll over the filter tube flange.

    edit to add 2: I also apologize for being metric on this most-traditional-all-American forum. but it would be a difficult read what with decimal caliper readings, mixed in with 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  16. models916
    Joined: Apr 19, 2012
    Posts: 380

    models916
    Member

    There is a tall truck filter for the 700r4. It's used with the deep pan or a pan with a step in it. Won't work with the flat pan.
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.