Register now to get rid of these ads!

Technical 6v battery dies in 5 seconds

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by That_53_Guy, Oct 17, 2019.

  1. After it die's, have you checked to see if you have juice on both the negative and positive sides of the coil? With a remote starter switch or with a helper, make sure that both sides of the coil still has voltage while cranking over the engine.
     
    Boneyard51 likes this.
  2. Copied from the net....
    All Kettering ignition systems work the same way, regardless of voltage or polarity. There are some minor differences in details with polarity and voltage, but general operation is consistent.

    Here's a quick way to check what's going on using a test light. You can use a 12 volt light on a six volt system, it just won't be very bright. You can also use an analog meter, but a test light is easier to watch. Digital meters don't do well at measuring pulses...

    First, check to make sure the light is working and has a good ground. Attach the clip to a ground and touch the probe to a known hot source or the hot battery post - light should light.

    Touch the probe to the following points, crank the engine, and observe the light:

    Hot (battery) side of coil - light should be "on" steady. No light means you're not getting power to the coil. Light pulsing on or off, or varying in intensity, means you have a high resistance connection somewhere in the power circuit.

    Point side of coil - light should pulse as the points open and close..."on" when points are open, "off" when points are closed. Steady "on" means either the points aren't closing or the wire between the coil and points is broken. Steady "off" means either the points aren't opening or something (most likely the wire between the coil and points) is shorted to ground.

    If the points are in fact opening and closing correctly, as indicated by the test light pulsing when the engine is cranked, you should have spark at the output of the coil. You can check this by pulling the coil wire from the center of the distributor and holding the distributor end near the engine block while cranking (not with your fingers unless you like getting zapped). You should have a nice fat blue spark at least 1/4" long.

    No spark at the output of the coil (and asuming the points are working correctly as determined above) means either a bad coil or a bad condenser. A weak yellow spark is generally a bad condenser.

    If you have spark at the output of the coil, reconnect it to the center post of the distributor, and repeat the check for spark at the end of one or more spark plug wires. If you have spark at the coil but not at the plugs, you most likely have either a bad/broken rotor, a bad distributor cap, or bad high tension wires.

    If you have spark at the plugs, check to make sure the distributor was timed correctly when the engine was assembled. As each cylinder comes up on compression, the rotor should point to the corresponding terminal on the distributor cap. If you set static timing so that the points just open (use the test light) at top dead center, the engine should run. Once it's running, you can set timing per the applicable manual.
     
    6inarow, Atwater Mike and Boneyard51 like this.
  3. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    Thanks Grumpy, will check with my test light when I get back to the house
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
    1stGrumpy likes this.
  4. Dick Stevens
    Joined: Aug 7, 2012
    Posts: 2,721

    Dick Stevens
    Member

    Change the condensor if that was when the problem fist began! Basic problem shooting, when a problem comes up after making a change, that is almost always the thing that caused the problem!
     
    That_53_Guy, Boneyard51 and abe lugo like this.
  5. plym_46
    Joined: Sep 8, 2005
    Posts: 3,904

    plym_46
    Member
    from central NY

    Condensers have a reputation on being doa brand new.
     
    Boneyard51 likes this.
  6. theboss20
    Joined: Dec 30, 2018
    Posts: 171

    theboss20

    Based on your explanation of the generator wiring i think that it is wrong...the voltage regulator should have a terminal marked Gen or Arm...that goes to the "A" terminal on the generator...the field goes to the field only...the voltage regulator terminal marked Bat. is the output from the generator through the regulator through the ammeter to battery usually via the solenoid.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  7. theboss20
    Joined: Dec 30, 2018
    Posts: 171

    theboss20

    7.1 volts


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  8. Truck64
    Joined: Oct 18, 2015
    Posts: 3,880

    Truck64
    Member
    from Ioway

    My theory is Pertronix is responsible for the raft of shitty condensers flooding our shores, those things have sold more Ignitors than anything I can think of.
     
  9. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    That's how my generator is wired exacty
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  10. theboss20
    Joined: Dec 30, 2018
    Posts: 171

    theboss20

    One thing my battery background says to me is the 6v battery is the most likely to be a stale battery of any on the shelf. Always check the manufactures' date code that is stamped into to top edge of battery...if nobody that is selling you a battery can read that code...beware. Go the website for the battery maker and learn to read that code...it's the only thing you can believe. I always check voltage on any battery I buy while in the store...7.1 for a six volt...14.2 for a 12v. Charging rate for a 6v system with everything working correctly 7.9v.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  11. Ebbsspeed
    Joined: Nov 11, 2005
    Posts: 4,887

    Ebbsspeed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You must check a lot of batteries in a lot of stores to find any that read those voltages.

    I think your volt meter may need recalibration.
     
  12. 41fred207
    Joined: Feb 7, 2011
    Posts: 102

    41fred207
    Member

     
  13. theboss20
    Joined: Dec 30, 2018
    Posts: 171

    theboss20

    You are right...I was quoting charge rate not static voltage...should be...6v=6.3v 12v=12.6v


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
    upspirate likes this.
  14. 41fred207
    Joined: Feb 7, 2011
    Posts: 102

    41fred207
    Member

    Not sure why no one has caught this or maybe I missed something along the way but the negative ( - ) side of coil goes to distributor, positive ( + ) side of coil should get power from ignition.
     
  15. 41fred207
    Joined: Feb 7, 2011
    Posts: 102

    41fred207
    Member

    Sorry, after rereading I see it's positive ground. Haven't had my coffee yet...:(
     
    Boneyard51 and That_53_Guy like this.
  16. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    I appreciate your help on this, thank you. When I had it running real strong, it was for like 30 minutes. I was sitting at a red light, when it changed and I took off, the car died. No sputtering, no coughing...just dead, like dead battery dead. It wouldn't start the rest of the day, even after charging battery fully. The next day, fired right up, ran for 5 seconds, died. Would not start again. This happened for several days.

    In that time, I replaced all 3 cables with 1 guage, replaced the solenoid and checked the volt. regulator, starter and generator, and rebuilt the carb. I tried "reversing polarity" on both the volt. reg. and the genny. Not sure what, if anything, I accomplished. Was still getting one easy start, die, no start.

    That's when some folks here on the hamb suggested the condenser may be bad. I was getting spark and fuel, but no start. So I removed the dizzy and replaced the condenser, rotor and cap. I also replaced the wire from the coil to the dist. and a suspect wire inside the dist. I've since had the dist. in and out of the car about 5 times. When I put the dist back in, I'm making sure #1 is at TDC on compression stroke. I marked the spot on the balancer so I know where it's at. I'm making sure that the oil pump shaft slot is in line with the cam shaft, per the shop manual, and that the rotor is pointing at #1 before putting dist back in.

    Today, I used the instructions you found and shared with my test light to confirm that I was getting power from the coil to the inside of the dist. Put it all back together, double checked firing order and plug wire disposition, etc. Still no spark. I'm not getting light on the points side of the coil when my daughter cranks the car for me. So now I have the dist out again and will re-check points, condenser and make sure button inside cap is making contact with rotor.

    It cranks strong, but definitely no spark at plugs, confirmed by removing plug, setting it on block and cranking car, no spartan what so ever (brand new plugs, properly gapped at
    .035)

    Sorry for the epistle, but again, the help is appreciated.
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  17. upspirate
    Joined: Apr 15, 2012
    Posts: 2,166

    upspirate
    Member

    Is there an old garage in your area that would have a distributor machine? Sun Machine? If so pull it and have them check it
     
  18. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    I can check
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  19. Sorry but I am confused with what you are saying. There was power between the negative side of the coil and the distributor but not when your daughter was cranking the starter? Is this correct? Was there power on the positive side of the coil?
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
  20. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    Sorry, I'm confused myself. This is what I did: with the test light grounded (clip on red side), I put the probe (black side) on the points side of the coil, had the kid crank the starter and got no light at all.
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  21. From a lot of years ago I've still got it stuck in the back of my mind that automotive wet cell batteries, at their prime, produced 2.2 to 2.3 volts per cell. Six volt batteries having 3 cells and 12 volts having 6 cells.

    All bets are off as to what they pull out of the newer gel-cell or air-gas mat batteries. o_O
     
    That_53_Guy likes this.
  22. O.k., did you check and see if there was power on the battery side of the coil?
     
  23. The back of your mind is correct!
     
  24. X-cpe
    Joined: Mar 9, 2018
    Posts: 821

    X-cpe

    You are correct if you take a ride in your "Way Back Machine". Current teaching is 2.1V per cell.
     
    ClayMart likes this.
  25. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    Checked this Morning by connecting the test probe to the battery side of the voltage regulator and the red side to the battery side of the coil and got a very very faint, dim light
    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  26. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 6,098

    BJR
    Member

    Why would you connect the test light to the voltage regulator? Connect one side to ground and the other side of the test light to the battery side of the coil. Then crank the engine and see if the test light lights.
     
  27. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    I did that cuz the dist. is out of the car, and I don't understand fully what the hell I'm doing lol. I was getting power to the battery side of the coil while cranking yesterday though., but nothing on the points side.

    Sent from my SM-G975U using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  28. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 3,555

    Boneyard51
    Member

    You are getting two things confused. The voltage regulator and generator have nothing to do with the running of the engine. Also if the engine spins over, you have plenty of battery.

    Your problem likely lies in that distributor. If your test light did not flicker when you put it on the disturber side of the coil while turning the engine, you have a short to ground on that side of the coil. Likely. Check where the bolt for the lead in wire goes through the distributor housing. I have seen problems there.






    Bones
     
  29. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 6,098

    BJR
    Member

    At this point I think you should find a friend who understands how a point ignition system works and pay him or beer him to help fix it, since you seem to be going around in circles.
     
    That_53_Guy and upspirate like this.
  30. That_53_Guy
    Joined: Jul 30, 2018
    Posts: 172

    That_53_Guy
    Member

    best advice yet!
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2020 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.