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64 catalina build Super Duty clone

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by jratz1966, Nov 6, 2012.

  1. jratz1966
    Joined: Nov 11, 2009
    Posts: 104


    Hey Guys,This is my first thread,It's a 64 Pontiac Catalina 2dr sedan.Car is almost 100% rust free.Doing a Super Duty clone.Pontiac stopped producing SD car in 63,but going to try to make it look like they still made one in 1964.Going to leave car white,Have a built 428 w/400 turbo trans that built with shift kit and 3000 stall.have 411 posi for rear.I would like some feedback on rims,I'm leaning towards chrome OEM with 670 pie crust and cheater slicks on rear.I also like narrow 5 spoke on front with black steel rim on rear even tho that was a Mopar thing.

    Attached Files:

  2. Well nothing like cloneing a car that didn't exist. :D

    I don't think that steelies and spokes up front was or is a MOPAR thing, that is just a budget racer thing, pretty much across the board. Anyway if it gives you the look you are after then don't sweat it.
  3. axle
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 3,875

    from Drag City

    Super Duties were late 1961 - 1963. GM ceased racing program in 1964
  4. Makes is easy to clone one though, you just clone whatever your little heart desires. :D
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  5. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    from florida

    At one time in my life Pontiacs were my car of choice. I'd love to have that 64 of yours and would probably do it similar to what you are planning. Maybe remove the two bottom headlights and run air ducts to the carbs ?

  6. 55chieftain
    Joined: May 29, 2007
    Posts: 2,183


    White steel wheels would look good also.


  7. I am not a purist and I would work an assembly line for love or money. If the company didn't build a super duty that didn't build one and in '64 if they ran a factory super duty NASCAR it had to be available to the public. That was the rules when NASCAR still used real cars.
  8. B Bay Barn
    Joined: Dec 27, 2009
    Posts: 402

    B Bay Barn

    Rallyes w/o the trim rings and center caps have a competitive air about them also.
  9. That is a picture of a guy standing in front of a roundy round car. What makes it an super duty and how many were sold to the public?

    Last edited: Nov 6, 2012
  10. jratz1966
    Joined: Nov 11, 2009
    Posts: 104


    Ok,here's a few more pics.I've taken the car apart,had front clip media blasted,stripped the rest of car with 36 grit and elbow grease,going back over it with 180 before epoxy primer.The only rust I found was the lower front of drivers fender,bottom of passenger door and small spot in front of passenger rear wheel well.I bought a rust free passenger door from Indiana Pontiacs.I'm going to take doors to blaster and have him do inner doors.The trunk and floors are 100% rust.It's amazing how clean this car is for being in Michigan its whole life.Now when I referred to a SD clone I mean a drag style car,I plan on doing some nostalgia drag racing .

    Attached Files:

  11. Dane
    Joined: May 6, 2010
    Posts: 1,353

    from Soquel, CA

    Don't confuse me with the facts dammit! :D
  12. Deuces
    Joined: Nov 3, 2009
    Posts: 18,569

    from Michigan

    Hell yeah!!! Do it up!!!!...:D
  13. jratz1966
    Joined: Nov 11, 2009
    Posts: 104


    I thought about painting wheel body color with chrome lugs and duct cap,I'm also knocking around lettering it like the 62 is,thought I might call it the last mohican.

  14. I like your plan and obviously the SD was your inspiration. Of course I lean toward performance as a rule so if it was a '59 Borgward and you wanted to stuff a 455 in it I would probably encourage that as well.
  15. dad-bud
    Joined: Aug 22, 2009
    Posts: 3,885


    Go the body coloured steel wheels - you won't go wrong if you do.
    Other than that, looking forward to updates
  16. Iron Dog
    Joined: Oct 28, 2011
    Posts: 267

    Iron Dog
    from Minnesota

    I like it. My grandfather and father were Poncho drivers through and through.
  17. That's better. I can't imagine why we don't do more NASCAR clones, there is just something about an old roundy round car hat does it for me.
  18. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 26,961


    That would make it a phantom rather than a clone wouldn't it. All bs aside I like the concept of building something that could have been built but wasn't and causing a bit of head scratching among the pre super car go fast factory car boys.
  19. jratz1966
    Joined: Nov 11, 2009
    Posts: 104


    The Super Duty Program was started in late 1961 and was available to qualified drivers as a Dealer Installed Option, therefore serial number documentation is hard to find for 1961 Catalina or Ventura Super Duty's. The program was a great success at the 1961 Indy Nationals and at Nascar Tracks winning multiple drags and oval competitions. These wins put Pontiac back into the spotlight and gave the Super Duty nameplate a new meaning.

    The program was ramped up in 1962 when Pontiac announced that it would make available, from the factory a limited number of Super Duty's. The new package would cost an additional $1,334.24 plus $234.00 for the mandatory 4-speed transmission (Pontiac's automatic transmission at that time could not handle the power output). The new Pontiac was outfitted with a 405 or 410 hp 421 cubic inch engine (true output was around 460 to 500 hp), cast iron or aluminum dump headers, special heavy suspension, special frame, 4:10 or 4:88 posi-traction rear differential and a selection of aluminum front end components including aluminum fender wells, core support, fenders, hood, grills, bumpers and defrost grill. Dealer installed options were also available including plexiglass windows, functional hood scoop and interior deletes.
  20. jratz1966
    Joined: Nov 11, 2009
    Posts: 104


    Conflicting numbers abound on actual output of vehicles and engines. Reliable sources however indicate that in all 178 1962 Pontiac Super Duty's left the factory, 162 were outfitted Catalina's and 16 were outfitted Grand Prix's. 225 421 cubic inch engines were produced, 178 installed and the remaining 63 served as replacements. Now you know why finding just the crank or heads to one of these monster engines is difficult!

    In 1963 the program was taken even further with a hotter engine and higher compression. Output of the 1963 engines was base 410hp but true output was rumored 500 to 550 hp. The cars got even lighter thanks to plexiglass windows and an aluminum deck lid, a select few, 15 to be exact had large holes drilled out of the frames, nicknaming these the "Swiss Cheese". Arnie "Farmer" Beswick known for setting many records in the 1961 and 1962 Super Duty's ran a few of the "Swiss Cheese's" on the track. The car did not qualify under the Super Stocker class and so it had to be run in the F/SX Factory Experimental class.

    1963 Vehicle output was 88 with 77 outfitted Catalina's and 11 outfitted Tempest's. In January 1963 General Motors announced that its Pontiac Motor Division would no longer support or output factory racecar's such as the Super Duty. Liability was becoming too high for the vehicle manufacturer. Interesting enough when one reflects on the great cars being produced by Pontiac in those years it becomes clear that so much of the spotlight was being taken away from the General Motors Division and Chevrolet could not afford more lagging sales of its Impala, Corvette and other model line-up so the Super Duty Program was abandoned but never forgotten!

    Today's hot muscle car market has increased demand for the early equipped Pontiac Super Duty's, some rare examples have been known to fetch close to $750,000 for a flawlessly restored, numbers matching Super Duty. Just recently a very rare Tempest Super Duty sold for $226,000. This vehicle was a shell, missing most of the original components, however, once completed it will no doubt be a fine example of a rare Tempest Super Duty (1963 Pontiac Tempest Super Duty Production = 6).
  21. '64 SD's were not made.
  22. troylee
    Joined: Jul 10, 2007
    Posts: 683


    Lookin good old man. I think body color rear wheel w/ cheaters and 6" magnesium 5 spokes up front. They were still racing in 64 , super duty or not.
  23. tommyd
    Joined: Dec 10, 2010
    Posts: 11,395

    from South Indy

    I like the direction this build is going. I also think that a round track version would be cool. Hey, where were you in 62?
  24. Offset
    Joined: Nov 9, 2010
    Posts: 1,714

    from Canada

    The Fireball Roberts 22 would make a great street car. It is beautiful. SY knew how to build them for sure.

    Good luck with your project. Nice to see some Pontiac cars built.
  25. propwash
    Joined: Jul 25, 2005
    Posts: 3,858

    from Las Vegas

    ya know - several of you have chimed in to state emphatically in a somewhat surly manner that there was no such thing as an SD in 1964. The original poster acknowledged that in his first post. Geez, get off your high horses, gents - this is a hot rod forum, building phantoms has been acceptable for a very long time. Somebody somewhere has allowed YOU to build what you want. Let him have the same privilege.
  26. stuart in mn
    Joined: Nov 22, 2007
    Posts: 1,758

    stuart in mn

    Factory SD's only went up to 1963 but that doesn't matter, it will still be a cool car. Have fun with it! :)
  27. belair
    Joined: Jul 10, 2006
    Posts: 8,413


    I like it. Looks to be cool project.
  28. boogeracng
    Joined: Feb 13, 2008
    Posts: 338

    from Eureka,MO

    It's your car/ it the way YOU want it. Who cares about years, factory stuff, yada, yada. Oh and by the way, body colored or white rims all around or white in the rear, chromed in front. I LIKE IT!!!! I'm a closet Pontiac fanatic. Build it and enjoy it!!!!!!!!!!!
  29. scrap metal 48
    Joined: Sep 6, 2009
    Posts: 5,936

    scrap metal 48

    Hey jratz, Your Pontiac is cool and I like the direction you're going whatever you want to call it.. Keep up the nice work on your 64.....
  30. nugget32
    Joined: Aug 21, 2011
    Posts: 256


    Should be an awsome ride. I had a new 64 Catalina, 2 door sedan (post). Ordered it from a dealer in Forest Lake, MN. Listed for around 3 grand, paid $, 2,600. Took 6 weeks to be delivered. Red, called Grenadir Red or something like that, 389, 4 speed, posi, tach, no radio, black walls, dog dish caps and duals. Drove it home from the dealer on my 20th birthday. Payments were $106.00/ month for 24 months, a ton of money as I think I was making about $2.50/hour at 3M Co. making sandpaper at the time. The hub caps immediately were thrown in the corner of Dads garage and replaced with Baby Moons and Beauty Rings, could not afford fancy wheels which came later. The thing came with a BW T10, which was pretty week for the 389, it lasted 2 weeks before the cluster gear shatered. Back to the dealer for a little warranty work. The Service Manager could not believe that I had wrecked the tranny in 2 weeks, but "Oh" Well. I had the only "Tin Indian" at the Drive Inn we hung out at, "Jerry's", in St Paul, MN. Mostly 327 or 409 Chev,s, and a few 383 Mopars. It ran pretty good and took my constant abuse until I traded it for a new 67 SS350 Camaro. Fun to try to remember the past and get it right.

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