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'59 ford fairlane motor swap?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by oldsrocket, Jul 16, 2007.

  1. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    My GF has a '59 ford Fairlane with a 223 Inline 6. I've tuned it up, rebuilt the carb, changed the intake and exhaust manifold gasket, new plugs, coil, points condensor... all of it and it's still a dog. Compression seems to be fine. I'm glad it's big and stuff so she doesn't get hurt, but I want her to be able to keep up with the pack and not get run over by a semi.

    Anybody know if a Y-block is a direct swap with the motor mounts? How about a 289? 300 inline?

    I'm not a ford guy by any means so a little advice on this topic would be great.
     
  2. Henry Floored
    Joined: Sep 18, 2004
    Posts: 1,370

    Henry Floored
    Member

    Y- blocks were factory, so were FE's. Should be able to get mounts, hoses and linkages etc. from resto parts supply houses. If you want kits and performance parts check out Crites

    http://www.critesrestoration.com/galaxie.htm
     
  3. old beet
    Joined: Sep 25, 2002
    Posts: 5,750

    old beet
    Member

    I know a FE will bolt in easily. As they came with them......OLDBEET
     
  4. NYfatboy
    Joined: Oct 5, 2005
    Posts: 252

    NYfatboy
    Member

    I put a 289 into a 57 ranchero using '63 engine mounts,and slotting the holes in the tranny mount to use a c-4.Driveshaft was too short,but easy job.Good luck!
     
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  5. hemi35
    Joined: Dec 9, 2006
    Posts: 282

    hemi35
    Member
    from Australia

    I agree, there should be a FE in your ride. Find a nice 390 & C6 and it will fit with ease as they cam factory with 332 fe's...
     
  6. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    will the mounts have to be changed between the I6 and the FE? Thanks for the help fellas.
     
  7. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

  8. Fidget
    Joined: Sep 10, 2004
    Posts: 1,011

    Fidget
    Member

    First question is, what do you want to do with the car? If it's just more power, then any engine will do that. Have you looked into hopping up that engine? I've seen several threads here about modifying straight 6's. What tranny is in it? Obviously a Y-block would be the easiest choice.

    I have a 292 in my 58 Fairlane. It starts everytime, I like the sound of it, and I can easily cruise at 70 on the freeway, it pulls hills well, parts are still pretty easy to find, and its a simple design, it's a small V8 that gets better mileage than the 6 in my 93 Jeep, and it's not a common motor to find in cars anymore. There were oiling problems, but once you know what to do they are no longer a problem. There were multiple engine choices for 59, so engine mounts shouldn't be that big of a problem.

    Downside is that Y-blocks are limited in transmission choices, without an expensive adapter that sometimes costs more than an used tranny, I'm not going to break any speed records-but thats not what the car is for, the newest engine you can find is over 40 years old-and that includes most of the speed parts, new speed parts are uncommon and expensive.

    If you want something more trouble free, look into getting a newer engine and tranny combo so you won't have to dick around trying to adapt things. While you have the engine out, switch the front brakes from drum to disc. If its her daily commuter car, a 390 FE might not be the best choice to putt around town with when gas is so expensive. A smaller V8 might be a better choice.

    Point is, once you pull that engine and tranny out, you basically have a blank slate to start with, it all depends on what you ultimately desire the car to be .
     
  9. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    easy quick answer.... the option that is going to make it the smallest pain in my ass. It's not my car and I have my own projects to be working on, but she's dead-set on having this thing on the road and has very little patience, very little idea of what's involved, and very little money.

    So as you all guessed... I'm the one that's gonna be suckered into doing it.

    If I'm at it I might as well give her an auto tranny because she has a hard enough time walking let alone using three pedels.

    Mainly it would be nice to have something that drops into the existing mounts (at least motor mounts), and something that can be mounted to an auto tranny.
     
  10. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    Found a 352 FE. According to my research this was an optional engine for that car. However, I'm still wondering about the motor mounts and if it will be a drop in fit. Anybody have any input? I think we will keep the 3 speed tranny. I looking for a fast and easy solution.

    BTW- I tested the compression today I was getting between 80-100psi. Motors Manual says 150psi. Damn.
     
  11. mortecai
    Joined: Mar 10, 2001
    Posts: 263

    mortecai
    Member

    An old FE 390 cu in engine will run strong enough to keep with up with the pack with no sweat. It is probably a bolt in proposition. Driveshaft may be different but that is a no brainer to fix.
     
  12. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    PS- The 352 is out of a 1965 truck. Was there anything that changed between 1959 and 1965 with the 352s?
     
  13. junkyardjeff
    Joined: Jul 23, 2005
    Posts: 7,364

    junkyardjeff
    Member

    All you need to do is find the mounts for a FE and it will bolt in,the part on the frame is the same for all motors,I have a good running 352 out of a 66 truck with a stick parts. I thought I had it sold but have heard nothing and it will be coming out of the truck soon,I also have a 460/C-6 that I might sell too. Both motors can be heard and I am in Dayton. Jeff
     
  14. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    Jeff- The 352 I'm looking at is $150 and comes w/ 3 speed tranny. Claims it's a runner in Bellefontaine. Can you beat that deal? (PS- I don't care about the tranny, planning on using the one already in the car....should work...right?).

    460 might be a bit much for my gf to handle.

    If not, do you think you could part with a pair of the mounts I'll need? Thanks.
     
  15. junkyardjeff
    Joined: Jul 23, 2005
    Posts: 7,364

    junkyardjeff
    Member

    I cant beat that deal yet,I supposively have the motor sold to someone with a restored 66 truck with a later 302 that wants to put it back to original and really seemed interested in my motor since its a 66. I told them I wanted around 250.00 but they have not gotten back with me and its going to be a couple weeks at the earliest that my motor will be pulled. You might have to use the trans that comes with the motor since in 65 the trans bolt pattern changed and the 59 trans will not bolt to the 65 bellhousing,you will have to find a 64 on back FE bellhousing to use the 59 trans. Jeff
     
  16. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    so after some research I found that the 352 wasn't offered in the ford trucks in 1965. So, I'm wondering what year this motor really is that I'm looking at. Does anybody know where I could find the casting numbers? Also does anybody know of a site/resource that can help me decode the numbers? Thanks.
     
  17. DrDano
    Joined: Jul 10, 2003
    Posts: 696

    DrDano
    Alliance Vendor

    I'd find a 390/C6 combo from a running car. Craigslist around here has quite a few. You can get damn decent mileage if you throw the factory intake and carb in the trash and run an aftermarket aluminum dual plane with a quadrajet, install some highway friendly gears and you'll be good to go.
     
  18. Malcolm
    Joined: Feb 9, 2006
    Posts: 7,567

    Malcolm
    Member
    from Nebraska

    I'd have to agree w/ DrDano. The 390/C6 is a tough, durable combo that can be had for a reasonable price. You won't have to worry about the 3-speed manual either.

    I get 15 mpg on the highway with the 390/FMX in my '62 Galaxie. I put an Edelbrock Performer intake and 600 carb on it, along with a mild cam, electronic ignition, and free flowing 2-1/2" dual exhaust. It has 3.00 gears in it. The carb isn't perfectly dialed in, so I'm sure I could squeeze a little more mileage out of it. I do also drive the car pretty hard - the 390 just runs sooo good, has great torque and power, and pulls the heavy Galaxie around really well.....

    Malcolm
     
  19. Fairlane Dave
    Joined: Mar 23, 2007
    Posts: 634

    Fairlane Dave
    Member

    A 302 will fit with essentially no mods at all. You can order a motor mount kit online for about $125. The mounts bolt directly onto the 223 frame pads with no drilling needed. I am installing an AOD with mine. That required no mods to the tranny crossmember with the exception of drilling two holes for the new trans pad. The good thing about this is that you (or the next owner) can go back to a factory setup later on without having to un-do any mods that were made.

    My 223 in my '57 Fairlane was a pig, especially bolted up to a Fordomatic tranny. It's a strong reliable engine, but it wasn't built for speed. Yes, you can hop them up, but for me the cost of getting my Fordomatic straight and the high dollar (and limited selection) speed parts for the 223 made the 302 HO swap a no-brainer for my needs.
     
  20. DrDano
    Joined: Jul 10, 2003
    Posts: 696

    DrDano
    Alliance Vendor

    On our trip out to Bonneville this past weekend we averaged 17mpg there and closer to 19 on the way back. That was loaded with 4 adults and a metric ton of camping gear and booze. I figure the car weighed in at close to 6000lbs. I was a tad disappointed that it didn't get closer to 20mpg like usual, but we were doing 75-90 the entire way and the winds were really bad the entire way there. Tailwind the entire way back which helped the mpg quite a bit.

    A word of caution though, the C6 may fit really close to the trans tunnel and you may need to "motivate" the clearance here and there with a hammer. The area directly above the servo on mine had to be moved up about 1/2" for clearance. The old Curse-O-Matic I had was physically slightly smaller in the bellhousing and case than the C6 I have in there now. Driveshafts, at least for my car, were identical in length between the COM and the C6, you may luck out as well.
     
  21. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    I think I'm going to go with the 352 w/ 3speed. I want this to be as painless as possible and the 352 was offered as an option that year, so <should> drop right in. Plus at $150 for a running motor and tranny less than 90miles from my house....you just can't beat that. She's just going to have to get used to the 3 on the tree.

    Rockabillydave- out of curiousity.... where did you order that kit from? My neighbor has a garage full of 302s maybe he'll come off one. Thanks.
     
  22. 57JoeFoMoPar
    Joined: Sep 14, 2004
    Posts: 4,451

    57JoeFoMoPar
    Member

    I'll second Rockabillydave on this one. If all you want to do is get more power and not spend a buttload of cash, then the SBF is easily the best way to go. Just keep the hood closed
     
  23. junkyardjeff
    Joined: Jul 23, 2005
    Posts: 7,364

    junkyardjeff
    Member

    I dont know where you were reading but 65 was the first year the FE was used in light duty trucks,64 on back had Y blocks and 223 sixes. My 66 came from the factory with a 352 and I have a friend that had a 65 f250 with a 352. 65 was also the first year for the 240 six which grew into the 300 and since 64 was the last year of the Y block what else would they have used. Jeff
     
  24. 390kid
    Joined: Dec 29, 2004
    Posts: 641

    390kid
    Member

    you should have no problems with the following; 58-59 332 , 58-64 352s, 61-62 mercury 352, 61-64 ford merc and t-bird 390s and 63-64 ford and merc 427s. the only thing you have to watch out for is exhuast manifolds especially with the truck motor. a big block c-6 is your best bet but the ford-o-matic and cruise-o-matic will get the job done too.
     
  25. Choptop
    Joined: Jun 19, 2001
    Posts: 3,303

    Choptop
    Member

    MAKE her help. She'll learn something, and she'll have some more ownership in the car when she's done. No help? No engine swap.
     
  26. 390kid
    Joined: Dec 29, 2004
    Posts: 641

    390kid
    Member

    i agree.
     
  27. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    I plan to get my payment in humor when I see her get to pressure wash the old crust and oil off the thing. Honestly....she breaks stuff..... like lots of stuff. I'm always fixing stuff she breaks. I figure that I'll want her as far away as possible when I'm doing this or I'll never finish it.
     
  28. dotcentral
    Joined: Apr 28, 2005
    Posts: 116

    dotcentral
    Member

    Didn't something changed with the motor mounts? The placement of the bolts that bolt the motor mounts to the block changed. I think your okay with a newer motor in an older vehicle. Or could be the other way around?
     
  29. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    The mounts on the 65 look farther forward than the placement on the 223. I might be crazy, but that's how they look. Wondering if maybe the earlier 352s had a different mount location than the later ones.
     
  30. oldsrocket
    Joined: Oct 31, 2004
    Posts: 2,146

    oldsrocket
    Member

    ok, after some consideration, I have decided to give her a 302 w/ AOD. My neighbor has a runner for $300 and rockabillydave hooked me up with a source for the mounts that should make it an easy swap.

    I'm a GM guy and new to this whole 302 and AOD stuff. I have heard things about reverse rotation water pumps on these motors. What was the purpose and how can I tell if I need to switch it? Also, what is the easiest way to Identify an AOD?

    Thanks for the help on this guys. Time for this GM guy to start learning fords quirks.
     

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