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51 Ford Shoebox Trunk Help Request.

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by grf-x, Oct 22, 2012.

  1. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    Morning H.A.M.B.ers

    I could really use some advice here. I am about to embark on my first major sheet metal surgery on my 1951 ford fordor. Yeah yeah I know... virgin. LOL

    Talk about junk in the trunk... It amazes me the skills some people have with hiding bad sheet metal fill bonder/filler. So I have come to the conclusion that it ALL has to go.

    I plan on replacing the complete trunk floor and tail pan with EMS sheet metal. I could rally use help with a plan of attack.

    Few notes, I am a beginner at welding. I am using a flux core wire, because I have yet to make to jump to gas shielding. Other tools at my disposal... cheap bead roller and 36" sheet metal brake, power tools, and hand tools.

    Below are the parts I plan on using. One thing I have notice. The perimeter flanges go up. In the factor sheet metal they go down. This make it a bit easier so I dont have to weld above me. I plan I butt welding the part together and spot welding the the floor the fenders and roll pan. Open to suggestions to that plan.

    I am just not sure where to begin. I already have an alignment issue with the trunk lid. So I need to factor this in.

    Do I start with the roll pan or the floors first?

    Ford Spare tire wheel well
    [​IMG]

    trunk floor (left and right) trunk floor extension
    [​IMG]

    Full roll pan
    [​IMG]

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    I did ask the guy on the phone from EMS and all I got was start from the inside and work your way. He didn't seem to sure though. I wish I could remember his name.
     
  3. Damn, I bet that metal cost a bundle :eek:. Good luck, and take photo's, lots of shoebox owners will be interested on how it go's.
     
  4. buster6972
    Joined: Apr 3, 2007
    Posts: 234

    buster6972
    Member
    from Florida

    We left the roll pan and inserted the floors to keep the trunk structure. Just a heads up, these pans do not fit perfectly, they may need some help getting in. I am no metal man either, but it was much easier than replacing the inner and outer rocker panels.
     

  5. flathead4d
    Joined: Oct 24, 2005
    Posts: 894

    flathead4d
    Member

    Check the new spare tire well pan carefully. I'm told the replacments are narrower than the originals.
     
  6. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    Did you eventually replace the rollpan? Did you spot weld the the inside of the fenders?

    Yea I am finding out that the fit is not true. I but I am getting there. I work full time in IT and deal with some pretty arrogant and stupid people. So reshaping the metal here and there is therapeutic.
     
  7. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    I will do my best to document. I am creating a build book for prosperity. Maybe a beginner article for a tech week :)
     
  8. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    That was the first piece I purchased, which also help me discover the all hidden issues with the floor. The right side piece i purchase did not have the factory whole for the spare wheel well cut out... So that should not be an issue. Thanks for the 411 though. That part is actually a universal part but they list it as different part names in the catalog with the same part number.
     
  9. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    Any one else? :)
     
  10. pimpin paint
    Joined: May 31, 2005
    Posts: 4,937

    pimpin paint
    Member
    from so cal

    Hey,

    You mentioned you're new to this and your going with a flux core welder:eek: I won't say you can't do top drawer welding of sheetmetal with a flux core unit, but an argon/CO2 and some.023 wire would sure be easier! A flux core weld on sheetmetal is, at best, kinda a ''splatter finish'' and will require much grinding to clean up:(
    I'd go with leaving the tailpan in, until you've finished the floor & wheelhouses. This method will help hold the quarters in alignment to the deck lid opening whyle cutting and welding.

    ' looks like a fun project!


    " A government by the people, for the people " my ass!
     
  11. manyolcars
    Joined: Mar 30, 2001
    Posts: 8,655

    manyolcars

    consider using a Mustang gas tank in place of a floor. The Mustang tank gives you a new tank, a new floor and no need of the spare well. If you really want the well, split it in two and add a strip wide enough that your spare will actually fit

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    If voting changed anything, it would be outlawed!
     
  12. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    Thanks pimpin' paint.
     
  13. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    manyolcars

    Thanks for the idea. I have a new stock style tank already. The 16's that came with the car pits fine in the replacement well. I will have fab a new bracket to secure the spare too.
     
  14. ems customer service
    Joined: Nov 15, 2006
    Posts: 2,598

    ems customer service
    Member

    10-23-12

    to: gr-x

    thanks for buying our parts

    i understand you bought the trunk floor 3 pcs and the spare tire well.

    and that you may buy the roll pan in the future..

    i would advie not to weld the trunk floor in place, when you go to o the rollpan it will probally have to cut out/loose.

    why?

    the first order is to make the outside of the car look good,

    the trunk lid and roll pan will need to be installed. to make a good looking trunk lid gap and fitting the rollpan the rear of the body will require adjustment

    this means the 1/4 panels will need to be moved up/down and in/out . we want to fit the 1/4’s and roll pan to the trunk lid.

    as said this make the car look good. the trunk floor then can be welded in place and any adjustment to the trunk floor will not be cosmetic ( let the trunk fall into place, trim were needed and leave it there) minor cutting and grinding will be needed.

    your other question of tabs and such are non issue’s makes no difference if the tab is up or down unless your going to build a zillion doller “aaca” perfect resto.

    this whole theroy applies to the doors also, make them look good then do the inside of the car. you can trim the floor to fit and then it done, trying to do fit outer panels when the floor is done means you will have to cut it loose to adjuest the doors.

    remember after 60 years the car do sag and shift and when you cut a panel it relives the stress of the metal forming operation and the part moves a little.

    do not get discourage if you started in the wrong place this is a common mistake.

    we have caught the issue early and it will be ok, were having fun now!

    the ems guy
     
  15. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    First. This is a great reply.

    One question. If I read this correctly, when I do the roll pan first... is this with the old trunk floor still in place?!?! If so, i wont be able the move the quarter panels since the are attached to the old floor.

    I have not remove the old floor yet and the body is still on the frame. I have been placing the pieces over the old floor to get a general Idea of fitment.
     
  16. ems customer service
    Joined: Nov 15, 2006
    Posts: 2,598

    ems customer service
    Member

    if the trunk needs to be replaced cause of rust. the 1/4's will move, if not then cutting the old trunk floor is ok. you do not want to cut out to much at time, go slowly and do not try to out smart yourself, each car is a bit different.

    also the trunk lid seal by the tailpan/roolpan on a 49-51 ford is unique, it has no room for adjustment must be dead on, get a trunk seal from dennis carpenter to use when installing the rollpan, also trunk hinges need to be wiggle free
     
  17. grf-x
    Joined: Jul 15, 2010
    Posts: 299

    grf-x
    Member

    So I got a couple idea of how the get the 1/4s to move/spread out from tail/roll pan... but how would one get the 1/4 to move in toward it. It's just me and my shop dog. My wife and 6 year old are not going to provide any strength. LOL
     

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