$5,000 TRADITIONAL Rod, can it be done?

That question/challenge got me really thinking. I said it CANNOT be done- but looking at the responses I realized YES it could be done, but you can also get a .39cent hamburger or a $50.00 one depending on your taste. I've eaten PLENTY of .39cent hamburgers, but when I think of GOOD hamburgers I gotta plan on spending 6 or 7 bucks. Same with hot rods. It can be done REALLy cheap, but to really get excited about something your gonna need more than what you can find in the couch cushions.
What I'm talking about is REAL traditional hot rods- and for this you need an original Ford body (yes, the cowl of an old Maxwell you found in the desert for free WILL work, but will it be a "traditional hot rod"- nope), a dropped I-beam axle (again that $10-dollar Model a stocker WILL work, but tradition HOT ROD, another nope), an interesting engine with some form of speed goodies (they aren't cheap & grungy junk yard smog era 350s don't count), cool old gauges, steering wheel, wheels, tires, rearend, brakes- that stuff ALL costs money.

So here's my list of the needed parts and I realize 95% of the HAMBers that actually own hot rods do their own wrenchin' so I won't even add labor into the mix. I don't know what the total would be, just thinking out loud.

Frame
Axle
Spring
Spring bolts
Shackeles
Perches
Spindles
King Pins
Shocks
Shock mounts
Wishbones
Tie Rod
Steering
Drag link
Front brakes
Engine
Trans
Shifter
Engine mounts
Trans mounts
Pedals
Master Cylinder
Brake Lines
Driveshaft
Rearend
Rear brakes
Rear spring
Rear shocks
Body
Steering wheel
Column
Dash
Gauges
Seats
Glass
Wiring
Headlights
Taillights
Rims
Tires
Caps
Rings
Tons of little things like fasteners, belts, hoses, clamps (I built a REALLY cheap truck for another magazine I was at and just the stuff needed to revive this junk yard hulk added up to almost 2 grand of nickle and dime runs to kragen and the harware store. This truck was built from all recycled junk yard parts except what was TOTALLY necessary for safety. I cleaned a lot of old bolts and even recycled an original old rubber floormat.)
PAINT
UPHOLSTERY

Yeah, it can be done for 5k, but is it finished? Or it could be with another 10K worth of paint & upholstery. I totally commend anyone who can build one super cheap, but ask Rudy what he spent to build his super cool homebuilt '40 Coupe (a TRADITIONAL hot rod) and he would wish it was near 10K.
Just getting it on the road doesn't count- and maybe our ideas of "traditional hot rods" is worlds apart.

 

Didn't Rizzo say he was going to attempt a follow up to the budget beater and do it for $5000, or was I dreaming?

 

Maybe he did, but he left the magazine.

 

ill have mine on the road for under five grand... i guess mine will be a porkeys TWIN BURGER...

Tuck

 

As for the hamburger, I think the best hamburgers are White castle and there .50 each So I say yes it can be done but with time and patiance.. You would have to shop out all the parts old and used and do all the work your self.. Sounds like fun!

 

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I think the best hamburgers are White castle

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mmm, White Castle

 

I think one big factor is how much NETWORKING you do.

To build one using resources like the HAMB is more do-able. Or Does your Dad's friend have some duece rails hangin' in the rafters? (ha ha Gow!) Or are you gonna shop in the Speedway Catalog or on eGay?

 

with some horse tradin' & a little work I have assembeled almost all the parts to build a Trad car for very little money. I bought a '28 Pontiac & sold a few stock parts. I have 2 cowls, 2 sets of doors, a grill shell, 1 body & a frame for about $400. I scored a complete '38 ford suspension for free & a flathead for $150. I also did some tradin & got another flathead & 3 speed for almost nuthin' out of a running car. I bought a complete Model A chassis for $250, sold it for $500 a couple of months later for $500 & kept the V8 wire wheels. My goal is to finish it for $3000. That is with out paint & it will have a very sparce interior. I think you can do it you just can't build a '32 for $5000 but you CAN build a Trad car cheap if you take your time & do a lot of work. You CANNOT do it fast.

 

Char-Grill here in Raleigh has the best Hamburgers and for $5.50 you get a drink and fries to boot. As for the $5k thing. I sure hope so. I've got just over $100 in a chassis right now. and $400 in a body. I'll have about $1k in the motor. $600 for bellhousing, clutch, and tranny. That leaves a bunch to finish. I've got most of the little stuff sitting around... we'll see...

 

About $4600 into mine with mill and tranny. No paint yet. Should have her running enough to get to the pileup next weekend!

 

Paint & interior should not cost $10000 if you do most of that yourself. That is the key. You have to do as much of the work as you can yourself. Your opinion of a Trad Hot rod must be all Ford with a dropped axle & slick show car paint & interior. That may be hard for $5000.

 

There was a post awhile back that asked what it cost to build your hot rod. There were several nice cars on that post that were built on the cheap. I think it can be done if you just take your time and do a lot of searching.

 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think the best hamburgers are White castle

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mmm, White Castle

[/ QUOTE ]

My favorite's the Fur Burger.....mmmmmm.....

 

Jim, I think the BIG ELEPHANT that you're ignoring is what can the builder do.

Some guys can take a pile of flat sheet metal in different thicknesses and a donor '40 chassis and with a little networking build a good looking rod. Those same guys have a decade of metal expereience and a variety of tools that they KNOW how to use. They could build your trad' rod for $3000 finished.

On the other hand, some suburban dweller with a wallet, a so-cal catalog, and some hand tools STILL can't get one together.

You've got to have resources in addition to cash.

 

Not really I guess.....[here anyways]-unless you have a lot of gifts from goodhearted buddies.
My '30 Roadster is just about half done-it runs and drives but still needs quite a lot to run right and the body work is barely started AND JUST A SEAT.Yes probly snickered at too.
I figured up what I think I have in it and I am sure I missed something. also it is just basic as hell no frills at all.
counting money spent-NO LABOR AGAIN-CONSTANTLY BEING CHEAP and not counting what was free from friends [and there were several who gave me parts]
also it does not have a dropped axle and I believe its trad..... No?
I came up with 5,386 dollars......I am not going to sell it so I would do a list/breakdown- if anyone cares.

 

This is a good discussion. I think it can be done, but it takes time and patience.

I have about $3000 in this pile...



...but I have been collecting parts for a long time and fixing junk for the the last year to get it to where it is. I still have a long way to go on the fixing junk end of it.

But that $3000 includes things like new tires, 32 Chrysler gauge panel, 36 Banjo wheel, roadster windshield, original hood, firewall, shell and insert plus alot of the small pieces.

Here is Jim's list

Frame $25 (rough but real 32)+ $130 front horns
Axle $30 Moredrop
Spring $10, reversed myself
Spring bolts $5
Shackeles $10
Perches $15
Spindles free from a "street rod" update
King Pins free from a "street rod" update
Shocks $10
Shock mounts trade
Wishbones $35 + free welded together
Tie Rod $1
Steering free from a "street rod" update
Drag link $2
Front brakes free from a "street rod" update
Engine free running flathead, it will get rings and bearings
Trans $100 T-5 + $100 adapter
Shifter $5
Engine mounts Fabricated
Trans mounts $8
Pedals $35
Master Cylinder $40
Brake Lines not done yet
Driveshaft not done yet
Rearend free from a "street rod" update
Rear brakes free from a "street rod" update
Rear spring free from a "street rod" update
Rear shocks $50
Body $1000 (cab, doors, bed, tailgate, hood, shell, insert)
Seats $50
Glass not done yet
Wiring not done yet
Headlights Free + $30 headlight bar
Taillights $30
Rims free
Tires $500
Caps $30
Rings $20

That is about $2000 plus another $1000 in little parts.

It should be running and driving for under $5000 and painted, plated and upholstered for under $10000.

I am sure alot don't view my jalopy as a real 32, but it is close enough for me.

Neal

 

I was hoping to have my Model A ready for the HAMB drags next summer. If I spend more than $5000.00, you're all invited to my "I'm single again" party. The truth is that I have a bunch of parts laying around. I don't thik some one could start from scratch and have much for $5000.00 total. Be realistic we're not talking about a Monster Garage budget where "freebee's" don't count.

 

And Neil you just had another 5.0 shake down test for free!

Looking good there bud.

 

[ QUOTE ]
I think one big factor is how much NETWORKING you do.

To build one using resources like the HAMB is more do-able. Or Does your Dad's friend have some duece rails hangin' in the rafters? (ha ha Gow!) Or are you gonna shop in the Speedway Catalog or on eGay?

[/ QUOTE ]

In other words, if you are getting a lot of parts for way less than current average market value or outright free.

...Like if daddy GIVES you GrandPa's 3 window Deuce '50's street rod that's been in the garage for 45 years, that just needs the '39 brakes gone through, 97 carbs, tank flushed and some new upholstery and paint, then you MIGHT be able to get it done for under $5000, as long as you don't have a "name" painter or upholsterer do that work.
But at current average market value, a "traditional quality" (only 20 years old in the 50's so it hasn't rusted at all yet) body and frame alone are going to run more than that. Doesn't have to be the Deuce either. Even Model A parts are going to be that much...Unless you get them free or under average market value.

Selling off parts of donor cars doesn't work against the cost either because pleanty of people scrap out cars for a living without counting the INCOME against some other project. You could just as easily say it made your house cost less...You spent $X to buy that part and happened to get a whole car wrapped around it, that part still cost the same $X. You sell off the rest of the donor, thats just doing business dealing in scrap metal (without a license)You probably bought beer with that money anyway. Beer doesn't count unless it's the bribe to get your friends to help lift the body off the frame for the fourth time...See?

If you're not buying new from Speedway then you're risking a part, like an axle for instance, being junk or needing forging or machine work.
SO like Jim said, your own labor doesn't count, but you really need to devalue your mill and lathe costs into that cost since you'd be farming out that machine work if you didn't have them, right?
and if you buy three of some part before you get a "good one" to use, like flatheads that don't have too many cracks to use, then the cost of that whole search process needs to be counted.
Gas to pick up, or search for "field cars" a couple dozen swap meet admission prices?
They are al part of the cost of that build, aren't they?
Or do you REALLY go to the swap meet just to socialize?

Jim said something about a good, interesting, hotrod engine, or something like that.
How do you know it's good if YOU don't overhaul it?
A $150 junkyard engine that happens to run isn't a hotrod engine, Add at least another $1000.
Id say, with today's paint materials prices, if you paint it yourself and get the lady up the street with a power machine to do some plain T&R it'll still be closer to $7000, plus the chrome bill, of course.
Yea, I think you have to include paint and upholstery....

Remember Tex Smith's $1 a pound hotrod? That was proposed way back when, at a 1950's value $1, not a 2004 value $1

 

R&C has done a couple of these,where some guy put together a kick ass car real cheap.

Of course he already had a bunch of the parts so they didn't count towards the budget,
and/or made some "once in a life time,almost too good to be true" trades
to get the parts that would have broken the budget,
and/or got a pile of freebie used parts from one of his gold chainer friends,
and/or got freebie parts/services from magazine advertisers.


The cost of the tools,welder,floor jack,axle stands,drill press,grinder,garage space,materials on hand,etc seem to get lost in the story.

 

Yes Grimlok- I agree a dropped axle is not a necessity.[just an opinion]

 

This is a good question,

I just built a very traditional model a coupe on original
duece rails and a flathead.

I had never done a tally but this seems like a good idea

Frame $600 original 32 frame, yes I know it is a screeming deal but you could use a pair of new rails for 600.

Axle $265 wide beam 32 axle dropped by guy in az

Spring $20 reverse eye 32 spring, swap meet

Spring bolts
Shackeles $20 swap meet orignals with new bronze bushings

Perches $35

Spindles $40 37-40ford swapmeet find

King Pins $30 new

Shocks $10 chrome p&j swapmeet

Shock mounts $55 new lower mounts

Wishbones $200 unsplit 32 off ford barn, came with axle

Tie Rod $free off junker F1

Steering $25

Drag link $ free off junker F1

Front brakes $150 rebuilt 40's ford, with old chrome backing
plates

Engine $500 rebuilt ford flathead with ajustable lifters and circle track cam, I know this was a screaming deal as well

Heads $300 Edmunds finned aluminum, includes shaving and testing

intake $125 weiand high rise 2x2, good trade

carbs $65 2 strombergs, traded $25 for two cores and rebuilt myself

Trans $400 rebuilt 39 ford, I over spent here as I later found one for $60 at swap, but the $400 is in the car

Shifter $0 came with tranny

Engine mounts $20 new


Trans mounts $50 pricey for the stock 32 k member mount

Pedals $60 39 ford pedals from slazzen

Master Cylinder $95 new

Brake Lines $100 this includes rebuild kits for wheel cylinders, lines, hoses, and fittings

Driveshaft $80 to have shortened, shaft came with rearend

Rearend $100 41ford banjo

Rear brakes $0 came with rear end rebuilt

Rear spring $0 came with rear

Rear shocks $20 swapmeet

Body $225 for two model a coupe which became one
+ $50 for decklid, another screeming deal

Seats $free bus seat

Glass $free cut down stock glass myself

Wiring $30 wiring harness at swapmeet cloth covered

Headlights $25 chrome blc swapmeet,including new lights

Taillights $free pontiac junker

Rims $40 16" steelies found on cars and farms blasted and painted myself

Tires $490 firestone deluxe champions new

Caps $0 none

Rings $40 16" ribbed beauties swapmeet.

Grill $65 original 32 steel shell swap meet find

insert $125 original 32 ebay find

Dash $20 32 chevy dash with gauges

steering wheel $45 38 buick banjo wheel

So my tally is $4,520
I added a few things not on your list

pretty damn close, with out some really good deals
I can see how it would be tough, but obviously it can
be done.

I gathered parts for about 6 months and then built it
in 2 months and 1 week.

I will try to find a pic and post my car. this pic has
a 32 pu grill a had for $250 but the 32 car grill is on
it now.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Didn't Rizzo say he was going to attempt a follow up to the budget beater and do it for $5000, or was I dreaming?

[/ QUOTE ]

Rizzo was going to build a 32 3-window(glass of course) out of all new parts with a budget of 25 grand.

I think there are a lot of cars out there built for less than 5 grand. It would involve a lot of dealing, scrounging, free stuff, buddy networking etc but it is possible. Maybe not with a kick ass high horse engine or flawless paint and awesome tuck and roll inside, but with a good running stocker engine with an intake, carbs and headers, a nice suede job and mexi blankets. Patience and ingenuity would go a long way. Fab skills, too. That brings up another point - tools. They make all the difference in the world. There is only so much you can do with wrenches and screwdrivers.

My current "project" is working on getting my garage set up for something more serious than changing spark plugs. I'm working toward an air compressor and some tools, and a MIG for starters.

This is way more interesting than bitching about vee-dubs isn't it?

 

I'm sure it can be done, just depends on how you do the math. I still have the channeled 1930 Model A Roadster body I found @ 1962. Got it for free IF I cleaned out the guys garage. That was the start of a lifetime of fleamarket parts sales. Actually sold the body, then got it back 20 years later in a labor trade nothing had changed except for the garages it was stored in. If you start with a pile of parts say $500 worth, eBay the stuff and keep investing the profit in more parts to roll over, you could fund a very nice ride. Keeping it out of the general cost of living funds is the REAL hard part.

 

well hell Jim, now you gotta define a traditional hot rod...

good luck!

Frame- free
Axle- trade.
Spring- already attached to axle
Spring bolts- came with frame
Shackeles- already attached to spring
Perches- attached to axle
Spindles- ""
King Pins- new bushings, I had em.
Shocks- $12 ea. x4
Shock mounts- free F1
Wishbones- attached to axle
Tie Rod- new ends $30
Steering- trade
Drag link- offa free stock model a front suspension
Front brakes- $100
Engine- trade. 39 Merc. .040 over, Isky cam, dual Strombergs. hot rod enough?!?!
Trans- came in free 38 chassis
Shifter- attached to trans
Engine mounts- F1 free
Trans mounts- stole it outta free 38 chassis
Pedals- ditto
Master Cylinder- $35
Brake Lines- haven't done it yet
Driveshaft- came with banjo
Rearend- trade
Rear brakes- $100
Rear spring- free model a roadster
Rear shocks- priced em up there
Body- super duper huge trade of the gawdamn century
Seats- came with the body
Glass- came with the body
Wiring- $40
Headlights- free
Taillights- $15
Rims- trade
Tires- fronts free, rears $100
Caps- none
Rings- free

I don't agree with anything Dr.J said either.

 

Problem is... people have different ideas about what constitutes a traditional hot rod or custom...

redbeard comes about as close as you can get... when finished with rust repair and bodywork... he'll have a traditional hot rod for about as cheap as you can build one...

I guess I'm just one that would like to see the term "traditional" kept semi-pure... call the rest "nostalgic" hot rods or something... Or maybe just call them "traditionally styled" hot rods...

Also, a way to have a contest would be to offer the car up for sale for 5k after the contest was finished... that would keep the honest people honest... maybe put it on e-bay for a "buy it now" price of 5k??? Have people write in to the magazine telling why they think they would be able to build a traditionally styled car for under 5k... the magazine pics 6 contestants... they can get sponsors if they'd like... they front the money, build the car and then R&C auctions them off and gets the money back to the builder to pay his out of pocket expenses... you are disqualified if you don't auction the car with a buy it now price of 5k and and then R&C makes you the laughing stock of the world...

Sam.

 

Great eye opener! I would have NEVER thought Neal and Grimlocks car could be that far along for that little of coin- DAMN resourseful guys! That's so awesome- I like to be proved incorrect when it's something I admire as much as your two cars. I wish I had that patience and talent. GREAT WORK! I have over 5K in mine and the chassis and driveline were FREE.

 

Want to triple you money Neal? No gold chainer can do that- and that's one of the many reasons I'm a life-long traditionalist!

 

I'll have to add to Grimlock and Choprods ideas...now I sure as shit wasn't alive in the 50s so I don't know, but I'm sure that every hot rod on the street didn't have ALL of the goodies. I'm sure the legendary cars that we see or hear about from back in the day had A,B,C,D,E,F,G,and H (insert speed parts for letters). But for the average guy building back in the day, I'm sure alot of them only had A,C, and D, or C,B,H or....well you get the idea. I don't think it needs all of those things to be considered a hot rod. Shit, a bone stock Model A Coupe looks pretty nasty just by removing the hood and sides.