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Technical 389 to 455 Pontiac Swap

Discussion in 'Traditional Customs' started by speedysilver, Apr 30, 2018.

  1. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Over due weekly update.... not a lot of progress this week as my dad was in Canada this week for work... hoping to have more to update you guys on as the week progresses...


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  2. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Well guys here is the post you have been waiting for… the moment of truth where the motor and trans actually gets dropped in and we see where the issues lie… need to build an adapter for the crossmember… we knew we were going to have to do that… need to figure out the linkages… shift linkage… throttle linkage…etc. mainly the only interference we had was with the exhaust flange on the steering box/arm… going to have my exhaust guy look at it and hopefully he can rework the header a bit to get it all to fit so all in all I feel only minor issues and or things that we knew we were going to have to tackle… ill try to get some more pictures today…


    Keep Calm and Build On…
     

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  3. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Alright guys im thinking I have ran into our first major problem… everything went in accessories bolted on shift and throttle linkages being made… everything is going together great nut it looks like hood/air cleaner clearance may be a problem… any advice would be great… yes I have looked and seen other posts about low profile air cleaners but nothing is really coming up as a solution I actually like so here I am… any advice would be great.

    Thanks
    mike
     
  4. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    It would be interesting to compare the height to the top of the air cleaner for your 455 setup compared to the stock 389 setup if you can find a reference point that is the same for both blocks. Your 455 setup looks a lot higher than stock (obviously). Drop base air cleaner an option?
     
  5. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    It would be interesting to compare the height to the top of the air cleaner for your 455 setup compared to the stock 389 setup if you can find a reference point that is the same for both blocks. Your 455 setup looks a lot higher than stock (obviously). Drop base air cleaner an option?
     
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  6. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    If I recall correctly my dad looked at it the other day and said it look liked the manifold was taller than the one on my 389 and everything else was close to the same... been looking for one but it appears that the carb may hit with no air cleaner


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  7. The mounts on the block are in about the same relative position?

    There are two mount locations, the second-gen Trans Am blocks have them further back and (I think) higher, but I wouldn't think if you had mounts there it would even bolt to the stock 59 mounts. (some blocks are drilled and tapped for both, some just one).

    I can't see where a 455 is that much taller than the 389, the changes are all internal. In fact I had a late distributor installed on a '59 389 block and it was literally a bolt on.

    Unless the intake itself puts the carb up higher somehow. But it would have to be super tall to hit the hood.
     
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  8. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    It appears that the manifold is about 1-1.5 height than the original and with a different carb and air cleaner I think it’s putting me to high...


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  9. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    Maybe you've done this already or don't care.....whatever. I measured from the top of the air cleaner to the top edge of one of the inner valve cover bolt heads (highest edge) on my totally stock 2 barrel setup on my 60 Ventura. That distance is basically 6.75 (6-3/4 ) inches. You could easily check the same on your 455 setup if you want to get a rough idea of the difference. The 59 & 60 intake setups are essentially identical for all practical purposes.
     
    loudbang likes this.
  10. The air cleaner on that 2bbl is pretty tall, you aught to be able to take yours off and take the stud out and close the hood. Maybe stick a block of clay in there somewhere so you can figure out what the actual clearance is?
     
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  11. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    I measured just the air cleaner on my totally stock 2 barrel (see above post). The overall max height is 3-15/16 inches from the bottom to the very top (which has a small raised conical shape). To just the top flat surface it's 3-3/4 inches. However, the air cleaner has somewhat of a drop base design. From the air cleaner lower base which sits on the carb inlet to the very top (small raised conical shape) of the air cleaner is just 2-7/8 inches.....just a hair over 1 inch less than the max overall height. I think all of these 59/60 Pontiacs came with a sound deadening pad under the hood as delivered, or at least the design allowed for it. The thickness of that pad is approx. 3/4 to 1 inch, so that space is available.
     
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  12. Gman0046
    Joined: Jul 24, 2005
    Posts: 5,244

    Gman0046
    Member

    No pad on my 60 Poncho.
     
  13. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    My plan is to stop speculating go home Sunday put the hood on and see how big of an issue it’s actually going to be...


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  14. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    Neither does mine (now)....took it off cause it was crappy. I'm saying they were all designed to allow for it, so that space above the stock 60 air cleaners is available..that's all.
     
  15. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    I bet there's only a couple inches clearance with the original stock 389 setup...just an educated guess on my part. Your 455 manifold and air cleaner look high (or thick) to me. Good luck.
     
  16. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

  17. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Haven’t gotten home yet to put the hood on and check for sure


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  18. sunbeam
    Joined: Oct 22, 2010
    Posts: 3,724

    sunbeam
    Member

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  19. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Alright guys here is the update. I went home last weekend and made it out to check out the progress on the car. I set the carb and air cleaner on the engine. It appears that it will most likely fit. We will probably have to remove some insulation from the bottom of the hood.

    That’s plan A. for plan B well I’m toying with the idea of the Ford/Pontiac super duty hood scoop. Please excuse my dirty pans in the background of the photo I was doing dishes when I got distracted and remember I still had yet to take my new eBay purchase out of the box. Still considering using this hood scoop even if the hood doesn’t fit otherwise im going to fix the dents the studs and prime it and list it for sale on here.
     

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  20. No, no , no
    (did I say no yet?)
     
  21. Poncho60
    Joined: Jan 23, 2011
    Posts: 164

    Poncho60
    Member
    from N Illinois

    Definitely not a fan of the SD scoop idea. Doesn't fit the character of the car. Just my opinion. Do what you want, your car. In closing, UGH!
     
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  22. '51 Norm
    Joined: Dec 6, 2010
    Posts: 620

    '51 Norm
    Member
    from colorado

    Ya know I did something like that back in the day. Fortunately for me there are no pictures of it and so according to the HAMB rules it didn't happen.
     
  23. carbking
    Joined: Dec 20, 2008
    Posts: 2,324

    carbking
    Member

    Plan C ?????

    Pontiac used a "wraparound" air cleaner for hood clearance on some models in the late 1960's and early 1970's. Fits the Q-Jet perfectly (well, it was designed for it). Will not fit the e-clone or a Holley.

    Probably would mean keeping hood insulation, and no scoop necessary.

    Of course the Q-Jet, a stock cast iron Pontiac intake, and the wraparound air cleaner are not as "kool" as the shiny chrome and aluminum; they just work better on the Pontiac, and get significantly better fuel economy. ;):p:D

    I know, nobody but me cares anything about fuel economy. Everyone else on here is either independently wealthy, or owns stock in Shell Oil! :p

    Nice car, have fun.

    Jon.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2018
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  24. speedysilver
    Joined: Nov 6, 2008
    Posts: 157

    speedysilver
    Member

    Well just for all the nay sayers that said it couldn’t be done... I’ll post the video to YouTube later and post the link [​IMG]




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