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Featured Hot Rods 351 Ford Horsepower

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Boneyard51, Nov 6, 2018.

  1. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    A friend and I are going to try to build some horsepower into a Ford 351. We are open to suggestions! 351 Windsor? Cleveland? Modified? Windsor with Cleveland heads?
    Let me know what you have done that works! Plus anybody have any speed parts for this build? We are starting from scratch! Thanks in advance!


    Bones
     
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  2. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 2,433

    southcross2631
    Member

    Check with Jimmy Huff who runs with Southeast Gassers. He builds some bad ass Clevelands.
    A 351 Windsor bored and stroked to 408 with a good set of aftermarket heads can make some good power. How much do you need?
    I bought some CNC ported Promaxx heads for my Windsor project, but AFR and a few more will work.
    You didn't say what the application was for. Street driving or track only.
     
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  3. What's your budget, and what's its intended use? Street or street/strip, I'd go Windsor. Track only, Cleveland. A 351M/400 only if doing it on the cheap...
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2018
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  4. We ran Clevelands in one of our stock cars, made tons of power. I like how they look too over the Windsor.
     
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  5. Deuces
    Joined: Nov 3, 2009
    Posts: 15,260

    Deuces
    Member
    from Michigan

    I bought a brand new Lightning Windsor short block and installed the X-303 roller cam in it... Along with trick-flow twisted wedge heads.... A Victor Jr. intake, Barry Grant "gold claw" carb..... Runs like a raped ape.... :confused::cool:
     
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  6. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 649

    RmK57
    Member

    Budget has a lot to do with either a Cleveland or Windsor. Personally I'd go with a 408 Windsor and if the budget allows use a Dart block and build a 460 Windsor.
    Clevelands are kind of pricey these days as they only made them for 3-4 years. If money was no object then a Yates C3 headed stroker would surely scare the mice away.:D
     
  7. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    Thanks for the responses, I guess I should add some more info. Have to stay at 355 cubes, have to be iron stock type heads. Going to circle track race engine. I know that’s not quite HAMB friendly, but horsepower is horsepower. Not sure which combo we are going to go with. Would kinda like to build out of the box... mixing and matching parts for more power. Hopefully someone here has some experience they would like to share. Thanks.


    Bones
     
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  8. topher5150
    Joined: Feb 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,106

    topher5150
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  9. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 9,841

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Do you know Jack Roush?
     
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  10. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

     
  11. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 4,083

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    This is the wrong website for that question. Did you read the guidelines? Chevys in a ford, I thought we were all on the same page here?
     
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  12. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 9,841

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    He He!
     
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  13. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    Trying to do something different..... that’s kinda what hot rodding is all about. The engine really doesn’t know what it’s in. Lol


    Bones
     
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  14. What does the rule book look like? We did pretty good with cheater cams and stock style rocker arms. Twisted those up to 7k, less with the big blocks, those I ran at around 6300. If someone protested and put up the steep fee, you could get your engine torn down. We used to get puffed at Islip now and then after a good finish in the feature. The 429 Ford we had in a Torino was powerful with just a solid lifter cam added to it. But it was a '69 Mercury engine with the right heads. Your size limit is most likely a 358 for a Ford engine.
     
  15. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    At this time I don’t have a rule book, but know some of the rules. Has to be a 351 for a Ford, can be bored .030. Stock appearing heads, no aluminum heads, no obviously aftermarket heads. Can have aluminum intake. Flat top pistons only. Any cam. No roller rockers.
    We are going to try to stay legal, with stock heads and cubes. Compression is going to be a bit of a problem.
    Going to try to have this engine in the car for next spring.
    As for budget, we plan on spending some coins, but don’t have an unlimited budget.



    Bones
     
  16. brianf31
    Joined: Aug 11, 2003
    Posts: 335

    brianf31
    Member

    A 351C with closed chamber 4V heads and 10.5-11:1 CR is capable of 450hp on pump gas. Plenty of guys making north of 500hp with higher compression. The rods and crank will handle 7000rpm with minimal prep.

    Here's my 351C-2V.
    20180909_075726.jpg
    right front qtr.jpg
     
  17. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    That’s nice, always love to see a Ford engine in a hot rod.
    We are thinking 351 Cleveland, with 2barrel heads. Or 351 Windsor with 2 barrel Cleveland type heads. Have heard the 4 barrel heads are too big for circle track racing. I thought in racing nothing was “ too big “! Just trying to tap other people’s experiences.


    Bones
     
  18. Read up on the 400 based M Motors that Jon Kaase dominated the Engine Master's competition with for years. Lots of good info on getting the most out of an often over looked smog motor.
     
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  19. Engine man
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,446

    Engine man
    Member
    from Wisconsin

    We ran a 351 Windsor block with an offset ground crankshaft, 348 Chevrolet rods, 350 Chevy pro stock pistons, Chevy valves in the Ford Windsor heads in a circle track car. We tried running a Cleveland motor but the valve train didn't seem to like backing out of the throttle at 8,000 rpm for engine braking.
     
  20. What Frozen Merc said... I know that the 351M/400 is a popular motor among the 'budget' circle-track boys as they're pretty much unloved by drag racers because of their size/weight and limited speed parts so can usually be found cheap. Used in trucks and many Ford/Merc luxo-barge smogmobiles between '71 and '78. The early ('71-73) 400 blocks were cast with the SBF bellhousing pattern, all of the later blocks use the 429/460 bell pattern that limits trans choices.

    Next best choice would be a 351W shortblock with Cleveland heads, but there's more machine work needed and you're still limited on intakes or will need adaptors.

    I did a 351M in a later Bronco for a guy, used a 400 crank, moderate cam, intake and carb, ditched all the smog crap, and woke that Bronco right up...
     
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  21. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    That’s kinda what we are thinking 351W Cleveland heads. We know a guy that makes an intake for that set up. We’re wanting to give those Chevy boys a run for their money.

    That 351 M/400 was the first engine build that my son and I did, for his OT 79 Pick Up.
    When through about 5 blocks before we found one that was not cracked by the lifters. Stock other than RV cam Holley 500. Ran good. He still has it, today. And that was 20 some years ago.



    Bones
     
  22. BadgeZ28
    Joined: Oct 28, 2009
    Posts: 911

    BadgeZ28
    Member
    from Oregon

    There is so much to making the power you need. Car weight, transmission or in and out box, track size, etc. A higher RPM motor will be good for one application while a torque beast another. I suggest you find a track forum and ask there. Finding someone with a similar setup would be ideal.
     
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  23. RmK57
    Joined: Dec 31, 2008
    Posts: 649

    RmK57
    Member

    B&A used to sell a Cleveland head to Windsor block intake. I think they had track boss and a street boss. I would think their quite hard to come by today.
     
  24. H380
    Joined: Sep 20, 2015
    Posts: 336

    H380
    Member
    from Louisiana

    https://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/61699/10002/-1

    Designed to work with the 351C, 351M, and 400M, they feature very streetable 190cc intake runners with 2.05" intake and 1.60" exhaust valves that provide more than enough volume for outstanding power to 6500+ rpm. Not only do they offer superior flow over a stock Cleveland or 351/400M head, but they also offer the flexibility to work on the standard 302 or 351 Windsor block to build your own version of a Boss 302, or the infamous "Clevor" engine! The intake and exhaust ports are in the stock location to further add to the streetability of these heads, and can be made to breathe even better with minor port work. Made In The USA!
     
  25. Trick Flow also makes a conversion manifold for the 351W with C heads.
     
  26. Boneyard51
    Joined: Dec 10, 2017
    Posts: 1,228

    Boneyard51
    Member

    We understand the circle track cars, my friend has been racing since 1979 and owned Thunderbird Speedway in Muskogee, Okla which is a half mile dirt track measured on the inside. The biggest half mile track on the planet.
    His car was track champion at the outlaw track year before last.
    We are just into new territory with this Ford project.



    Bones .
     
  27. GordonC
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 1,110

    GordonC
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    While this topic is going on can anyone tell me if Boss 302 heads will install on a 351 W and if they are worth the effort at all? Or are they pretty much the same thing as the Cleveland heads? Got a set and no plans for em yet.
     
  28. Boss 302 heads are more than a bit big for a street motor, but excellent if you're going racing. The Boss heads and Cleveland 4V heads share port sizes/combustion chambers, the Cleveland 2V heads are more street-friendly. Ford actually downsized the Boss valve sizes between the '69 and '70 versions to address that. One Boss 302 advantage is they're already machined for a Windsor block, so no monkey-motion there, plus they're set up for adjustable rockers and guideplates as-is.

    The best iron street heads with suitable prep are the 'Australian' versions. These have the 2V ports, with the smaller 4V combustion chambers. But if you're really after big power, the aftermarket versions with raised exhaust ports is the hot ticket...
     
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  29. GordonC
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 1,110

    GordonC
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Thanks Crazy Steve!
     
  30. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 9,279

    RichFox
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    If anybody around here, San Mateo, wants some Windsor, Cleveland and a M blocks heads and cranks. Drop on by. Free for the asking. Have some closed chamber 460 heads also. For them I would want some cash. Not a lot.
     
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