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Technical 31 Coupe TROG build

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by ghalperin, May 11, 2016.

  1. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    In late April I purchased a 31 Coupe Banger car and I'm planning on driving it in TROG at Pismo. The car is mostly traditional with a 5 inch chop.
    IMG_6503.JPG

    The engine wasnt running, due to a failed head gasket. The engine had a few bolt ons such as; Reds 4 into 2 headers, Thomas Dual intake with 81 Strombergs, Lions IV Aluminum head, FSI distributor and an alternator.
    IMG_7108.JPG

    I removed the head and cleaned up both surfaces, the gasket had failed due to corrosion on the steel ring around cylinder #1. I also noticed the begining of corrosion on the aluminum head. I plan to install a couple of sacrifical annodes in the cooling system. The starter and oil drain plug were missing, so it took a little time to source those.

    The engine started instantly and idled smothly. The engine sounds fairly quiet internally. I tried to set the timing, but at TDC, it stumbles and coughs. The idle is smoothest at 35 degrees BTDC. I took it for a road test and it ran very rough. The brakes were also pretty scary, but thats another story. I checked the distributor drive to see if the gear was loose, but it appears to be ok.

    What could cause the timing to like being that far advanced? Could the cam gear be off?

    The header only has a couple of turnouts just past the firewall. I need to add mufflers, but have found very few photos in my searches.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
  2. junk yard kid
    Joined: Nov 11, 2007
    Posts: 2,714

    junk yard kid
    Member

    Cool lookin set up. Check out the monthly banger meet, here on the hamb. The timing could be a few things, maybe points are way off (my fsi has points because screw petronics) or maybe your running too lean. Lean conditions take longer to burn.


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  3. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,218

    F&J
    Member

    I suppose I would try locating TDC with a tool or mechanics wire in the plug hole, then see if the dimple on the gear is close??? Bear in mind that I am not a Model A guru, so I am just assuming the dimple indicates TDC if the gear timing is correct? I sure could be wrong.

    .
     
  4. Model A Fan
    Joined: May 20, 2010
    Posts: 179

    Model A Fan
    Member

    Are you going to keep it like that? That's a cool setup and I'd be interested if not... ;)

    On another note, I keep seeing "TROG"...what does "TROG" mean?

    That looks like a great car, I hope you have fun with it.
     
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  5. The Race of Gentlemen
    Do a search on either.
     
  6. junk yard kid
    Joined: Nov 11, 2007
    Posts: 2,714

    junk yard kid
    Member

    In the interest of a bump. Does anyone know how pismo is gunna work? Should I bring my 4x4 to cruise to a sand dune to watch the race with my family? Bring my 35 to drive down the beach just for fun? Or will this not be allowed? I haven't been there since I was in college and had a wild time with my dune buggy and a trashy women I found. I can't imagine they are closing down all of pismo. got my tickets and hotel, just want to plan logistics.


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  7. gordspeed
    Joined: Jul 9, 2013
    Posts: 212

    gordspeed
    Member
    from Oregon

    I look forward to seeing your A at TROG! Motor is lookin' sexy! Looks like your gettin' r done! :)
     
  8. Cyclone Kevin
    Joined: Apr 15, 2002
    Posts: 3,924

    Cyclone Kevin
    Alliance Vendor

    TROG or Bust!!!!!! That looks like a mighty fine steed. Congrats on the purchase. Talk to a couple of F.A.S.T. Guys, they'll be able to figure out that running issue.
     
  9. brady1929
    Joined: Sep 30, 2006
    Posts: 8,075

    brady1929
    Member

  10. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    In my "Greenness" I assumed that the timing pointer was supposed to line up with a mark on the pulley. Evidently it doesn't do that. I reversed the pointer and set the crank to TDC. I then made my own marks and pointer. They were about 30 degrees away from the other mark. I think the fuel pressure is too high, since there is no regulator. One step at a time, I'll go over each system and figure it out.
     
  11. waxhead
    Joined: May 11, 2013
    Posts: 1,081

    waxhead
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from West Oz

    Nice looking banger.
     
  12. Jalopy Joker
    Joined: Sep 3, 2006
    Posts: 23,756

    Jalopy Joker
    Member

    DSCN6154.JPG need to contact those that are putting it all together about details - first time there will need a learning curve - think that there are rules on who runs - guy I know has the 1952 Oakland Roadster Show winner and he is waiting for approval to enter & run
     
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  13. toreadorxlt
    Joined: Feb 27, 2008
    Posts: 734

    toreadorxlt
    Member
    from Nashua, NH

    incase you wanna see your car getting chopped.... in 2013, on the other side of the country lol

     
  14. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    Toreadorxlt,
    Were you part of that crew? Since you're familiar with the car, did it ever run well? I saw that video before my car even arrived. It still has a lot of finish welding to do and there is somthing wrong with the windshield, it's hitting the cowl. I plan on dissasembling the roof and windshield a bit and piece it back together.
     
  15. i'malittleslow
    Joined: Aug 6, 2013
    Posts: 34

    i'malittleslow
    Member
    from TEXAS

  16. Cool set-up. Very similar to the A Banger I recently picked up. Found a bunch of trick for the time stuff in the engine. Weights added to the crank and balanced, Bored over, Metal timing gears, High compression cast iron head, verified the non stock (supposed to be 3/4 race) cam. Externally it has a similar intake/carb setup to you and a mallory single point distributor. Seems as I am going backward tuning mine up though. Currently the head is off and the distributor is away for a tune-up at Bubbas ignition. I found excessive fuel in my oil on my 2nd oil change, which I still can't figure out why it happened. Best of luck to you in your build for TROG.
     
  17. toreadorxlt
    Joined: Feb 27, 2008
    Posts: 734

    toreadorxlt
    Member
    from Nashua, NH

    I was one of the two in the video. I was there for the day we roughed the chop out. the car was slammed together in 48 hours to make a show back in the day and many issues were addressed later with many left. It was built to be a hot rod, good enough was how it was. The banger ran well, I personally followed it for a 150 mile round trip from my house and back to another show. I saw it run at TROG last year too with a new owner.
     
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  18. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    I pulled the oil pan, front and side covers off the engine. I wanted to inspect the cam timing and just look it over. The cam timing was spot on. The crank is a B model and everything looks fresh. I put it all back together and it still ran crappy with huge hesitation.

    The exhaust consisted of a Red's header and two turn out pipes. This setup is not so cool for tuning in the driveway. I cut off the turnouts and added a couple of short sections of 2 inch pipe. I then added a couple of Smithy's with longer turn outs. I made a couple of test pipes to replace the mufflers at TROG. It is now very quiet at idle and I don't feel guilty revving it in the driveway.

    I took the carbs apart and although someone had just gone through them, I found a few problems: binding linkage, floats set at 3/4 inch below the top, 30 main jets and the power valves looked physically damaged. I installed 35 mains and new 71 power valves. Set the float to just under 1/2 inch. Now it runs great, idles instantly and has great acceleration with no stumble.

    I also installed an original 32 grill shell (I just had the radiator filler moved from the top by Matthews in Orange).

    Next on the list:
    Replace and reroute the steel brake lines.
    Install a 4:56 gear set.
    Install an Albro Aluminum flywheel with 9 inch clutch set.
    Remove the body and install a new wood mount set with the correct hardware.
    Remove and reinstall all the body wood, with the correct hardware.
    Install Guide headlights.
    Cosmetic clean up and paint.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
  19. boo
    Joined: Jul 6, 2005
    Posts: 530

    boo
    Member
    from stuart,fl.

    it might be your timing cover, the timing pin in a B cover is different than an A cover
     
  20. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    Thanks, I'm going to look into that.
     
  21. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    [​IMG]
    Looks like a 1928-31 cover to me. Correct me if I'm wrong.
     
  22. boo
    Joined: Jul 6, 2005
    Posts: 530

    boo
    Member
    from stuart,fl.

    looks like an A cover, think i remember that the B cover had a flat raised area where the pin was. think i remember that if you use a B cam in an A motor that you need the B cover or the timing will be off. i use the after market pointer and timing tape on my cars, got motor on top dead c. and marked pulley at pointer, now i can time w/lite.
     
  23. louisb
    Joined: Oct 13, 2008
    Posts: 938

    louisb
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    That thing looks great.

    --louis
     
  24. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

  25. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    I picked up an old tow bar. Made for the Model A frame out of an old Ford wishbone. The Valley coupler has zero wear.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
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  26. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    I also got something a little more traditional to tow it with. Much cooler than my Escalade. I just imported it from Canada.

    [​IMG]
     
  27. mike bowling
    Joined: Jan 1, 2013
    Posts: 3,440

    mike bowling
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    That car looks verrrry familiar------------
    Nice truck; needs an Airstream trailer maybe?
     
  28. ghalperin
    Joined: Dec 10, 2012
    Posts: 153

    ghalperin
    Member

    Mike,
    Do you know the car?
     
  29. Jet96
    Joined: Dec 24, 2012
    Posts: 1,001

    Jet96
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from WY

    That's a verrry cool lookin coupe !
     

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