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Projects '29 Roadster Authentic Prewar Hot Rod

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by jadz928, Jan 11, 2020.

  1. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions!
    @flatheadpete We're just up the road near Frankenmuth.
     
    flatheadpete likes this.
  2. Looks great as it is to me.
    I run mechanicals on all three of my four bangers and they stop just fine. Teds floaters in B brakes up front on the Tourer and Fordor, and '35 brakes on the Coupe. Cast iron drums are a good shout though.

    Worth putting a 3.54 in the rear end too if it's still stock. Although I've put a 3.27 in the Coupe and it pulls that fine.
     
    winduptoy, jadz928 and 97 like this.
  3. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,628

    97
    Member

    You KNOW why there are very few cars like this left! Yeah because everybody that got their hands on one said "well it's not stock now, I am not a restorer, so it won't hurt to "just change one thing". The further you get from how it is the easier it will be to make more changes.
    Like it for what it is, you have NO NEED to drive it on the freeway, and no need to be in "traffic" .
    It is already better than any over restored 100 point "stocker" and better than any tribute car or 2000s version of what we all think we know about 1940 or 1950...this car was there. It's a perfect snapshot of a time , which once changed can never come back.
    Now I am not saying do not maintain or repair, or even improve internally , but keep the outside and the visible and obvious as they are. As others have said , keep the drums and rod brakes, but when it comes time to replace the drums , use the cast ones and a set of Ted's floaters, ( I am sure Daniel would have if he could have) but make damned sure those rods are perfect first, and keep up the adjustments...I don't think I would change anything in the driveline, you just don't need to, it's not your only car , and it will only tell it's story as long as it is how it is.

    6 volts worked in 1939, just as it will work today... please don't take the obvious and easy route, take the high road, so future generations know where we came from. BTW, repro parts are OK , but they really spoil the look of a great car... I hang around all the restorers here and sweep up their discards, and cherish all the dings and scrapes that really tell a story. ....IMHO Henry's parts and 90 years use are almost impossible to reproduce .
     
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  4. Absolutely mister 97.
     
    Stogy, flatford39 and Stephen Barrett like this.
  5. Well done 97.
     
    Stephen Barrett likes this.
  6. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Right on, @97! Great advice all around.
     
    Stephen Barrett likes this.
  7. Stephen Barrett
    Joined: Sep 24, 2019
    Posts: 773

    Stephen Barrett
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    If it were mine I might cry a little. What a great story and piece of history. All that car needs is a full tank of gas and a nice sunny day so you can put the top down and go.
     
    nunattax likes this.
  8. A Boner
    Joined: Dec 25, 2004
    Posts: 5,798

    A Boner
    Member

    Minimalist approach for this old hop up, is a good idea...for sure!
     
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  9. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,628

    97
    Member

    I predict that this car is on the cusp of becoming a world famous and iconic find , that all of us can learn from. I am sure none of us want to see it go into a collection or museum where it is inaccessible to everybody, but I can see Jim and Herb being inundated by the magazines ( what's left of them) and car show promoters clamoring for a piece of the action. It is a standard by which many people could sit back and reflect on the things they think are "period correct".
    It is a jewel from the past , proving to the Pebble Beach crowd, that "overrestored perfection" was NOT the way cars were seen and used in days gone by....... it should be driven and used as it would have been, BUT it's new life will be one of wonder and education for many , hopefully some of those who overstate traditional modifications will take careful note of the subtleties of this very special car...including the fact that while fenderless cars are lighter and probably faster, hop ups, gow jobs and hotrods were mostly the owner/drivers only car so fenders were not always removed, and NOTHING was perfect or built to a formula .
     
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  10. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    @97 I'm still processing what you wrote (which was awesome), and I'll be in Florida next week for some sun, and will then respond in full. Thx.

    In the meantime, here's the Original Hop-Up.
    IMG_20200131_202746_156.jpg
     
  11. mkebaird
    Joined: Jan 21, 2014
    Posts: 335

    mkebaird
    Member

    Wish my dad was still alive to see this car, it's very close to his first car, bought in 1938 at 18 years old. He modified it by putting on smaller wheels, chopped the windshield/top 2", and added a few performance 'upgrades'.
     
  12. HotrodHR
    Joined: Jul 12, 2010
    Posts: 205

    HotrodHR
    Member

    I would keep it as is and any changes should be "correct" the the '30 and '40s when it was originally being hopped up.

    I'm guessing the block side cover may not be period correct; if it is the Allen bolts are not and need to be replaced.

    Clean and hand mend the seat cover/ upholstery unless it's totally rotten and falling apart or recover in something "period." The door panels are OK to run for now, probably a budget mod to clean up the interior by then original owner.

    You could pull the wheels and store them to use when you go to Pebble Beach or other big show and compete in the unrestored class... too late for a barnfind (dirt include) class. Some big and little or stock wire or steel wheels with new rubber would look nice. Regardless what you do with your wheels new tires are in order. Even cruising around town at 35 - 45 mph is dangerous on the old tires.

    As someone said, send some pics to Rodders Journal, Hemmings, or other mag... might get a write up!

    Good luck and have fun.
     
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  13. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,628

    97
    Member

    I think the valve cover is probably either the one that was supplied with the OHV conversion or at least one that was period when the roadster was last on the road.
    As for allen keys and hex head bolts
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hex_key
     
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  14. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    @HotrodHR Thanks!
    Yes, sticking to the 30's & 40's period is the current plan.

    The side cover and valve cover both are correct for Schofield 1930-specific, between a Miller & Cragar, with the 'Miller' removed from both castings. The Allen bolts appear 'of the period' and are a very unique size (compared to what available today). And they are super cool, so they will stay.

    The seats need a good cleaning and mild repair. We will try them on for size when the old girl goes back on the road this Spring.
    1223191245.jpg

    Original 16's and tires will be preserved to use for shows, etc. We're working to have a spare wheelset ready for driving. Considering black wires and 6.00 front & 7.00 rear tires.
    wo2.jpg
     
  15. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    I'm glad you appreciate the subtle details as much as I do. Within these details, you can see from where the original owner, Daniel, drew his inspiration. I think the most definitive is the shape of the roadster top, which to me looks very '34. And other notable roadsters from the 40's, like the McGee, were similarly inspired.
    Also the mild chop, however subtle, completely transforms the overall shape or 'look'.

    1223191125b.jpg 1223191128c.jpg

    The '32 steering wheel may have been inspired. I suspect Daniel respected and desired the Deuce, possibly wished he had the V8. Instead he decided to keep his 'old roadster' relevant, and emulated his desire with the '32 wheel. This, and the aluminum horn delete cover are of my favorite details!

    1223191136.jpg

    I know the 16" wires are commonplace now, but back in the 30's, they would've been the hot ticket. I imagine Daniel was thrilled when he scored a complete set from a '35! He was a keen guy to grab the spare tire cover as well, and smarter yet to add the locking cap so no one could take it.

    1223191126d.jpg

    It's clear to me that Daniel was very in-tune with the period.
    This roadster is a unique snapshot of him and that time.

    Thank you @97 for your appreciation.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2020
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  16. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Progress has been slow-going as we waited for the rebuilt head to get finished. Custom-made valves. Quality work takes time!
    0418201125a.jpg

    0418201126.jpg

    In the meantime, the Miller OHV-unique water pump was rebuilt w/bearings and a new prop, the distributor was rebuilt w/modern points, the seized speedo was rebuilt, and dash reconditioned w/new pop-out switch.
    0418201130b.jpg

    0418201132.jpg

    0418201135.jpg
    0418201135a.jpg

    IMG_3635~2.JPG

    Next up is painting and installing the head, while we wait for the rebuilt rocker assembly to get finished. Also 6V electric system rehab.
     
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  17. waxhead
    Joined: May 11, 2013
    Posts: 1,172

    waxhead
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from West Oz

    Love it :)
     
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  18. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    The electrical system restoration plan is an interesting and complex undertaking. Worth noting, no factory wiring exists and the original 'spider' light/horn switch was deleted. Also, the Guide fog lights and 'Harley' horn were never wired-up.

    So the goals are to continue where Daniel left off, keep sympathetic of the period, and improve safety and reliability.

    Daniel's custom electrical features such as the terminal box delete, 'hot wire' ignition switch, pushbutton start/solenoid, and light dimmer floor switch will be preserved.

    The 6 volt positive ground and generator system will be retained, however a voltage regulator may be added if needed.

    A custom panel will be added to the upper steering column for the light and horn switches. This will include a temperature gauge and ignition light.

    Fuses will be added to the generator, battery and high-amp lighting. Light relays will be added to keep the hot wire leads as short as possible (similar to factory length). Period cloth-braided stranded copper wire, components and hardware will used.

    For those who 'geek out' on wiring diagrams, this one is for you...
    29-Roadster-wiring-diagram.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2020
    Stogy, redoxide, alfin32 and 3 others like this.
  19. Cliff Ramsdell
    Joined: Dec 27, 2004
    Posts: 1,247

    Cliff Ramsdell
    Member

    @jadz928 your car is absolutely wonderful and the care you are taking as well as attention to detail is first rate on all the repairs and keeping things the way the car was built.

    I’m one of those who “geek out” on electrical stuff and I dig the wiring diagram you have provided covering the projected upgrades required.

    What brand/style of relays will you be using for your lighting? Where are you planning on locating them on the car? One thing I noticed is you didn’t include a wire gauge in your diagram for the various circuits, not a criticism just an observation.

    Looking forward to seeing the harness construction and installation.

    Cliff Ramsdell
     
  20. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Thanks for the kind words @Cliff Ramsdell
    The relays are old stock P&D which were used on early Fords. They will be located on a relay panel bracket in the left frame rail, just fore of the steering column. This panel will be mounted to existing holes for the splash shield.
    0505201033_resized.jpg

    0505201039b_resized.jpg

    Also, I appreciate the geek out and observation on wire gauge. Finalized and ordered wire today, so I updated the wiring diagram above to reflect. Feel free to share any other observations, I need all the help I can get!

    Here's the fuse panel mounted on the firewall. I'm happy with it's location and the use of existing threaded holes and roundhead screws. No firewall was harmed during this installation. ;)
    0505201019_resized.jpg
     
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  21. Stogy
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 17,580

    Stogy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    @jadz928...I like your considerations for where your taking this...very admirable...it's a fantastic old survivor...and that era of Hotrod is like all the others...part of the Big Picture I like to say...
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2020
    brady1929 and jadz928 like this.
  22. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Right on @Stogy, she certainly tells her part of the story.
    Re considerations, we're doing our best and everything is discussed before working thru. Trying to minimize compromises, and have fun with the car and process.
     
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  23. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Just checking in to let you all know this is still an active project. Had to take a break to work on other projects. My Dad has patiently waited for me and has moved some things along in the meantime.
    Back at it and it feels great to work on the old girl again!
    Stay tuned as we move into this next phase. Thanks! 30709.jpeg
     
  24. How did I miss this thread! What a great car!
     
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  25. flatheadpete
    Joined: Oct 29, 2003
    Posts: 9,962

    flatheadpete
    Member
    from Burton, MI

    Man....I really like that car. Please keep us updated as work continues.
     
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  26. winduptoy
    Joined: Feb 19, 2013
    Posts: 2,197

    winduptoy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Original 16's and tires will be preserved to use for shows, etc. We're working to have a spare wheelset ready for driving. Considering black wires and 6.00 front & 7.00 rear tires.
    View attachment 4565416 [/QUOTE]
    Good to see that you are back on this!
    I'm running 6:00 X 16 on the front on 4.5" wide and 7:50 X 16 on 5.5" wide for the rear on steel wheels. I started down the path of wanting wires and had ordered some rears from Coker 2 years ago. I just got a call that they got them in and a month later I talked to Jimmie at Rally America and ordered two rear wires from him. I just got them a month ago...point being, wire wheels may have a long lead time...or not. They did for me. I like the taller tire for road speed and rubber rake.
     
    jadz928 likes this.
  27. winduptoy
    Joined: Feb 19, 2013
    Posts: 2,197

    winduptoy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

  28. harpo1313
    Joined: Jan 4, 2008
    Posts: 2,028

    harpo1313
    Member
    from wareham,ma

    You got a real good one there Jadz, take care.
     
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  29. jadz928
    Joined: Dec 15, 2019
    Posts: 49

    jadz928
    Member
    from Michigan

    Thanks everyone for the kind words and interest. She's a pretty cool old Roadster, and it excites me to be able to work on her again!
    My Dad is been working wheels over the past several months. He put together a set of 16" wires for driving, 5 including the spare.
    Satin black, 6.00 fronts, 6.50 rears (it's tall for a 6.50), Auburn radials from Diamond Back. Should roll real nice, and we really like the mild rake!
    Original painted-red wires and Firestones are set aside in storage for shows. Great to hear from you again, @winduptoy!
    IMG_3930.JPG

    I really love the red drum brake treatment done by the original owner, Daniel. He really had an eye for detail!
    1210201129a.jpg
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2020

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