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Projects 29 Model A Couprielet, A Phantom Sleeper

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by chev34ute, Jan 5, 2018.

  1. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Once the upper and lower buck is completed, the next task will be to make the patterns that will be used to trace onto the sheet metal.
     
  2. low down A
    Joined: Feb 6, 2009
    Posts: 451

    low down A
    Member

    I have no idea where batlow is but it seems like your going to a lota extra work when you can buy a set of repros for 300 dollars.
     
  3. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Hey Guys.

    Just a quick update, fellow HAMBER "low down A" raised a very good question about why I did not just purchase a set of repro sub rails for $300. The simple fact is that I live on the other side of the globe in Australia where we pay a lot more for everything.

    With the differences in our exchange rate the $300.00 US would work out to around $360.00 Australian. I don't mind paying the 20 percent extra but the shipping could end up being two or three times the purchase price.

    While these reproduction panels can be shipped in, the cost of the shipping often makes purchasing panels un-economic. As far as sourcing the parts locally, there are only two businesses in all of Australia that manufacture steel Model A panels and they are pickup cabs and beds so again there is no option there.

    While I would prefer to use the original sub rails for this project, the severe pitting and rust makes repairing them more trouble than its worth. There is just enough of it left that I can use it for a pattern to make my own.

    While the ones I make up will not compare with good originals or repro ones, I will be striving to make them as accurate as possible. There will be various other panels that I will be fabricating as well including the hood, rain channels below the deck lid and even a folding top.

    I figured out last year it was far cheaper for me to purchase the equipment to fabricate the parts I needed, rather than to try and track down the originals or pay sky high shipping for repro versions. DSC00543.JPG DSC00544.JPG
     
  4. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Hey Guys.

    I found some time to get a bit more done today and finished off the buck.

    DSC01243.JPG
     
    RICH B likes this.
  5. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    With the buck completed, I was really keen to get a start on forming the sub rails so I pulled out some sheet metal and used the buck as a template. DSC01244.JPG
     
  6. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    As I could not find a marker, I used masking tape for the outline before cutting out the desired shape. DSC01246.JPG
     
  7. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Once i had further trimmed the piece, I made sure to take a paper pattern of it for the other side. DSC01251.JPG
     
  8. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    With that done, I was ready to place the piece over the buck and clamp it down. DSC01255.JPG
     
  9. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    It was a tricky process as I did not want to deface the metal, so I opted to turn the metal with the wide vice grips rather than hammer down.
     
  10. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    I worked the inside leading edge first, followed by the inside trailing edge making sure to keep the same width at each ends which worked out at around five inches. By doing so I was able to lock the piece over the buck and turn my attention the outside edge. I then focused my attention on forming the inside contour. DSC01258.JPG
     
  11. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    I found it easier to put the whole thing on its side to turn the outside down. It was only after using the vice grips that I turned to the rubber mallet and then the hammer.
     
  12. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    DSC01259.JPG This was how it turned out. I was pleased overall with the results but the crudeness of the buck showed up in the form itself by the way of indentations from the screws. This was due to the difficulty in getting them to sit flush with the joiners.
     
  13. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    A bit more fine tuning and I had it looking the same as the buck its self. DSC01260.JPG DSC01261.JPG
     
    kiwijeff likes this.
  14. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    With that done, I have decided to simplify the buck design to make the forming easier. I will be using 30 mm ply for the two sections. Because of the mess with joiners, the new buck won't have them, this will allow the piece to sit perfectly flush between the two sections. The lower section will be slightly beveled at 75 degrees rather than 90 degrees to allow me to turn the sides further back before resorting to the mallet. Less blows will mean the buck retains its shape and strength better. The top section will also be beveled at the same angle to allow the mallet to get in closer. The other difference will be in the clamping process its self. Due to the width of the piece, it was very hard to get the clamps to hold it down in the center. So these clamps will remain at each end and bolts will hold the middle sections down. These bolts will correspond with the placement of the cross rail mounts so there will be no need to weld the holes up when finished. I will be picking up the ply on Wednesday or Thursday so I expect the shaping of the buck will be completed by the weekend.
     
  15. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Hey Guys.

    I finally picked up the materials from my local building supplies store yesterday. I was not able to get the right sized slab that I needed so I had to make do with an off cut section. I also got two lengths of 4 x 2 hardwood lumber for some other bucks I will be making. The first thing I did this morning drag the frame out and place the sub rails on top and clamp the quarter panel over the top. DSC01262.JPG
     
  16. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    I did this so that I could get the precise measurements for the length of the sub rails.
     
  17. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Last night, I managed to find some images of an original Model A Cabriolet that referenced the diagram that I have had since last year. These images have filled in the gaps as far as the layout of the floor. The sub rails on the Cabriolets are all timber and longer than the coupe versions. When I purchased the cabriolet body last year I was also given a lot of the original timber, so I was hoping that I would find the original rails in amongst it that could be used for patterns. DSC01287.JPG
     
  18. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    I was out of luck in that department, so I needed to find another way to get the desired shape. What I worked out was that by placing the sub rails over the slab of ply, I could trace its outlines. DSC01273.JPG
     
  19. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    DSC01274.JPG I was careful to use a rule when I was doing this as there was a considerable gap between bottom of the rails and the surface of the ply.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
  20. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Once I had the outline worked out I got it ready for cutting. I had to measure 20 mm in from the inside edge as the outline along here only showed the flange and not the main body. I also angled the bench saw to allow a slight angle for the cutting to allow the sheet metal to be more easily turned to 90 degrees. DSC01278.JPG DSC01276.JPG
     
  21. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Once the first piece was cut out, I needed to work out how the back section was going to be shaped around the wheel well area. A contour gauge was used to get the information needed in this area. DSC01279.JPG
     
  22. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    With this area notched, the sub rail was able to sit in line with the bottom of the quarter panel and I was able to use the finished section as a template for the other section. DSC01280.JPG
     
  23. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    With both sections cut out, I turned to sanding the faces and mirroring them and then placed them into both quarter panels for a comparison. DSC01284.JPG
     
  24. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    In order to make up the missing sections between the wheel wells and the beaver panel, the same procedure was undertaken. To insure both sections lined up when put back on the table, a witness mark was added.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
  25. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    In order to join the two sections together another, two more sections needed to be cut and drilled to the existing sections with phillips head screws. DSC01292.JPG
     
  26. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    The goal will be to have a reversible buck, with the upper and lower sections that hold the sheet metal in place beveled to make the turning process easier. DSC01295.JPG
     
  27. chev34ute
    Joined: Nov 13, 2011
    Posts: 1,125

    chev34ute
    Member

    Once I have completed the second section, I will be cutting two strips of .95 sheet metal to the same shape as the buck and joining them to each one to give them extra strength.
     
  28. Davey Mac
    Joined: Jan 18, 2018
    Posts: 14

    Davey Mac

    Thanks for sharing, very coool. I'm getting used to folk looking at m have my project and literally think it's a pile of junk. I might print out your photos and post them on my carport with as sign of some sort...
     
  29. If you ask me, and i mean this in the nicest way possible.. i don't know why you are fart assing around with all the woodwork nonsense.

    I built a roadster starting off with a cowl and one door, before finding all the other bits and pieces and getting Brookville quarters, subrails, rear panels ect. In my opinion you are going about this the most difficult way possible.

    Get some subrails from someone in Aus who stocks them (there are a few, AJ's / Burleigh Roadster i'm not sure if they are still doing them but ask on the HAMB fb group (I'm the guy that runs it..) and someone will know.. get your cowl you want to use onto a workbench, stick the subrails in each cowl opening and then build your subrails with the centre pieces. Get it all squared up, weld it and then patch the bottoms of your quarter panels and get the rest of it assembled. I'll try and find some pictures of how i did it.. but if you ask me you are fuckin around with it so ass backwards..

    Edit: If you can't for some reason get repro subrails just use 25 x 50 RHS. Still be a heap easier than what you are doing.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
    kiwijeff, 28rp and low down A like this.
  30. Build your repro subrails so they end up like this..

    [​IMG]

    And then start fitting your doors, quarters ect. You'll need a TON of clamps. You're right, the fingers get hammered around the underside of the subrail and i suppose spot welded or pressed into place to hold them up. There are braces inside the boot area that probably hold them up as well, but you can fab that up as you go.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    This is what it looks like currently.. i haven't done much on it in the last few years because i'm a uni student so money is a bit tight. It'll get there. Anyway, i hope this helps ya in the right direction.

    [​IMG]
     
    waxhead and 28rp like this.

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