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289 casting #'s & other questions

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Moonglow, Jun 1, 2009.

  1. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Just picked up a 289 SBF for my model A project. I've done some seaches for casting number info and have learned quite a bit. I still have some questions though, so any help would be appreciated. Let's start with the casting numbers:

    Block: C5AE-6015E (above the main casting number is 5C20)
    4 Barrel Intake Manifold: C50E-9425C
    Driver's side Exhaust Manifold: D50E-9431-BB
    Pass side Eshaust Manifold: D50E-9430-0A

    1.) The guy I bought this from said it came from a '65 Mustang, but the block casting number seems to indicate it's from a '65 "full size car". Any thoughts here?

    2.) Does the four barrel carb intake indicate that it could be a HIPO motor? Problably not, but worth asking about.

    3.) The exhaust manifolds look pretty cool. They have shallow fins and dump more to the bottom than to the rear. The 289 exhaust manifolds I've seen in the past are not finned at all and dump nearly straight back. Any idea whats up with these?

    4.) Not really related to the above, but is there a simple way to relocate the oil filter (maybe to the fire wall)?

    Thanks for the help guys..............
     
  2. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    The C5AE-6015-E block was used for the HiPo, but also for any other "standard" 289 (including those used in Mustangs), so the casting number alone does not tell you enough to know if you have a HiPo block.

    Those exhaust manifolds are from a mid-Seventies mid-size Ford.

    I don't know anything about that intake casting.
     
  3. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Cool.......Any idea how to tell a HiPo motor from the standard 289?
     
  4. RAY With
    Joined: Mar 15, 2009
    Posts: 3,133

    RAY With
    Member

    Hipo heads were different and had spring cups and screw in studs. They used no guide plates and the push rod holes were narrow and could use stock push rods The intake was like any other 2894bb--Most hipo blocks had threaded oil galley holes-they also had a counter weight on the lower timing gear and was unique to hipo. The main caps were thick and didnt have a ridge or angle cut on them. All hipo rod bolts were 3/8 and not the usual 5/16. only other SBF with the big rod bolts were the boss 302--the ex manifolds were rear exit but big in diameter
     

  5. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Great info, thanks. Any way to tell from the outside? Maybe a special casting number on the heads?
     
  6. 5C20 is March 20, 1965 assembly date

    There was a 4bbl 289 Mustang that wasn't HiPo (the A code, requiring premium gasoline)

    Detailed engine application information was on a metal tag attached to the intake (but often missing and could be easily swapped to fake a more valuable motor you wouldn't easily know until you disassembled it)

    This is all from memory, I am at work and shouldn't be surfing the net :) but I know there is a ton of SBF decode information out there. Ford was very anal about their part numbering schemes.

    --steve
     
  7. C5OE is 65 Fairlane which were also shared with Mustang and later Cougar quite often. D5OE is 75 Torino. The fins are typical of the manifolds then. Mustang II's and Mavericks etc had similar. 351W manifolds are dead ringers for HiPo 289 ones and flow pretty much the same.

    Hipo Blocks were same block as regular 289 but during the QA check blocks that were "harder" during Brinnel test were set aside for Hi Po use. Ford dabbed orange paint on them behind the bellhousing area.

    http://www.hammar.dyndns.org/~djhamma/partnumb.htm

    This may help on the Ford P/N
     
  8. havi
    Joined: Dec 30, 2008
    Posts: 1,875

    havi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Orange paint and a shiney surface on the crankshaft? 19,20 or 21 cast on end of head topside? Thicker balancer? dual point distributor? remote oil filter kits are available.
     
  9. RAY With
    Joined: Mar 15, 2009
    Posts: 3,133

    RAY With
    Member

    NO other than the listed difference the 289 hipo heads were identical to all the other heads and the cups and studs were the main difference. Blocks were the same also and was no different casting numbers but the main caps were a give away as was the threaded oil galley holes. To tell a real hipo the valve cover-timing cover and pan has to come off.
     
  10. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    Not correct, at least as far as the heads are concerned. Havi has it right. There will be a 19, 20, or 21 cast on the upper end of the head. It is visable without removing the valve cover. No non-HiPo has these three particular numbers (as far as I've ever seen or heard).
     
  11. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Looks like I problably have a non HiPo engine. The heads are marked "12" and "13", respectively, on the upper sides, near the left ends. Also on the head, just above the accessory bosses is marked a "16" on one and a "2" on the other (also at the left end of each head).

    I thought the 4 barrel intake & carb was pretty rare on the non-HiPo 289. Is that true?
     
  12. Retro Jim
    Joined: May 27, 2007
    Posts: 3,859

    Retro Jim
    Member

    The head by valve train where its has the -289 will have 2 dots instead of one so I have been told . Also was told it was a "K" head for HiPo .
    The only difference besides minor thing was the flow was better other than that the heads were the same . 289-k had the bigger cam too .
     
  13. Don't the Hipo heads have screw in studs for the valve train? The regular 289 had rail type rodkers
     
  14. Solid lifters too
     
  15. Retro Jim
    Joined: May 27, 2007
    Posts: 3,859

    Retro Jim
    Member


    YEP to both !
     
  16. havi
    Joined: Dec 30, 2008
    Posts: 1,875

    havi
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You can still build this engine to make respectable numbers, and with the stock 4bbl intake, few would know the wiser.
     
  17. Retro Jim
    Joined: May 27, 2007
    Posts: 3,859

    Retro Jim
    Member

    I have a 302 I am going to be building real soon and I am using a nice pair of 1966--289 heads . They have great compression !
     
  18. JeffB2
    Joined: Dec 18, 2006
    Posts: 8,760

    JeffB2
    Member
    from Phoenix,AZ

    Click on this: www.mre-books.com/interchange/index.html under the small block Ford section if you click on the various parts in blue, it will give you a wealth of info,it would also be a good investment to buy the book.
     
  19. 49 Custom
    Joined: Apr 17, 2009
    Posts: 282

    49 Custom
    Member

    Actually the "A" code mustang was fairly common, at least more so than "K" code HIPOs. Unfortunately, most production stats list mustangs by body style rather than engine configuration.
     
  20. Mark H
    Joined: May 18, 2009
    Posts: 1,461

    Mark H
    Member
    from Scotland

    Hi.
    My 289 came from a 65 mustang and also decodes to 'Ford Full Size'.Maybe they used these when they ran short on the production line?
    Regarding your question on oil filter relocation,is this due to clearance issues?If so,you can use the oil filter from the 4 cyl Pinto engine(Motorcraft EFL90) which is quite a bit shorter and gives lots more clearance,and lots cheaper!
    Hope this helps,Mark.
    I saw at least two set of Cal Custom valve covers for sale on ebay today,one day left,one pair sitting at about $80,the other set about $110.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2009
  21. 49 Custom
    Joined: Apr 17, 2009
    Posts: 282

    49 Custom
    Member

    If I remember correctly, the mustang was on the same production lines as the falcon and fairlane (and in fact, shared many parts) for a number of years. I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if some of the engine blocks with consecutive numbers found themselves in different models.
     
  22. vertible59
    Joined: Jan 25, 2009
    Posts: 1,058

    vertible59
    Member

    221-260, and early 289s also had the close tolerance push rod holes and rail type rockers, but not the spring cups and screw-in studs.
     
  23. Fords don't have "numbers matching" scenarios like GM does. The same engine in various state of tune was plonked into Fullsize, mid size, Mustang, Cougar etc. Often to restore a Ford "correctly" is to find a motor that has right casting #'s and date codes within a month or two of the car build date
     
  24. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Great Idea. I'll give it a try.

    I have this idea to reverse the cast exhaust manifolds (so they dump to the front) and bending a "U" back with a megaphone and internal baffles. Sort of a poor man's lakes style headers. I'll mock it up and see if I like it.

    Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2009
  25. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Thanks for all the great informative help guys. You can't beat the H.A.M.B.!
     
  26. ROADRAT EDDIE
    Joined: Apr 17, 2005
    Posts: 1,349

    ROADRAT EDDIE
    Member
    from New york

    Some of the earlier 289's had the VIN# stamped in the block at the pass. side front corner just above where the pan bolts to the block....The fifth digit would tell you what you have if it's there....They stopped doing it at some point. {mid '65?}
     
  27. Moonglow
    Joined: Mar 6, 2006
    Posts: 426

    Moonglow
    Member

    Thanks for the tip, but no luck. Guess mine is a post mid '65.

    The mystery continues.............to be continued. :D
     
  28. I am not sure if I am right and others are wrong or viceaversa. But from what little I know!
    C5AE - I am Not sure what this AE means
    C5OE means Original Equipment
    C means 1960 to 1969
    5 means 1965
    O means Original
    E means Equipment
    6015 means the type of casting it was
    Like I said I do not know what A means
    This may be a replacement motor from ford I really don't know
    I have 6 SBF in my possession All are OE blocks
    3 are 260s
    1 is a 302
    1 is a 306
    1 is a 65 289 made in to a 308
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2009
  29. 48fordnut
    Joined: Nov 4, 2005
    Posts: 3,931

    48fordnut
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    the 289/271 was originally planned for the fairlane, then along came the mustang and comet,and the cobra. not sure in what order. there were aprox 17000 hi pos made. some were 5 bolt. when I first got into fords ,I bought a 5 bolt 271, and 4 speed. it went into a falcon sprint.
     
  30. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    Just a little bit of correction.

    5 (in conjunction with C) means originally designed for the 1965 model year. Could have been used for years thereafter. (The date code will indicate which model year in which it was actually used. It would look something like this: 5M20, which would mean December 20, 1965...the 1966 model year)

    O is the model code, and means originally engineering for the Fairlane line (and later other mid-size, i.e. Torino).

    E is the department code, and means Engine department.

    6015 means cylinder block.

    A means Galaxie (i.e. full-size Ford, and later other full-size Fords, such as the LTD).

    I have both a C3OE block (260) and a C3AE block (289).

    Model codes (some variation in this, over time)
    A=Ford Full size Ford / LTD,Galaxie
    C=Truck
    D=Falcon , Maverick
    E=Explorer
    F=Foreign, Trans-Am Racing
    G=Comet (later Montego)
    H=Holman/Moody HiPo part
    J=Industrial
    M=Mercury
    O=Mid size Ford Fairlane (later Torino)
    P=Replacement Part Autolite (later Motorcraft)
    R=Rotunda
    S=Thunderbird
    T=Truck
    U=Bronco , Econoline Van
    L , V=Lincoln
    W=Cougar
    Z=Mustang


    Department Codes
    A=Chassis
    B=Body
    E=Engine
    F=Engine Accessories
    J=Autolite
    M=Holman Moody
    P=Auto Transmission
    R=Manual Transmission
    W=Axle
    X=Muscle Car Parts
    Y=Lincoln/Mercury Service Parts
    Z=Service Parts
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2009

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