2007 HA/GR rules

These are the rules. Let's find a way to live within them. The class will live or die by these guidelines. I hope it will live forever.

2007 Rules:
1. Stock or modified stock frame rails, rectangular tube or round tube 3′’ diameter or larger.

2. Stock width front axles and rear ends only.

3. All cars must be equipped with a minimum four point roll bar of 1 3/4″ tubing with a main hoop higher than the driver’s head and 2 support bars down to the frame towards the firewall. Tubing must meet NHRA minimum wall thickness for application.

4. Cars with keyed axles must use hub safety retainers.

5. Closed drivelines are encouraged. If open driveline is used driveshaft must have a 1 1/2″ x 1/4″ “driveshaft loop” within 6 1/2″ of front and rear universal joints and be totally covered/sealed off from driver with steel or aluminum floor pan.

6. Cars must have cowl or body and proper floor boards/belly pan to prevent driver’s legs from exiting vehicle in event of a crash. firewall mandatory.

7. No “slingshot” chassis. Driver and engine must be positioned between the front and rear axles.

8. Cars must be equipped with an engine mounted starter and be self starting.

9. Batteries must be securely mounted and fully enclosed.

10. All cars must have a master battery cutoff switch accessible from outside the car.

11. All cars must have at least one red rear running light for night racing.

12. Flathead v8 or inlines, pre-1962 inline engines with stock cylinder blocks only. No exotic aftermarket inline six overhead valve heads (Wayne). No OHV V8s or V6s. (If you are looking to run a straight 6 with exotic heads or a flathead with an o/h conversion, contact Ryan for some good news.)

13. Engines must be naturally aspirated. No superchargers, turbos, nitrous oxide or fuel injection.

14. No electronic ignition boxes that mount outside the distributor or “coil in cap” HEIs. Conversions such as “ignitor” or “stinger” that fit within a stock dist cap are allowed. Aftermarket magnetos not allowed.

15. Pump gas/racing gas only. No Methanol, nitromethane, or alcohol.

16. Era specific carbs only, stock appearing- no modern Holley, Edelbrock, or other aftermarket carbs.

17. Fuel lines can have no single rubber piece longer than 24″, must be fastened by hose clamps, not hard or cracked.

18. Cars equipped with a cooling system or water tank must use a radiator cap and overflow/catch can system.

19. Automatic transmissions are not allowed. All cars with clutches must run a stamped steel bell housing or a 1/4″ scatter shield.

20. Cars must have rims no wider than 6″ and only bias ply street treaded tires allowed. No radials, slicks, or cheater slicks allowed. Tire tread width must measure no more than 6″.

21. Drivers must wear full face helmet, single layer (or more) fire retardant jacket or suit, gloves, jeans (or fire retardant pants), and leather shoes.

22. Five point NHRA approved safety harness required.

23. All cars must be of general soundness and safety. Must have all lug nuts, sound steering, cotter pins in place, and heim ends “captured” etc. Must pass all tracks general safety rules.

24. No electronic/pneumatic drivers aids such as rev limiters, two steps, shift lights or electric shifters. Tachometers are allowed if they don’t have a rev limiter or a shift light.

25. Cars must be built in the spirit of the “Bug” and other early rail jobs. If ya aren’t familiar, ya better ask…

26. All HA/GR cars are required to run a H.A.M.B. Logo in a visible location.

 

We've beat some rules to death, but a recenty one has come into question. Are you Okie boys just "testing" or have you gone outlaw?

16. Era specific carbs only, stock appearing- no modern Holley, Edelbrock, or other aftermarket carbs.

This rule refers to carbs such as the Sromberg 97 or the Holley 94. The four barrel such as the 4150 pictured here is a "modern" Holley. I know it was used by Ford on some models in 1958 or before, but it still don't fit in HA/GR

 

Randy
I dont think Mike with the flathead and the glide and the new holley has any intention of running his car in the HA/GR class at Mokan.
I think his intent was to run at Tulsa in the five race points series.
Didn't you guys run a old Ford 4Barrell when you first started?

 

Randy,

It was my understanding last year there was to be a " car owners" meeting at Mo-Kan and the rules could be policed among the owners.
Hopefully ( as a car owner now) i can have some voice in the class as we go? The rules are great with the exception on :

19. Automatic transmissions are not allowed. All cars with clutches must run a stamped steel bell housing or a 1/4″ scatter shield.

How long do we grandfather this rule on automatics?

Maybe we can all discuss this at Mo-Kan?

I also agree with the period carbs rule.
I think the pre 1962 rule is the best......looking forward to Indy and Mo-Kan.

 

Sure, We ran a "teapot" four barrell off of an old Linclon. That's a pretty far cry from a Modern Holley. I don't understand why anyone wound build something that's like an HA/GR but not be interested in the HAMB Drags.

 

Why not just build to the rules as they are now, and deal lwith it. If you want a bracket type car with automatic, then go bracket racing. Cowboy Bob and myself have built our HA/GA rails to the present rules, it really isn't fair to change the rules for a few who don't want to conform.
2b-banjo

 

Guess some guys have just forgotten how to drive a car with a stick and a clutch.

 

How about the fuel rule?.......................E85 is pump gas and not pure alky...................would it fit in? Just a curious thought I had.

 

T man, I see no problem with it, I will be running 110 or 112 octane race fuel.
As long as it is pump gas or race fuel(gasoline) I see nothing wrong.

 

Cool, E85 is about the same as that

 

I haven't studied E85. I'd like to know how it's properties compare the Methanol we would normalmally use in racing. One of the good things about "Alky" is it's latent heat of vaporization. Long story short, you get a good, cold intake charge that brings in more dense air. Alky will handle a lot of compression. If E85 ethanol is like that, it might be an unfair advantage. Who knows?

 

Tman,

Good question. I'm not sure what kind of power one can make with E85 but I may have to do some testing on the dyno to find out.

Ron

 

I thought E-85 was a lower octane? You lose power when converting to it I thought?

 

My own personal standpoint is that the guys going "outlaw" are straying from the SPIRIT of the class. Forget the rules, within or without, for a minute. The idea is to represent the spirit of the early days, speeds possibly be damned. Sure we want to go fast as we can, but WITHIN THE SPIRIT of the original intent of the class. Autos and Demons don't represent the pioneering spirit of the early days of drag racing, they represent the tried and true formulas of speed in TODAY'S racing.
For my own build, I chose an engine that I know can't compete with the speeds available (through 50 years of development and racing information) to the flathead Ford, Chevy six and Jimmy six guys, but speed is only half the point. Yeah, I want to go fast. I'd like to go REALLY fast, but to me, the spirit of the HA/GR is in the PURSUIT of speed, not necessarily in the ACHEIVMENT of speed. I'd rather fight my way to a 12 second quarter through six seasons of different vintage carb combos than bolt on a Demon and run the 12 on the first day. So am I saying that the devil is in the details? Can you only achieve the spirit of the class through a completely vintage macine?
NO!!!!!!!!!!
but pioneering spirit I think is the core element of the HA/GR class, as it was the core element of early drag racing. Without that spirit, the whole point of the class "Run hard... Show the folks" becomes lost. And I don't think there's anything even remotely pioneering about a TH350 or Powerglide.
I think our target "folks" aren't the general public. They are the other hot rodders, the other racers at the track. What are we showing the guy with the SBC/auto Camaro by running a rail that has the same carb and trans as his car? that his car could be faster if it didn't have a body? But how long do you think that same guy will stare at your rail, and how many questions will he ask you, if you have carbs he's never seen, a trans he's never heard of, tires that are the antethesis of traction, and everything else that represents the opposite of what he knows to be "fast" , and you still, despite his preconcieved notions, proceed to whip his ass on the track?? THAT'S "showing the folks".
I'm picking on the carbs and the trannies alot, because they seem to be the stickiest points, but hey, while we're at it, why don't we go ahead and throw in some Hoosier Quick Time DOT's some rear disc brakes and a 30" wide front axle? The "folks" in the stand probably won't know the difference, but hey, those parts are "faster", and it's all about speed right?

Alright, I admit, I like the rules the way they are. Let those guys be "outlaw" if they want, I'm not gonna. I absolutely believe in the questioning and scrutinizing of every little tiny nuance in the rules, that's what makes the class what it is, and it's also what will determine whether the class stands or falls. I even think I'd like to run some of the "against the rules" parts- hell, they ran magnetos, narrowed rears, and Hemis in '55---- BUT ---- here comes that proven performance versus pioneering spirit again. Thanks, but I'll stick with points ignition and 6 pistons.

or did I just COMPLETELY miss the point?

 

The point is...the HAMB drags are a great place for cars that have been built according to the HA/GR rules to run against each other. For car clubs to pool their parts and talents and build a car to race. The cars you are refering to as "outlaws" for the most parts started out as a HA/GR...but have evolved and now are something else (know as SDRA cars).

As they evolved they stayed broadminded enough to leave room for the HA/GR cars to run with them. They made sure that if the HA/GR cars showed up to run at one of their races that they would have a shot at a share of the round money. Unfortunately...the same has not been done in return.

I really don't hear the guys with the "outlaw" cars complaining. They still want to keep a relationship with the guys with HA/GR cars...but in reality they don't have to. There are enough of them out there now, and ones being built, that they could just move on. I think it would be a loss to the HAMB and the HA/GR class for that to happen.

Everyone on here will have a different opinion about whether they should be allowed to stay and post here or just move on. They have certainly given up some of the nostalgia "look" for more performance. But I think that they all have the spirit of the pionneers well in heart and hand.

So the word has been handed down that the "outlaw" cars are not welcome amoung the ranks of the HA.GR cars at the HAMB drags. So be it. I for one hope that the guys with the HA/GR cars will continue to run at SDRA events...and we can all have fun and run safely.

 

I think you hit the point perfectly. Looking forward to seeing another Mopar flathead 6 on the other side of the tree in the future.

I'm still living in a points and condenser world, even if they don't have distributors any more.

 

I haven't even started on my car and knowing there are truly passionate people willing to be true to the rules gives confidence in the longevity of the class.

 

So these outlaw guys can't come to the hamb drags or can't compete in the classes? I'm sure this is why Ryan was so hesitant about laying out rules.

 

Please refresh my memory, there's no trophies at Mokan is there? so who really cares who comes to race, is the HAMB sticker on the side of the car that much of an issue?

storms in a teacup.

 

Ryan has some homemade trophies that he gives out to whoever he wants. No real classes. It's heads up racing.

There are loosely categorized cars ,but that is more for his own reference I guess.

I was soooo tickled when the guy with the 60's styled Anglia showed up and ran against me. I didn't care if I won or he won, it was just like stepping back in time.

 

Ryan made the post below on another thread about the HA/GR class. He has a definate ideas of what he wants to see in the cars...the rules support these ideas. The cars that are "outlaw" to those rules will not run at HAMB events with the HA/GR cars.


"The auto class is a great idea... And I am glad it is around... I know there were a few guys that were bummed when we decided to make the HA/GR class a "no auto" class. Now, those folks have some fellas to race. I think that is good.

That said, the HA/GR class will remain the same at all of our events. We won't be allowing auto trannies or modern carbs in the class... I just like the idea of our guys banging gears and dumping clutches too much...."


The message is straight and clear. The "outlaw" cars can run each other but not with the HA/GR cars. They do not conform with the rules. The rules will not be changed. If the "outlaw" cars want to run as a HA/GR at a HAMB event they will have to change their car to meet the rules. If they don't understand where they fit in now they are just not paying attention.

 

I found out by trying to start the heads up dragster class that you will never make everyone happy. I gave up. I may try again ata later date but for now I think I will concentrate on building up the altered class, since I already have a car in this class.

 

If all the auto cars would put fiberglass T, Bantum, Fiat, etc body on them, They've got a new class such as "B Altered". Seems to me like that coud be a HAMB Drags class, but I don't speak for Ryan. They could make up what ever rules they want and the bitchin could stop. Hell, I could see a Fiat with pie crusts, a 300 Ford six, C4, Alky, and Webbers in my garage right now. HA/GR doesn't have to change. Everybody can have their way.

 

Why don't we just split the class and be done with it.
Let the auto's and new carbs run HA/GM(Modified).
That way they could run the six or seven race series at Tulsa and run the Hamb drags in there own class.
I'm not sure what you guys consider a new carb.We have been running the brand new 97's from England for two years.
We are now trying out a four barrell intake with a holley carb.
The carb is the holley replacement for the 58 Ford, and it has been modified. It sure is alot easier changing jets in ONE carb instead of 3.
OH! WE still have the 55 Ford P/U three speed in,for now.

 

What's A Modern Carb? Please Define.

 

As I told Hiney some time back...I could have booked these cars (what ever you want to call them) here in Oklahoma and Kansas for about 8 more races. It does not matter to the strip owners what you call them...as long as you can put together enough cars to make a good show.

I only booked the Wichita race (Sept 9th) but have not heard from anyone interested in running there. I don't know...do you want to cancel that race date...or do you want to race it?

The track owner has offered free entry and free track food. That is not a bad offer...since he has never seen these cars run. If the crowd likes them I can get a better deal next time. PM me and let me know if you want to make it. Ron.