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Technical 1st Gear Violent Shaking

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by mykeb, Apr 17, 2014.

  1. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Hello All,
    Looking for some advice...I'm running a 56 F100 with a 223 and 3 three on the tree. I had the flywheel turned, installed a new clutch and pressure plate, installed a new drive shaft, and rebuilt and installed a 3 speed overdrive. It's been running very well since, but I have this recurring, very violent vibration or chatter occasionally when releasing the clutch for 1st gear. With very high RPMs or very slow release when engaging the clutch i can avoid the issue.

    Would any one have any thoughts as to what the source of the problem might be?
     
  2. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 46,901

    squirrel
    Member

    loose motor mounts?
     
  3. My first thought also. HRP
     
  4. Stu D Baker
    Joined: Mar 4, 2005
    Posts: 2,609

    Stu D Baker
    Member
    from Illinois

    ^^^This, or badly deteriorated ones. Stu
     

  5. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    I replaced them when installing the 3 spd OD, but will certainly check them to ensure they haven't loosened up. Thanks for the suggestion.
     
  6. Onemansjunk
    Joined: Nov 30, 2008
    Posts: 169

    Onemansjunk
    Member
    from Modesto,CA

    Was the flywheel turned on a lathe or resurfaced with a grinder?
     
  7. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,217

    F&J
    Member

    How many mechanics bother to put a dial indicator on the flywheel face, both before and after having it cut?


    If the crank flange is out just a couple of thousands, the outer extremes of the face will be out a mile.
     
  8. sounds like the flywheel surface is poop
     
  9. mcmopar
    Joined: Nov 12, 2012
    Posts: 1,574

    mcmopar
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Strum, wi

    Did the have to take enough material off of the flywheel to make it out of balance?
     
  10. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Hmmmm......i don't know for sure, but can find out. It wasn't that bad to start with and looked okay when finished, but maybe I didn't know what could hurt me at that point.
     
  11. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    It wasn't a deep resurface from what he told me when he did it. Other than when initially starting off, I don't feel any vibrations even at high RPM on the highway.
     
  12. Andy
    Joined: Nov 17, 2002
    Posts: 4,628

    Andy
    Member

    Oil on the disk will also do that. You need to pull it all down and have a look.
     
  13. I don't know the correct name for them, but the little springs in the clutch disc missing or broken, clutch plate in backwards?
     
  14. jvo
    Joined: Nov 11, 2008
    Posts: 223

    jvo
    Member

    I'm gonna watch this thread real close, as I have the exact same situation on my model a truck. I have a stock flathead, with saginaw four speed, with re-surfaced flywheel, new clutch and pressure plate, new driveshaft, same as your vehicle.
    Exact same problem. Violent shaking when letting out the clutch, but if I let it out very slowly or rev the engine up there is no vibration. Mine is definitely NOT a motor mount problem. I replaced the motor mounts with stiffer ones, and cranked them down really tight and it made no difference.
    I can let the clutch out very slow, but not in traffic, as people start honking their horns behind me. But if I do it that way, when there isn't any traffic around, it just idles away no problem at all. Rev it up and there is no problem.
    I have no vibrations at speed, that I can feel in the driveline.
    I had a machinist cut a bunch of weight off the flywheel, but not sure if he did it with a lathe or surface grinder.
    The clutch I have was built by a clutch builder, with the saginaw splines and the original flathead style springs in the centre.
    Anyway, sure hope you can solve your problem as it might just cast some light on mine.
     
  15. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Installed new clutch. Pretty sure it was installed with correct orientation. Clearly I should remove trans and check clutch and flywheel.

    Should I have any concerns with trans cluster gear clearances?
     
  16. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Yep. Your description sounds like my experience. Sorry you're going thru it too.
     
  17. Did you install a new pilot bushing when you replaced the clutch?

    Also might want to take a look at the clutch pedal linkage for worn parts or any binding.
     
  18. Torana68
    Joined: Jan 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,190

    Torana68
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Australia

    did you wash the face of the flywhel and presure plate? new pressure plates have a coating to stop rust. Is it hard to engage first? could be someone let the box hang on the driven plate whilst installing, this will bend the center of the drive plate and cause issues (it runs out of round)
     
  19. 48FordFanatic
    Joined: Feb 26, 2011
    Posts: 1,336

    48FordFanatic
    Member
    from Maine

    I had this same issue on a 1976 Ford F100 I bought new. It was a 302 /3 speed. Ford could not fix the problem using Ford clutch parts . A mechanic recommended replacing the Ford clutch with a Borg Warner clutch which he did....problem solved.
     
  20. Did you have this issue prior to doing the Clutch? If so tell us about your rear leaf spring set up. Yes the two can be related.
    The Wizzard
     
  21. Years ago I had a similar problem. A mechanic friend of mine said to replace the rebuilt clutch with new parts. I did and the problem went away.
     
  22. I'd be curious to see if it did it in reverse as well.. or not.

    Bob
     
  23. 54Buick48D
    Joined: Jan 25, 2013
    Posts: 208

    54Buick48D
    Member
    from Maryland

    Gear oil on the clutch plate. I ran into the same with my Buick 264 3 on the tree. First gear shudder. If I feather it and high revs I can avoid the shudder. I dropped the trans and found the entire assembly covered in gear oil. Replaced the parts and fixed the leak. Works great.
     
  24. 54Buick48D
    Joined: Jan 25, 2013
    Posts: 208

    54Buick48D
    Member
    from Maryland

    Yep.
     
  25. Quite possible since the problem is new since the clutch change. I used to use only new Borg Warner discs and would use a good rebuilt clutch cover if it was also BW or Perfection American (poor man's Zoom clutch).

    Bob
     
  26. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Yes, the pilot bushing is new. The clutch pedal linkage is free of binding.
     
  27. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Okay. Thanks for all the suggestions. I will plan to remove the inspection cover to look things over and/or drop the trans to get into it deeper.

    I didn't have this problem before replacing the clutch, pressure plate, pilot bushing, turning the flywheel, and installing new drive shaft. Rear springs are the original set up. Everything appears tight and correct on the springs and shackles.....shackle bolts and bushings didn't appear to have unusual or excessive play or wear when I checked everything out over this winter. I will look closer when I get the jack and stands under it.
     
  28. mykeb
    Joined: Apr 12, 2011
    Posts: 27

    mykeb
    Member
    from Virginia

    Hmmmm....no, I made sure it was clean and free of oil, but I didn't wash it. Will do that differently next time.

    Gears, including first, all shift easily. I rebuilt the trans so am wondering if too much play on the cluster shaft could do this. I installed the trans myself and used a trans jack and didn't hang it (without the jack and trans-to-bell housing bolsts).
     
  29. mustangsix
    Joined: Mar 7, 2005
    Posts: 1,296

    mustangsix
    Member

    Was any of this stuff rebuilt as opposed to brand new? I had this occur twice in the past on a new clutch install - once with a clutch disc with broken springs in the center and another time with broken springs in the pressure plate.
     
  30. Bigchuck
    Joined: Oct 23, 2007
    Posts: 1,141

    Bigchuck
    Member
    from Austin, TX

    Warped clutch disc comes to mind.
     

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