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Hot Rods 1963 Ford falcon - AOD or C4?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Boulderdash, Feb 11, 2018.

  1. Boulderdash
    Joined: Jul 24, 2009
    Posts: 95

    Boulderdash
    Member

    Hello fellow Hambers!
    I am currently rebuilding a 302 to go in my 63 Falcon 2dr Sedan. The steering and crossmember etc has been previously swapped over for v8 use, and it has already had a 5 stud conversion too. I have an AOD trans to use and, as of last week, now a C4. I was originally intending to use the AOD due to its overdrive street ability. But now I have the C4 sat there alongside it, it's simplicity and significant weight advantage has me wondering if I should run this instead.
    There's 3.0?:1 gears in the 8" at the moment, so that lends to using the C4, but on the other hand I would need to buy a 157 tooth flexplate and matching converter if I did go down this route. Not to mention the fuel consumption increase.
    Also will the AOD need tunnel mods to fit? I have read differing things about this. And is the parasitic drain of the AOD over the C4 really enough to be a consideration?
     
  2. scrap metal 48
    Joined: Sep 6, 2009
    Posts: 5,249

    scrap metal 48
    Member

    You have a lot to think about.. For a hobby car I would go with the C4.. If your going to use it everyday and a lot of highway driving, then the AOD... I know, not much help....
     
    osage orange likes this.
  3. LM14
    Joined: Dec 18, 2009
    Posts: 1,048

    LM14
    Member
    from Iowa

    I believe the C4 and AOD can use the same flex plate.
    If you have a 3.0 gear go with the C4.

    For a casual car I would use the C4, it takes a LOT of miles to recoup the gas difference VS the price difference involved in all the other things you will need (shifter, TP cable setup) to use the AOD.

    I just went thru the same thing. Have a C4 and an AOD sitting here. Decided to put the C4 in my '32 (roller 302 with 3.25 gears) and use the AOD (with an adaptor) behind the 390 FE in my unibody with 4.11 gears. Figured the FE could use all the help it can get and the '32 needs the smaller tranny tunnel.

    SPark
     
    osage orange likes this.
  4. cracker head
    Joined: Oct 7, 2007
    Posts: 968

    cracker head
    Member

    Use the AOD, drive the fuck out of it. Sledgehammer will make proper clearance.
     
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  5. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 14,723

    gimpyshotrods
    Member

    More gears is more better, as long as you have the proper rear gear.

    If you are starting from nothing, always more. As has been mentioned, recoup time for a swap in a hobby car is infinite.

    My daily driver Falcon has 6-gears, but had a busted 3-speed.

    My blown Hemi will have just 3. No hope for high MPG there.
     
  6. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 2,067

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    C4 pan fill and AOD use the same 164T flexplate. C4 case fill uses the smaller 157T.
     
  7. Contrary to above posts, the C4 and AOD DO NOT share the same flexplate. They look the same, but the AOD plate has a different 'recess'; it moves the torque convertor slightly closer to the engine block. Sometimes you can get away with it, but the times it doesn't work it takes out the front pump on the trans. Correct flexplates are readily available, don't take a chance. Make sure you get the right balance factor, 50oz or 28oz.

    Also be aware that the '63-65 Falcon has two body shells; the six is one, the V8 another. The V8 shell has considerably more bracing, as well as heavier-gage metal in the frame rails, shock towers, crossmembers, and rockers, all to reduce flex with the more powerful and heavier V8. If you have to modify any existing bracing, make sure you replace it and subframe connectors are highly recommended on a six-to-V8 conversion.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2018
  8. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 2,338

    southcross2631
    Member

    Your use of an AOD will mean a gear change . My old street driven 5.0 powered Morris Minor had a 3.00 gear with an AOD and lugged below 55 in overdrive. Went with a 4.11 gear and it was a whole new car. Still cruised at low rpm's on the highway.
     
  9. savannahDan
    Joined: Nov 26, 2008
    Posts: 91

    savannahDan
    Member

    I've done this swap in an early mustang with 3.70 gears. With a free AOD, the little stuff added up costwise - AOD crossmember, Lokar TV cable kit, shift linkage, etc. When it was all done and I got the TV cable set the way I wanted it, I just didn't like the AOD. It shifted lazy, was a little on the clunky side, just didn't feel sporty. I preferred the C4 and 3.00, and even 3.25 gears. Only downside was long distance freeway driving, but it wasn't that bad really. MPG not a huge difference.
     
  10. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 6,884

    George
    Member

    I had a Crown Vic Police Interceptor with 351W, OAD & 3.08s. Seemed fine to me & was fast enough for the cops.
     
  11. Boulderdash
    Joined: Jul 24, 2009
    Posts: 95

    Boulderdash
    Member

    Thanks for the advice chaps!
    I thought the C4s had a big and a small bellhousing. Mines the small type, so I though this meant I need the smaller, 57 tooth flexplate?
     
  12. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 2,338

    southcross2631
    Member

    I always put a shift kit and a B&M convertor in my AOD swaps, it takes the sloppy clunky shifting out.
     
  13. Kerrynzl
    Joined: Jun 20, 2010
    Posts: 1,587

    Kerrynzl
    Member

    Go with the AOD
    With the 3.0:1 rear and 24.5" rolling diameter tyres you'll be cruising 70mph at 1930 rpm.
    The lower 3 gears are almost identical to a C4 so nothing will change there.

    A 1991 heavy ol' Crown Vic barge with a 5.0 and AOD had a 2.73 rear end [and 215/75 R15 tyres]

    You don't need subframe connectors on a Falcon. The V8 variety and Ragtops had "Torque Boxes" which tied the front subframe to the sill .
    They are easily made ,or you can buy them.
     
  14. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 2,808

    jimmy six
    Member

    If I put in an 8" in my 56 with a cruise0matic which has similar trans gears I was going with a 2.80 rear gear. That's an option for the C4 and they are very reasonable.
     
  15. Maybe yours are different, but the US versions were structurally different between the V8/Converts and sixes. There was also variations for the wagons/Rancheros. Cracked frame rails, broken windshields, and blown-out upper control arm mounts have been known to occur...
     
    gimpyshotrods likes this.
  16. Boulderdash
    Joined: Jul 24, 2009
    Posts: 95

    Boulderdash
    Member

    But will an AOD and 5.0 combo fit a 62/63 Falcon without trans tunnel butchery?
     
  17. George
    Joined: Jan 1, 2005
    Posts: 6,884

    George
    Member

    B&M makes a constant pressure valve body that takes the gnat's ass dialing in out of the equation. Still have to run the cable, just not so finicky.
     
  18. BLUSHU
    Joined: Sep 1, 2016
    Posts: 313

    BLUSHU
    Member

    The one regret I have when I built my o/t Falcon is that I didn't use an overdrive.
    With 3:55 gears my little 5.0 is taching about 3000 rpm on the highway @ 65 mph.
    I personally would look into a Gear Vendors over drive & keep the c4.
    By the time the smoke clears either choice will cost about the same.
    I haven't had very good luck with the AOD or AODE in the past.
    Just my opinion.
     
  19. wood remover
    Joined: Dec 23, 2012
    Posts: 560

    wood remover
    Member

    The aod does not fit that well in the transmission tunnel. Had a 64 sprint , with a 5 litre and aod (bought it that way ) transmission was always bumping off the floor. Finally got tkred of it and put a 260 and c4 back in it .r
     
  20. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 2,338

    southcross2631
    Member

    Once you figure out how to adjust the cable they are really good transmissions.
    Most people don't take the time to figure out how they work and then blame the design.
     

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