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Projects 1940 Ford Coupe Resurrection, Tuesday Night Special, 303 Olds Taildragger

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Crusty Chevy, Sep 14, 2017.

  1. I have a 4 barrel Carter carb that's on an Olds intake. If your interested in the carb shoot me a PM. Open to offers so it will be reasonable.
    Crusty Chevy likes this.
  2. Can you post what carb you're looking for in case someone has one? I know I have some old GM carbs lying around, as do others.
    Crusty Chevy likes this.
  3. bangngears
    Joined: Aug 30, 2007
    Posts: 1,146

    from ofallon mo

    by the looks of the engine it must have had the old Pennsoil with the parafin wax in it.
    Crusty Chevy likes this.
  4. These are Rochester 4GC#'s 1954 700590 1955 700700 and 1956 7007221, I am sure of these numbers all are 4 barrell and for cars with automatics. These seem to be fairly common.

    Carter WCFB #'s 2246s, 2016s, 2080s, 2059s and 932s, I am not totally sure of these as it is hard to find source material to confirm, some are possibly earlier 1952-3 numbers and may have the small base. These seem to be less common. Only one I have seen is a 2059s that was listed as 54 Buick, but it looked right.
  5. Will do, thanks.
  6. Lots to report on. Paid what I thought was too much on the Bay for a crusty looking but correct 7000221 '56 Olds carb and was pleasantly surprised when it arrived. It was not too bad to begin with. Everything inside was in order and good shape except the leather accelerator pump was all dried and shrunk.
    20230514_132434.jpg 20230514_132449.jpg 20230514_145645.jpg

    Ran it through my ultrasonic cleaner, followed up with soft brass bristle brushes on the Dremel and good old elbow grease. Installed a new pump, set to factory adjustments, some paint and "good as new"? I used my favorite VHT Chassis and Rollbar paint. Its a one part epoxy, so fuel resistant and no primer required, just takes super long to harden.

    Pulled the old axle out and spent 2 hours with the wire wheel followed up with the VHT epoxy making it look much better. New pins, assembled and ready for some test fitting in the chassis.
    20230524_122201.jpg 20230602_181136.jpg

    Got the big patch in the cowl done. It went pretty well.

    So I made a new hole to fill, next time.

    I am looking at the CT style mounts I have for the 303. They use the large 5/8-11 on the side of the block and a small 3/8" bolt in a boss off the block under the head. The drivers side is factory drilled with a large boss on the backside for the bolt to go into.
    Passenger side is not drilled with no large boss. Got to be honest I am very nervous about drilling and tapping the block so close to the water jackets. I would prefer to find a set of Hurst mounts to avoid the issue all together but have had no luck in the last few years. Anybody done this? I asked Paul who had a motor in the classifieds with these mounts and he simply stated "I drilled and tapped it". Anybody else used these CT mounts? How deep should I drill the hole? How many threads do I really need for a 3/8" bolt to hold torque? Anybody have some Hurst mounts you would part with? I have a friend in the machine shop business who can make me a pile of them to re-sell if I can just come up with one set to copy.

    And I treated myself to a bit of a "mock-up" as reward for sweeping out all the grinder dust from the cowl repairs.
    With the weight supported with jack stands under the rear end I have about 3" of a 15" rim showing below the skirt. I would like it a smidge lower and assume with more weight added to the car in the form of an engine and transmission, full gas tank, interior and glass it should settle right down to where I would like it to be with out messing with the leaves again, I hope.
    Stogy, chevyfordman, Squablow and 6 others like this.
  7. skooch
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 229


    In researching how to install a 303 I’ve seen some hambers make some great looking mounts, I don’t have that level of skill. I bought a sbc hurst style mount from speedway and modified it to fit the factory front mount holes. Haven’t put it in the car yet but I think it’s going to work well.
    Stogy and Crusty Chevy like this.
  8. I just installed a 303 in a 39 pickup using the Hurst mounts. I was totally surprised when the engine hit the crossmember and steering column and the mounts were nowhere near the stock Ford mounts. Taking a step back and doing more research I found that the 35 to 40 Fords need an additional 1.5 inch spacer. Hurst spacer sp150. I made my own spacer using 5/16 x 2 inch flat stock. I also needed to trim 1 inch off the bottom of the firewall. Not sure if the CT mounts are this way just letting you know my issues. 20230527_185426.jpg OL202COMP.JPG 20230530_165020.jpg
    Stogy, Squablow, brEad and 4 others like this.
  9. I was thinking also to modify the SBC Hurst mount. I see them at the swap for $25-50 occasionally. Post a pic if you have one of it on the engine.

    I was also contemplating making something using 3/16" material bent and welded to the two CT mounts ( using them for their side hole in the block mounting point and the chassis mount and cutting off the uprights) incorporating the four bolt factory lower mount. Something like this that was made combining a Pontiac Hurst mount and a factory Olds lower mount (pic from an old Olds thread on here): 0F4D643C-6996-4C6B-8AE2-AF7C6FAEEBBF.jpeg 53D6AF43-DDC6-4C33-A85A-F01E5768DB70.jpeg

    I have heard some old timers say that the factory lower mount can just be bolted to the original crossmember's rear lip (excluding the rubber base). Might set up some vibration issues that way but my 47 chevy I6 has a fabed front mount made of 1/4" angle to clear a rack and pinion that uses a 1/4" piece of rubber sheet through bolted between it and the motor. I have not noticed issues from the drivers seat other than the fenders shake a little bit more than they used to at idle at a stop sign.
    Stogy, brEad and Thor1 like this.
  10. The distance from the top of the chassis mount ear to the center of the hole in the block above it is 3 1/2", which looks to be about the same as yours, guessing I am going to need the spacers, thanks for the heads up.

    My firewall has these slits in it and the metal was folded up and back when I first got it (I just pushed it down), I have been thinking it had an olds/cad in a previous life.

    20230603_171310.jpg 20230603_171303.jpg 20230603_171316.jpg
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  11. skooch
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 229


    If I had an original mount I would have been happy to use it, here’s some pics of what I ended up with. Filled in and cut away all the Chevy holes, drilled the 2 bottom middle holes and welded tabs for the outer 2. There’s not much meat there but it matches the stock mount.
    7EAFB312-7296-4197-B007-6801A2F879E2.jpeg 0B923540-51B0-4AFD-AC0F-635F6C9D9C2C.jpeg
  12. Quick question. Is there supposed to be a pad or anything between the front transverse leaf spring and the crossmember? Part of me thinks yes to be an anti-squeak and other part thinks it would be a bad idea and could compress and allow the spring to get loose in U-bolt clamps.

    Because posts without pics are no fun, and why I'm asking: I pulled the front crossmember back out (I had put this one in years ago to replace a butchered one) to sand blast and clean up. Here it is ready for paint and hopefully soon to receive the front suspension.
    Stogy, Thor1, Squablow and 2 others like this.
  13. No pad that I have ever seen.
    Stogy, Crusty Chevy and Woogeroo like this.
  14. Well I decided to put on my Big Boy Undies and do as Paul recommended and just drill it and tap it. Pulled out my supplies, stared at it for a bit and just went for it.

    I snuck up on it and did not have any issues. I ground the parting line down so the bracket would rest smoothly against the block. Marked, punched and drilled it slowly out to 5/16" starting with 1/8" and progressing up in size. I tapped to 3/8 -16. I have to say that block is very hard metal. It drilled easily enough with freshly sharpened bits (love my Drill Doctor!) but the tapping was slow going with lots of back and forth and removing to clear shavings. I went in 1/2" and have left about 1/8" of material to not risk breaking through the back side which is tapered and does not sick out as far as the front as the cylinder is there. I have a blind hole bottom tap on order to cut it the rest of the way down.

    Both mounts installed for a test fit and some measurements.

    With the mounts squared away the motor was ready for some color. I made masks for the exhaust, intake and fuel pump areas by tracing the real gaskets onto card stock and cutting them out and punching holes to bolt them in place. I went stock Olds green from Bill Hirsch paints. I have had good luck with this product in the past. One word of warning. I had brushed it on in the past but sprayed it this time. The can said that it is spray ready but it is actually too thick as is. It would not spray out of my old suction feed mini gun at all. I diluted about 10% with xylenes and then it sprayed and flowed out great at around 40psi. I gave it three coats with the last two pretty heavy. Drips on the floor are from a bad cup gasket, not paint runs, got to fix that.......I also got a bunch of dust in the valve covers and probably everywhere but with the texture you cant tell (spraying in a dirty garage after all) and plan on simply buffing the covers out to eliminate some of it. Not building a show car here, this will be a greasy motor in 5000 miles. But it should look nice when assembled. Not sure what to do about the yellow to highlight the embossed letters on the valve covers. I know I am not steady enough to hand letter it. Anybody know of stencils or possibly vinyl stick-ons out there?
    20230611_175155.jpg 20230611_175213.jpg
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  15. skooch
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 229


  16. Paul
    Joined: Aug 29, 2002
    Posts: 16,363


    looking good
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  17. Nice job on the mod. Paint looks great.
    Word of caution....I have the same style engine stand. It is prone to falling over when you least expect it with that Olds hanging off there with it's extended bell. I lengthened the front floor support to keep it from feeling like it was going over. Learned the hard way as I had a spare block on mine when it felt like lying down on the floor. Very dangerous, especially if you have people around it when it decides to go.
    I also have a support under the front to stop the "bobber action" of the block.
    Stogy, brEad and Crusty Chevy like this.
  18. Yes, I cannot wait to get it back on the floor dolly. It is mighty top heavy up there and I have seen it do a bit of 3 wheel motion a time or two moving it around. I have been keeping a 2x4 wedged under the bottom to the floor to keep the bobbing away when working on it. Once the paint hardens up in a few days I will install the lower bell so it has something to rest on.

    Thanks, I missed that somehow in my searches.
    Stogy and Thor1 like this.
  19. Time for an update. I finally finished up the drivers side of the cowl. It took two more patches from where I was last time. I did a Bad Chad and did a lot of flat pieces using few bends and lots of butt welding. Its not Riddler level but its back to solid with no pin holes. It will need some sculpting putty, but so little will show with the fender on.


    Had to rebuild below the hinge as well, pretty happy with this as it was pretty rough.


    I test fitted the running board. The lower cowl is a tad too long as it hits the board, it was gone from both sides so I had no ideas how long to make it, and will need to be trimmed back just a bit.


    Got the front suspension installed. I picked up a spindle bushing/king bolt kit and have a reamer on the way. That is for next time. This is the last major hurdle to getting it on four wheels. I have a disc kit for it. Once its on wheels I can spin it around and start work on the passenger side. Which thankfully, is in better shape and hopefully will not take forever.


    The wishbone ball is just hanging at the moment. I have two ball cup caps and plan on using them as a way to attach the ball to the CE center of the X that is set up for split bones that I wish to avoid having to do. Plan is to drill a big hole to slide one cup in and weld in from the top side. We will see if there is enough clearance once the engine and trans are in.

    Speaking of transmissions I have decided to do my best Phill A and rebuild the Hydramatic. I have picked up a few tools and manuals, watched a bunch of videos and am ready to order my parts once I pull it down and make sure there is nothing major wrong with it. I could not find a 51 Olds shop manual, but there are tons of cheap Pontiac ones out there, can't be too different????

    I like to mix up the mechanical and body stuff, keeps it interesting. Thanks for hanging in there, its been a long road so far.
    Algoma56, brEad, Stogy and 8 others like this.
  20. Jacksmith
    Joined: Sep 24, 2009
    Posts: 1,512

    from Aridzona

    Keep goin'... we're with you!
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  21. Squablow
    Joined: Apr 26, 2005
    Posts: 17,312


    Looks good, cowl metalwork looks well within bodywork range, which is all it'll ever need. No rot, clean solid steel to work off of and no big ditches to fill. Can't really get much better than that, especially if you've got nothing to go off of.

    You're a brave man to take on that transmission job, I'm going to need to work up the courage to take some transmissions apart soon. Never did one, but I want to learn, since there's so few people left to do that kind of work. I'd really like to hear how that goes.
  22. brianf31
    Joined: Aug 11, 2003
    Posts: 929


    Nice progress!
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  23. Scott's 40
    Joined: Apr 28, 2012
    Posts: 263

    Scott's 40
    from VA

    Hopefully, some of these pictures will be helpful. That thick udercoat is what I brushed on - a bucket of Sears & Roebuck undercoat I had put on in summer of 1966.
    Aug 27  #1 reference cowl pics.jpg
    Aug 27  #2 reference cowl pics.jpg Aug 27  #3 reference cowl pics.jpg Aug 27  #4 reference cowl pics.jpg Aug 27  #5 reference cowl pics.jpg

    Unfortunately that bottom cage bolt is broke off and I'm going to figure out how to get it out of the nut. Ugh!

    Anyway, hope some of this is useful.
    Stogy, brEad and Crusty Chevy like this.
  24. aussie57wag
    Joined: Jul 13, 2011
    Posts: 671

    from australia

    Love the plan. The 303 olds is awesome. And tail dragger will be cool.
    Stogy and Crusty Chevy like this.
  25. Thank you. I knew there should be an indent at the bottom but I had no idea the placement or depth. I think I'm about 3/8" too long using your measurements. Easier to fix now, than later.
    brEad likes this.
  26. Scott's 40
    Joined: Apr 28, 2012
    Posts: 263

    Scott's 40
    from VA

    Let me know if you want any additional pictures of that area and where I should place the tape measure.
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  27. Need a little '40 steering wheel removal help. I have a very nice column, drop, wheel and mast with a tight steering box. Besides needing a good scrubbing and paint the only real problem is the bell behind the wheel has a big gonk with a crack. The bell is distorted enough that the backside of the wheel rubs against it when it is turned.


    I'd like to get the wheel off to push it out and repair it or possibly just replace it with this good bell I have on another mast.

    The rub is I cannot figure out how to get the wheel off. I got the nut off and have a steering wheel puller but this one has no threaded holes to put it into.

    I have a beat up spare '40 wheel with the holes for a puller.

    So what is up with my good one not having any threaded holes? Is their a trick? Special tool that grabs the back of the wheel? I noticed the key ways are different between the two, is that a clue? I tried to use a gear puller on the ring that holds the horn button but it just bent and I quit before doing any real damage. I also whacked it from the backside with a rubber mallet pretty hard and no luck.
    Stogy likes this.
  28. Wayne67vert
    Joined: Feb 23, 2012
    Posts: 130


    put the nut back on but don't expose any threads above the nut. Pull on the outer rim where the arms connect. Have someone smack the nut with a hammer. It will pop off.
    Stogy, Jacksmith and impala4speed like this.
  29. BJR
    Joined: Mar 11, 2005
    Posts: 9,692


    I have drilled and tapped steering wheels so that a puller can be used. Very easy, especially since you have one already drilled and tapped to copy.
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  30. Time for an update. Been a bit ADD with it this past bit. Struggled to get the spindles fit. I bought a bushing/king pin kit at the NSRA nats. It was a Carpenter branded kit. Installed the bushings by pressing in using my bench vice and my reamer would not fit, their ID was too tight. So I ordered bushings alone from Third-gen. They were different maker but the same problem too small ID, same as Carpenter's, to fit my reamer. 20231105_082930.jpg
    So I took it all to the machine shop and had them hone on the pin hone. They wore through all the brass down to the steel backing to get them to size. And they lost one of my pins! Back to square one. Ordered a third generic kit off ebay from Gearhead World to get a new pin and the bushings that came with it fit on my reamer. So out with the bushings again, in with the new ones. Machine shop then found my pin. So now I have a complete second kit with bushings that I know will not work. At this point it would have been cheaper to buy new spindles from Speedway that come with honed bushings and pins (but do not have arms and need bolt on's attached). I topped the spindles off with Speedways 11" brake kit. No issues with that. It has a bearing adapter for the spindle. I do not own a press, which is recommended, but the instructions are good and tell you to heat adapter at 400* in oven for 20 minutes. I did so and it just slid on. Once cool it was perfectly secured. These have the larger full size 70's car calipers. Same kit I have on my '47 Chevy and have been happy with.

    I always paint the rotor hat with rustoleum Barbecue black, hate seeing rusty rotors through the wheel windows. Calipers (and rear drums) brush coated done with Eastwood silver caliper paint, one pint has lasted me nearly 20 years.

    One piece at a time: I had two under radiator pans. One with a rusty bottom and the other with very badly cracked sides with large sections of the mounting flange missing. Even the good sides had cracks. I cut the two apart, blasted the parts clean, added some reinforcing to the cracked areas and welded them back together. Favorite VHT chassis and rollbar black spray bomb job and ready for service.

    20231105_083019.jpg 20231105_083033.jpg

    Started on the Winter project; rebuilding the Hydramatic. Got it disassembled. It was pretty filthy inside but was full of fluid so no rust or water damage. I found evidence of part rebuilding; stripped case of all green paint then painted black and yellow markings on case exterior and internal fasteners. 20231011_183700.jpg


    I found one are of concern on tear down. The main shaft had too much end play. There is a selective thrust washer that comes in various thicknesses to take up the slack. I had .035 slack on a .062 washer, it should have been .004-.018. This slop allowed the main shaft gear to ride up too high on the planetary gears causing wear to the end of the main shaft teeth. It should have been riding in the middle not at the ends so the gear/shaft is still good with a correct thickness washer which I have found a NOS .082 washer on eBay that will get me within spec..


    These little bits of metal off the gear(and probably other trash) embedded themselves in the rear band (on right in photo below)causing a lot of damage.


    I got lucky again on eBay and found a NOS drum for short money. This is a one year only part, who knows how long they had it listed, but I'm thankful to have it. I picked up a full rebuild kit from David Edwards along with his last NOS rear band as mine was contaminated with all the metal debris. So far everything else looks real good. I have not broken down some of the larger assemblies like the pumps, and reverse unit yet so hopefully no more surprises. So far I am into it for around $600 not including a few special tools I have purchased to do the job. My wife's Pontiac hydramatic cost around $4500 to be built around 8 years ago (it had lots of broken parts and was done at a transmission shop). It was her build and I was very hands off with it as she wanted to handle it herself, probably a mistake but gotta let them learn. She gave me a high 5 the other day seeing it all pulled down, I got real lucky with her, good wife and mom to the kids.

    Its all in individual baggies labeled to where it goes. I have a large high heat ultrasonic that I have started to clean parts with and its doing a great job, just takes a long time to get all that burnt on stuff off. Hope to have all this cleaned and back together by Christmas:


    Attached Files:

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