4WD under '30 Ford PU -- anybody done it?

I've been driving a 4WD shorty S-10 for several years and really like having the 4x4 -- no serious "off-roading" but I'll use it several times each month. Kinda like insurance, you can do without, but there's times it's real nice to have!

I'm thinking about building an extended-cab PU and would like 4WD on it, but haven't seen one and builders start backing off real quick and muttering about "custom installation" and "why would you do that?"

As to why -- same reason some people chop/channel/section/shorten/etc -- 'cause I want to!

And when has "it hasn't been done before" stopped a hot rodder?

I'm thinking about using Chevy half ton running gear but am open to suggestions, etc.

definition of "suggestions" does not inclued "sarcasm, witticisms, and other such frivolirty!

 

If you really want to do it and make it look decent try using first generation bronco or jeep chassis.
I know of a 51 chevy pickup on an S-10 chassis that was made to look stock. Very nicely done.
Good luck!

 

I think your crazy. There is no such thing as a hot rod 4x4. You should drive the chevy pickup and sell me the '30.

Mootz

 

Yea, Jethro did that at the end of the remake of "Beverly Hillbillies" a few yrs back.........

 

You asked for suggestions. Mine is, don't do it. Some things are better left not done.

I don't think the above qualifies as "sarcasm, witticisms, and other such frivolirty!"

 

LOL, now that you've had your balls busted, do a search under Marmon-Herrington. The spelling may be off, but these guys did 4WD conversions on pre- and post-war Fords. I've seen a couple of woodies and a sedan delivery on an M-H chassis, and they were pretty cool. Certainly cooler than an S-10.

 

I don't think I would do it under a 30 ford PU maybe a later model truck from the fourties or fifties. But if you want it to look tastefully don't put big wide tires and wheels on it. Try to find some kind of a skinny wheel and run skinny type tire they can be tall just don't go real wide otherwise it will look stupid like the vehicles that everyone on here is thinking of.

And use straight axle type 4x4 stuff not the independent style front ends that are in use now under most 4x4's.

I've also thought about building an old styled 4x4 pickup out of a 48-54 chevy pickup. using late 60's to early 80's chevy pickup drivetrain.

I wasn't going to lift it or anything just put some taller skinny buckshots on it with black steel wheels and some cut up moon hubcaps to fit the front hubs. I would also make the truck look fairly stock on the outside to but maby mold the headlights in and change the taillights. Keep it simple and clean was what I would be going for. Kind of like the old army jeeps from wwII or something.

 

I say go for it! It's your truck, build it how you want to, and fuck-em if they don't like it! Just don't call it a hot rod. It might be a "hot rod 4 wheeler", but it's not a hot rod in the traditional sence.(sp)


I remember back in my rock crawlin days there was a guy who built a rig with a model A body on it. He went so far as to run "big-n-little's" on it, with the axles geared to match the two different tire dia.s. It looked good from a design/fabrication standpoint, but it looked a little odd over all. I'd be afraid of destroying the body, so I'd never build one like it, but I used to kinda "get after it" when I'd be out rock crawlin.

Kinda like this:

 

I think that the reason it hasn't been done before (or hasn't been done too often, because there's the occasional abortion on Ebay) is that the 4X4 frame looks seriously awkward underneath the elegant Ford body.

 

The first one I saw was back about 1965. It was a 30 A closed cab pickup, stock 4 banger, with a Jeep transfer bolted to an AA four speed trans. It had a Jeep front axle mounted on the stock spring and an AA wishbone. Ran stock 19" A wheels with mud grip tires all around. He had a plow on the front, and that truck worked in the snow every day. I have seen numerous others since then. I did build a 4x4 48 Angila one time.

 

I dont think Dr. Chop ever made it to the new board, but I know he had at least one 4x4 model A. http://www.roddingroundtable.com/rides/members/12drchop.html . I think it was on a Jeep J10 frame?

 

I think it could look good with early jeep parts under it....IE wwII surplus style. I am thinking some field wheels (those ones that bolt apart) banger motor and a solid fornt axle (a converted banjo would be tits)

 

I have an 80 Dodge short box 4x4 frame under my 50 Dodge cab and front clip. My 50 was an old 2 ton dump truck. I had to reconstrust the front fenders and I built a box because the wheel wells in the original box were not in the correct position. It runs out and drives pretty good. Some day it's going to be blue.

It runs, drives and is currently licensed and insured. It is my winter ride. Next year it may be supporting a plow. Not very popular, and not very triditional, but ask me if I care. Gene

 

look for pictures of the roadster built by foose (I think) with all cyclone or typhone drive train. it was all wheel drive.

 

In Canada a truck like this could be practical as a fun runner...but it could easily look like junk if you go extreme!

This is how I'd approach it...A solid tubular chassis for a start, that fits the cab and has strength for the added mass of a driven front axle. Maybe even 2x6x...3/16wall and tapered like a Deuce rail to give it a nice look.
(NO frame swapping...that kills it because everything becomes a compromise.)

The 60's/70's Bronco and Ford trucks of the same era had a clean coil front axle with radius arms that worked great and have a traditional "kinda" look to them. No big spring pack to support out front so you can retain the clean look of the stock A frame beyond the radiator shell.
MIGHT even be a way to run a late 40's style transverse leaf spring out front (but keeping the Model A wheelbase) however it wouldn't be an absolute necessity. You won't hide the fact its a 4x4 anyway and the coils would be under the fenders and doing a great job.

Out back use the Bronco 9" on a later transverse leaf (or coils to match the front)with some fabbed tapered I beam truck arms to a center pivot below the Tcase to keep binding out of the equation. (and to match the stock Bronco front arms)
Strong, reliable and traditional roots at least. You could even drill lightening holes in all the arms!

Keep it at a sensible, drivable height...jacking it beyond where it absolutely needs to be would be a no no...and would make it look like a joke. 16" F100 rims with some realistic rubber would look great if the factory look is important.
Try for what a STOCKish Model A 4x4 would have looked like...if Henry made one.
Keep it all Ford and you would only need 1 donor vehicle!!! You guessed it!

 

Your S-10 (Bronco II) 4x4 is a dependable little truck, as is. Wheel base about a cunt-length differnet than Model A. Hanging a 1930 shaped custom cab on it will look great and not change the performance. It'll look like Henry made it. You'll have people commenting, like "I didn't know they made a 4x4 back then", "with a Mitzubishi motor, yet!", etc. Go for it.

 

This is probably one of your better avenues.

I would use live axles under it if it were mine. Full fenders to hide a bunch of the ugly stuff. if its not a true mudder than I wouldn't go extreme, I think Goodyear still makes a decent 7.50x 15 or 16 bias mud tire. they would be a natural of that type of vehicle.

I'd keep it kind of utilitarian, not go in for all the heavy dressy shit. Let it be what it is.

If you use a coil spring type of a bronco suspension it will ride better than with leaves, say a late 60s to early 70s. You can get lighter springs from the roundy round guys.

The comments on not calling it a hot rod ar probably good advice. it'll keep the bulk of the world from getting a case of the ass with you.

An all wheel drive '30. If you do it just through it out there, don't give it a name and let everyone accept it for what it is.

This is your daily right?

 

It will look like something from Ebay. (search "Clown car, 32, Rat Rod".)

I'd put it on a 1 ton chassis with 44" BOGGERS before I'd run an S10 under a Model A. At least it would look purposeful!

Just in case someone believes this might be a good idea I HAVE to continue...

Have you ever looked at all the crap ahead of the front wheel centerline of an S10? The width of an S10, the layout of the leaf springs on an S10?
50's pickups...sure! It's a good frame in 2x4 OR 4x4 as swap material...But a MODEL A!?!? Come on...you can't be serious...
Theres more to this than just a wheelbase measure.

The frame of the S10 would be hanging out past the open front of an A. You can't just slice it off...the steering box is out there too!
You would need to relocate the engine rearward to allow the cab to fit the chassis at the correct location on the wheelbase and the rear springs and back chassis would be hanging down under the bed in full view.
It would look like it was a slapped together afterthought...

I guess you could leave the engine in its stock location, mount the cab in the same place as the S10 firewall and then have your front tires about where side mounted spares would be! Sounds great don't it? Saves work though...

Do it right or don't do it at all, unless you like being laughed at. Just making it 4x4 isn't the final goal. Wouldn't be mine anyway!

SOME resemblance to a thought out vehicle would be nice too...

Needed to be said. Sorry.

S-10 (Bronco II)...?

 

I saw a 4x4 tudor at the nationals in Louisville a few years ago. It looked stoopid. I couldn't bring myself to take a pic...

Here's one done in scale.. Don't know who built it, someone posted it on the HAMB a while back.

 

By all means if you decide to do this post pictures as you go. I have had a serious case of "got to get one of those" with all wheel drive for quite a while now. An all wheel drive rod would take care of 2 needs at once.

 

The problem with talking to a builder about your ideas is most of them will try to steer you towards their preferences. Draw a picture of what you want, then build it yourself. It'll take a couple of years or more, use an eraser at the drop of a hat! , but when you get done, it'll be yours. Don't have the time? Then wait until you are retired, there's plenty of time then.. There's artists like Foose that can interpret what the car owner wants and implement it. Then there's builders that mostly always build a car his way. Then there's zillions of wannabe builders that think they are builders just because they changed spark plugs once, that think they can make a living at building, some do, some don't, but I've seen a lot of the successful ones building garbage and some of the most talented go broke because of their desire to excell, drags them down. Recognize the obvious, most self-built 'rods are more bitchin' than those built in a busniess/custom shop. It boils down to whether you want it your way or the other guy's way, whether you want to hire it done or do it yourself. I might choose somebody like Foose, but can't afford him, so I build my own. I appreciate people that might not like my truck, or my lack of labeling it that simply butt out and keep thier shitty attitude to themselves. Labels are like assholes, everybody has one. I sense by your intro that you already have a handle on how to ignore uninvited lables. You can put any lable on it you want, or not, it's your truck. Who really gives a fuck. If you are going to use the S-10 chassis, there's no good reason to do any modification to the chassis, whatsoever, unless something is broke and you can't find a replacement. In that case, retrofit. That's what 'rodding is all about, retrofitting. If you're going to build a ground-up, that's great too. Just like everybody else you work with what you have. If I wanted a pristine built from the ground up, and had the money to do it, I wouldn't, I'd simply buy a PROWLER. But, I'd keep the truck I built with my two bare hands too, because there'd be days I would like it better.
You can put lipstick on a pig, but after it's eaten it's next meal it'll have pigshit on its lips.........

 

Actually the S10 chassis is not your best bet fot an early car. They are front steer.
For an A or something that is short in the snout a you want a rear steer chassis.

I guess the Foose route is OK but if I had a couple of hundred k for a car I would probably just buy a Lamborgini and be done with it.

 

"If I wanted a pristine built from the ground up, and had the money to do it, I wouldn't, I'd simply buy a PROWLER. But, I'd keep the truck I built with my two bare hands too, because there'd be days I would like it better.
You can put lipstick on a pig, but after it's eaten it's next meal it'll have pigshit on its lips........."


I couldn't have said it better. I have no idea what it means, but I couldn't have said it better.


Mutt

 

What it means to us farm-raised-boys, is it's a fact that the best tasting thing to a pig, in the whole wide world, is other pig-shit. They fight over it.


Mutt[/QUOTE]........couldn't have said it better. I have no idea what it means, but I couldn't have said it better.
Mutt[/QUOTE]

 

First one I saw was in mag. early 80's. It was a 30/31 A pickup and used early jeep running gear with coil overs and four bars on both ends. Looked real good.
Been wanting to build one for the last 25 years. Currently have a 84 Toyota pickup for the running gears. Bet I get a lot on the Toy!!
I'm just an old hot rodder from way back and ya use parts that are in the junkyards. Just check out prices for early jeep running gear.
The early Bronoc running gear would work out also. Around here the early Brono stuff starts at $450 for just a rearend! Started with that in the 80's but moved to CO in '86 and sold all the cars and parts.

 

Th' fella' said he has a S10 4x4. By the time you hang an apron, and a bumper out there in front of the radiator, it ain't a short snout any longer anyhow. Standoff, it'll look Bitchin', like Henry built it, but it'll drive on the highway just like it does now; no better, no worse. Nothing is a best bet.

 

.......early jeep, (you)r 84 toy, s-10 (very similar to BroncoII), D-50, they all work good. Yep you'll probably get a lot of hog-shit about that, but who gives a flyin'fuck. Us farm boys know all about that.
It'll by yours. Proporting to re-design a complete chassis instead of using a good'un that's already road-tested is kind of lame. I prefer something like '82 Mazda, with the tortion bar suspension, good handler.

 

That's the first 4x4 hotrod i've seen that i liked!

 

If you used some skinny 19" knobbies or some dirt track tires, it would look pretty cool.

However, it could turn out to be a clown car/ E-bay abortion if you tried the wide mud tires.

 

This is a little over the top. I'm sure it drives OK...but it just too much of the 4x4 thing.