Projects My 61 f100 302 aod swap !

So I had been pushing this aside for a while up until the three speed locked up on me. I had a 302 crate motor sitting around and a 30,000 original mile aod trans I have been wanting to drop in for that OVERDRIVE! So I've looked in here and haven't seen any build threads so here goes mine. I'm not done yet still need to make a support for the trans but that's what I used to hold it up for now. My buddy just spot welded the bolt on mounts, which is easier to do once you center the engine. I picked up the mounts from speedway, they say to mark everything where it's gonna go then take the mounts out and drill the frame, but two spot welds and there u go its in place now I just drill through. Swap so far is fairly simple, I'm a newbie without a shop, all in the driveway. If anyone has any input or trans mount ideas let me know I will keep posting as I go along. Is it just me or does it look like there's too much engine bay space still ! Hahaha


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I would use this:http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Tubular-Transmission-Mount-with-2-Inch-Drop,4219.html Pick up an ANCHOR 2253 rubber mount from O'Rielly or Autozone about $10.

 

Good luck with this project.

Be sure to replace that original crossmember with several new crossmembers, as removing the original is a big deal if can understand the philiosophy behind what Ford was trying to do using it in the fashion they did...

Check out what I did with my 1960 and O/D tranny.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=366906

 

The tranny crossmember can be almost that simple, but because the original crossmember is cut out you should have a strong tranny crossmember or one under the engine to replace it.

I don't think the engine is centered on those trucks. I think it's offset to the right like the 65 and later ones all are. Easy way to tell, check if the rear end pinion is in the center or closer to the right side.

 

Looking good so far.
That original engine mount was really a structural crossmember that also held the engine. Would be cool to get some of that structure back.
Good luck with the project!

 

Hooooooo boy, you're gonna love that 302! I'm just waiting on the day my C4 goes out so I can throw in an AOD. MAKE SURE YOU SET THE TV CABLE UP PROPERLY OR YOU RISK DESTROYING YOUR DRIVETRAIN!

 

Your right about that I centered the motor and it doesn't look center because the trans tunnel looks off to one side. But the way the mounts go it centers it no matter what because the go on the inside of the frame so no room to play with it. Is this a bad thing ? Also I am going to weld a solid crossmember for the trans, would that be enough ? Thanks every one for joining in on advice.



Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Attached is a document posted by an engineer idscussing what an f100 chassis needs when fitting a Jag IFS.

I know you are not doing the IFS but it is worth the read all the same from your point of view of playing with cross members etc.

Just taking a step back you will note that the way Ford has mounted the engine (and that original cross member you have just removed) which really has been designed to keep the cab and up front portion of your vehicle quite rigid and let the rear portion of the chassis do the flexing especially when the box was loaded.

Part of having the cab and pickup box as two separate items is also part of coping with the flex.

By weakening the front system of original bracing you could create the potential for chassis twist up front which will place all sorts of stress on your cab components including doors etc.

Stress on your cab will increase the possibility of sheet metal tearing and stress in panels increases the capacity to rust and warp panels.

The basic idea is that you much prefer your suspension to be doing the work rather than your chassis and effective cross members will help you achieve this.

Just my 2 cents worth and do with it what you will, but if it helps you make some good decisions about your build then all the better for you.

In my thread, if you have read it you will note that I boxed my chassis from the radiator back to the rear axle and the driveablilty of my f100 with the Dodge IFS I installed and the reduced chassis flex made it a much better vehicle to drive daily as I do...

I also cut and reworked my original center crossmember to keep it to clear my O/D tranny.

 

ive got the same set up in my 62 uni and love it

 

hes right about that original cross member ya cut out its structural strength for that ladder type frame , and id put some down supports under those motor mounts , just for added strength had one of those break before ,in a 55 f-100 what a ride that was 1 i usually grind off the rivets on those trans cross members and bolt em back in so if and when you need to pull that trans its alot easier , i believe ford put em in for a reason other than that trans , just my 2 cents good luck have fun

 

Yeah now I'm sketched out about that crossmember it all makes sense. I want to add one in the same spot but I'm wondering if I should move it up to the front more.The reason I say this is because I just measured where the trans crossmember will go and it's only a foot away from where the old one was. Does anyone think I should move the original one up more or is two a foot apart ok ? Also any pics of a simple fab style crossmember I can make to replace the one I cut off ?


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Yeah I questioned the integrity of them as soon as put them on (mounts). Yeah my buddy said he wants to weld a down support to reinforce the mount. I tried taking the rivets out too but it was a pain in the !?&. So I just destroyed it with a grinder unfortunately, but did you use your original on your unibody ? Also did you have the stock gearing in the rear, and if you did how did it cruise on the highway ?


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

if it were me id find another stock one and just clean up those original holes , by removing old rivets and bolt it back in the stock location , it shouldnt interfere with the trans pan or anything , if so you can raise it up a couple of inches if necessary , in fact i remember having to do that with my 62 ,been in there for 10 years now no problems ,

 

My '55 (it's an F250, same idea though) with 302/C4 combo and 3.73 rear runs just a little higher in revs than I would prefer on the highway, you'll be good with that AOD

http://www.powerblocktv.com/resources/

 

i didnt use the original as a trans crossmember , i used a aftermarket that bolted on the sides yes grinding those rivets is a pain but if you can grind one side off then use a good strong punch and a small sledge hammer theyll pop out and yes mine had a 6 with a three speed and she seems to cruise just fine down the road , check your gear ratio you might have to change that center section with a higher geared one but thats not alot of work ,

 

anything in there for reinforcement across there is better than nothing , im sure theres something you can fab or find to put back in there ,, good luck with it and keep us posted on the progress ,,

 

i'm doing 302/aod in my 62 uni also. mine has jag ifs and i'm going to try to rework that crossmember if possible. if not i plan to buy make something similar. it deff has to come up as i notched the jag crossmember into my frame roughly 3" and at ride height that stock crossmember has like 2" of clearance. the jag crossmember has 5-6". i just welded the crossmember in today and i'm gonna break the 302 i have down to pretty much a bare block to make it easier to move around for the mock up so that'll probably make it a week or so out before i start mocking anything up...ken....

 

Yeah soon I'm planning on doing a mustang 2 ifs swap on mine, I know everything would have been easier in one shot but I need my truck on the road since it's my work truck and kinda on a budget. For now at least it's close to running but I will see what I come up with for that crossmember I took out. I will post a pic as soon as I weld something in there. My buddy says the trans support will be enough since it's only a foot back from the original but seeing as many people disagree I rather be safe than sorry and add both side by side. Then a third one once I do my ifs swap, is this a thing where the more the better ?


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

If you plan to do an IFS install later, please be sure now that the IFS you choose will be compatible with your Ford engine oil pan.

This is where I got caught and ended up using a SBC engine with slightly modified oil pan.

I am mostly a Ford man, but I was beat by my IFS choice and had to submit to installing a SBC even though I had my Ford engine there and ready to go.

I used a 3.54:1 diff ratio and it is good empty, but 3.7:1 would be the better all round choice if I had my time again.
Where you are located in CA the ground is pretty flat so 3.54:1 would be fine for highway runs out there.

Just having a nice steering rack instead of the steering box with so much float was a blessing to receive...

 

I'm running a bronco rear sump oil pan right now, I'm sure I will have to modify it later but like you said I can't wait to get rid of that piece of junk steering gear box ! I hate the play in it and cost to repair so ifs will get rid of it soon. I was also thinking 3:50 ish ratio would be better for highway as well. At least for now the od will be better than my three speed that was screaming down the highway at 65


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I know my O/D is chevy and not AOD, but I lock it out mostly around the small streets and just use it on the main roads and highways.
It clicks in nicely at about 40mph and will run way over 70mph if needed.

The only way I would see 70mph in the old truck in its original form (223 six cylinder) was out of gear doing a down hill run.

Right now I am about to install a tachometer to get a better idea about how my rpm situation is running.

You will also treasure the power assisted disc brakes that come with a new IFS. Not that the old brakes were bad, but just heavy to operate after a while driving in local traffic (I got a bad back) and if loaded that made it even worse comfort wise.

The other thing I dont miss with the new IFS is that front end diving that would occur during hard turns, where the outside front would kind of dive down especially loaded and under brakes.
I think the front leaf springs were located too far from the wheel, but science say that is the way it had to be so the front wheels could turn/steer...

 

i would look at the jag xj crossmember before MII. i have dealer pricing on several mii apps but chose jag for my uni. mine would have been done months ago had i not been after an exact ride height that is probably lower than most want a static dropped truck. had i just went with welding the crossmember to the bottom of the frame it could be done as fast or faster than MII. to reach my goal i knew i had to notch into the frame and actually ended up doing so twice. the frame height at the crossmember is 4 7/8" most will say it's 5" but i had 3 other people besides myself measure and we all came with the 4 7/8". the first time i went 1 7/8" into the frame. mocked everything up and it was close but i cant say i was 100% happy. i raised the rear from where i had dropped it with an axle flip/2" blocks/1 pulled leaf about an inch and it look good but just wasn't where i wanted it so i dropped the rear back down and notched the front another 1" for a total of 2 7/8". this time i did it the easy way and welded 2x2x3/16 square tubing inside the rail and notched to it. each time i mocked it up and found it was low enough i had also went through the motions of setting wheelcenter and all which changed a little every time.

knowing what i know now i think going straight to the bottom of the frame i could do in a very focused weekend. straight to the frame nets you about 5-6" drop. that combined with an axle flip over the springs out back sits just about right together and is about as low as you get out back without heavy notches(you'd probably have to notch some) i have welder series step notches in mine as my explorer rear sits about 2/3 of the way into where the frame rail would be.

i think the jag is a better choice for these trucks. i'm also about to do a lexus sc400 crossmember in a ford. it's a bolt in unit similar to 03-10 crown vic but is about 5-6" narrower than the cv making it the correct width. lex is 5x4.5 pattern unlike jag which is 5x4.75. the biggest hurdle with the lex is it needs to be set up with coilovers or bags as it's originally strut assembly...ken...

 

I could care less what ifs setup you go with.But if you want it clean looking anything not made for the truck looks like a mess.Plenty of guys have mm2 front ends and they are just fine.You can allso buy the dokota style swap with custom cross made for these trucks from elpacko I think is his handle on here.Guys say the mm2 has messed up geometry but mine uses stock length arms and stock tie rods .The crown Vic front end is too wide so don't bother unless you are gona run front wheel drive wheel offsets.

Good luck with your project (I like ford with ford parts (or ford style parts)at least your putting a 302 in it instead of a 350 lol)

If you do a ifs swap move the front wheel center forward 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 inches looks better in the wheel wells.

Jake

 

Clean and very simple.

Jake

 

nothing wrong with MII if done right. thing is most are not but thats true with any ifs you might go with.

the biggest thing i don't like about MII is the thin crossmember and how the lower control arm extends so far behind the crossmember on most kits. most people also don't set the caster up right. right before i left the rod shop we cut an og MII out of a 47 chevy that whoever did it went extreme with 5degrees of caster which would have been heavy but not to worry they went 5degrees the WRONG WAY hahaha.

i think the jag looks clean. it's a nice fat crossmember with tubular style control arms and big 4 pot brakes. i didn't take a good pic at first mock up when it was rolled outside but will after i finish welding the crossmember in tomorrow. and mines more hacked than most would need as with the notch i also had to notch for tie rods so it's a bit more chopped up than it would be if i did another...

but attention to detail is key no matter what you use. unfortunately it's overlooked way to much............

 

but as mentioned el palako at industrial chassis makes a nice dakatoa swap for these trucks.

and if your pockets are deep and you want REALLY easy porterbuilt now offers their BOLT IN dropmember for these trucks also. nice but spendy...

 

I agree with jake on this one as far as how other clips go. M2 just in my opinion looks cleaner and simple and parts are everywhere. But I've seen jag clips done to these trucks and they look like they work too , just not the prettiest.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I would like to see some pictures of that set up once you weld in the crossmember on your truck. Post some pics when u get the chance (ken). Everyone has a different take on the fab process I'm interested in seeing how you did your jag clip.
Thanks-Andrew


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Do you know how much the porterbuilt drop member runs for ? I thought they only had chevy stuff ?


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Yea I thought I saw some where Porter built was gona do them that would be a nice way to go there stuff is really nice.

Jake