****UPDATE ON POST #51---> found out it´s a 400 cui**** I need your opinion on this... yesterday I have got a 79 Bonneville parts car for next to nothing, had 47k on the odo and it was very mint before there was a fire under the dash. The non turbo 301 engine and trans are fine and I was thinking of using this in a daily driver / cheap ass shop car project I´m building. But what I have read about these little engines is not very positive to say the least... Maybe you guys have some first hand experiance and could share some of it! This is not about a high performance application, it would just need to haul around a 4 dr 64 Buick wildcat on a daily basis and be fair on gas. Can the 301 do that`? I think it makes like 130 hp...
Realy a horrible engine yes it will run but I would never spend anything to repair one if you need a pontiac engine 350's are plentiful and cheap
Thanks, that´s I was thinking... I wouldn´t like to put money into it or build it, but it runs well as it is now and has about 47 k on it... that´s why I was thinking about using it. Does the 301 have the same overall dimensions as the the 350 Pontiac? Regarding motor mounts, lengths etc.? That way I could use what I have now and change out for a 350 when the 301 kicks the bucket...
301s are good for Grandma's Catalina - until you start trying to push them too hard. We cracked the (low-deck block specific) main webs beating one up in a '79 Grand Prix. A '72 400 cured that. After that it was about rearends. 301s and 265s are dimensionally the same as any other Pontiac except for height. They are a low-deck design. Delivered by a blind carrier pigeon.
For a low performance daily driver they will work OK. My uncle had one in a 79 Bonneville that he drive nearly 200K miles. If if recall it wasn't too bad for fuel mileage either. But it is definitely NOT something that you want to beat on or try to hot rod.
Greetings! Friend had one in a Trans-Am, crank snout broke off, motor still ran but the lower crank pully didn't move. You can save all the brackets, accessories and tin for when you get a real motor.
To haul the Wildcat with a Pontiac engine economically, find a two-barrel 350 or 389. Delivered by a blind carrier pigeon.
Those 301s can't get out of their own way. From the height of juvenile smog control. Shortly after you try to remedy the low power something breaks. Comparing the curb weight, rear end gears and trans of the parts car to your Buick will give you an idea. If they are equal, the performance and mileage will be equal. The 301 won't know the difference and work just as it did in the parts car. If you want easy, grab a Buick engine and everything will bolt in if the right stuff is sources. If you want cheap, grab a Sbc. Want dirt cheap and a bad ass economical mill find a good 307 and some 305 heads then pick a cam.
There are some things that are 301 only. It think water pump is one of those things. Might give you a bit of a problem down the road. It might park the car a day or 2 till the part comes in, not normal stocking items.
I had one in a 55 Pontiac wagon...probably 3600 lbs. Mine was the low performance 2 barrel version and the wagon had 3.23 gears. The car was pleasant to drive with the ultra-light engine up front--no power steering needed [had to cut a full 3 loops off the front coils to get the front end down!] and the engine was peppier than the old 287s were...but not by much. I was very satisfied with it's performance and mileage but in a big, heavy buick with tall gears? I dunno...drive it like a little ol' man and it'd be ok.
If its what you have, run it. don't expect it to be more than it is, and use the time to find a better engine down the road, although may surprise you if you treat it right.
Rocky, that´s a nice Poncho you had there. I regard my wildcat as a fixer upper, daily driver for a while and sell it if something else is coming along, that´s why I try to use what I have...
yes, I have to order everything from the US, but that´s the same with SBC, nailhead, you name it stuff, I buy in the US anyway.
If you have a low mile 301 engine and you just need a driver to get around town then, Yes it is fine. I would not worry about it as long as you don't put alot of money into it. Just drive it and when it goes south then put something else in. Toxic Waste
64 was not a BOP trans. Original 64 engine would be nailhead and nailhead only trans, a full round, short belhousing. Not compatible with any other later GM trans bolt pattern..
I was working in a GM dealership around that time, still am working @ a GM dealer today...77-81 Pontiac 301 Pontiac were prone to cracked crankshaft rod journals. Carbon build-up on pistons was a big concern too. Just my opinion but I would steer clear of this engine.
Use it!! We have one in an OT 79 Buick Century wagon thats been in the family since new. No powerhouse for sure, but pulls 16-17 mpg in the city and when I drove it to Tulsa averaged around 21.
Don't know how many miles you think you will put on it but I would think about replacing the timing chain before you install it most Pontiac would last tell the 70.000 mile range then jump time and bend valves and push rods.
It is a shorter deck design than the std Pontaic V8 design. So it has unique intake, and probably other stuff I can't remember. But for a easy swap and run it as-is, should be good. Just don't expect any real performance. The heads on the 301 have zero performance potential and if my memory is right, very small valves and ports. Good for lower end torque to get a bigger car moving. The bellhousing is std BOP, so the trans with it can be used if you later upgrade engines to a std Pontiac V8. Being in Germany, you probably have limited options. So use what you have to save money.
The 301 was definitely a red-headed stepchild. At first glance they do look the 'same' as a typical late model Pontiac mill - but they have a lot of unique parts - the intake being one and I believe the exhaust manifolds also. Of course the cylinder heads are also unique. They did make a higher performance 4 barrel version that was the best one to get, but they are very rare. I've probably hauled at least of dozen of them in running condition to the crusher...lol. Also, like saltflats said - if you're planning to run it at all you need to put a timing chain set in it. Surely it still has the original fiber gear on the cam...and once you start running it much all the teeth will be in the pan and it'll jump time.
Thanks for the good info, guys! I´ll give it a try and see what happens...I´m not a big fan of weak engines,but if they are weak they should at least be reliable ...and if they are not reliable, parts should be easily accessible and cheap. Maybe I´d be better of to part out the Bonneville and sell the parts, and find a 350 Buick for the Wildcat.
Baumi, i got a 301 in parts at my shop. I have a new ground .010crank, too. If you want to try the 301 you'd have every possible part for spares, can't be cheaper than that... Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
Hey Damir! That´s great! A good reason to start my Diesel Benz and cruise to your garage, hehehe Merry Christmas, my friend!
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