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Wiring advice

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 4 pedals, Sep 30, 2013.

  1. 4 pedals
    Joined: Oct 8, 2009
    Posts: 958

    4 pedals
    Member
    from Nor Cal

    My son is 14 and we are on his first build, a 65 Camino. While barely outside the set parameters of this site, I believe the work still applies. I have seen some nice work here and know there is more knowledge available than the few wiring jobs I have done. The car is essentially stock at the moment, and we intend to hook up all the gauges etc, so a reproduction harness would work, but they're spendy and he's on a pretty tight budget. (like $20-40 a month)

    I installed a Painless 12 circuit harness in my 64 10 years ago, and while it worked, it was expensive and labor intensive. It also included quite a few circuits I didn't need in a basic car.

    I recommended a harness from one of our alliance vendors for a friend's 52 F1 last year, he was happy with it and even spoke to the owner of the company when he had a question or 2 (can't remember the name at the moment)

    I have seen kits that allow you to only install the circuits as needed. I like that idea in that we can add and subtract neatly, not sure who the manufacturer(s) are.

    I have a good idea of what needs to go where, it's just the basic parts and pieces I need.

    Any recommendations?

    Thanks,

    Devin
     
  2. Leviman
    Joined: Dec 11, 2012
    Posts: 201

    Leviman
    Member

    Is the stock wiring gone? Why is it being replaced?
     
  3. 57countrysedan
    Joined: Oct 28, 2012
    Posts: 370

    57countrysedan
    Member
    from NY

    If on a budget id just replace the wires that need to be replaced and add what you need. It would save alot of time an money.


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  4. 57countrysedan
    Joined: Oct 28, 2012
    Posts: 370

    57countrysedan
    Member
    from NY

    And by the way very cool project to do with your kid! Sounds like its going to be tons of fun


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  5. bgaro
    Joined: Sep 3, 2010
    Posts: 1,189

    bgaro
    Member

    build your own. way more labor, but cheapest. i cut up a vw harness to make what i needed. if i do it again, i'll draw it out first, then lay it out on a sheet of plywood.
     
  6. What he said ^^. If you think you'll replace the harness anyway, pull the original, if it's still there, lay it out and see if you can save it by replacing "in-kind" all the damaged sections. Keep it layed out so it goes back together the same dimension as it came apart. Be sure to get rid of any corroded or cracked wire and match all the connectors, even if it means going to the junk yard and "harvesting" 3 or 4 donor harnesses so you can match wire size and color. ALWAYS solder and heat shrink your splices. Even if the original is "trashed" you can replace wires end-to-end, one at a time and retain all your original functions and geometry with a couple week's worth of evenings, and be in it $20-$30 instead of $400. A little polishing of the fuse holders with a Dremel can usually save the fuse block. Good luck, great project for a first car F/S effort!
     
  7. luckystiff
    Joined: Mar 20, 2002
    Posts: 1,465

    luckystiff
    Member

    Haywire has the TA panel.... http://ruttersparts.com/i-157450-haywire-ta-panel.html which is a "do it yourself" panel. and I guess technically the RTA also but for $10 more theres more to the TA.

    If it looks like and option for you give me a yell here or a call at the shop and i'd knock a little more off our standard price in the interest of helping a kid with a project and do it for $100 shipped.

    The E Series from Haywire is another reasonable option.. http://ruttersparts.com/i-6248772-haywire-e-series-wiring-harness.htmland again I could probably tweak a little off that to in interest of helping a kid.

    My next suggestion would be Rebel and i'll say that even with not being a Rebel Dealer. The Rebel kits and the Haywire E Series are fairly similar.

    I have the Haywire 14 fuse Deluxe on sale right now but it doesn't fit his budget very well as it's more than any of the above options....ken....
     
  8. Binger
    Joined: Apr 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,734

    Binger
    Member
    from wyoming

    I just got done putting a Speedway harness into my step son's '68 Chevy pick up and was very happy with the results.
     
  9. tjet
    Joined: Mar 16, 2009
    Posts: 1,335

    tjet
    Member
    1. Early Hemi Tech

    I built my own harness. I guess a new harness kit would have been easier, but it wasn't too tough. I make a diagram of my circuit (see below). Click the link for other diagrams...

    I also used any of the original wires & connectors that still looked good

    [​IMG]


    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/album.php?albumid=37341
     
  10. Muttley
    Joined: Nov 30, 2003
    Posts: 18,500

    Muttley
    Member

    Buy him a new harness if you can afford it. Most likely you are trying to teach him about financial responsibility by making him pay for it himself and I get that completely. However, the wiring harness is essential to the proper operation, safety and overall enjoyment of the vehicle.........in other words not something to skimp on. Not only that but the ease of installation with a proper, quality kit make this a no brainer IMO. If he wants a new paint job, interior or set of wheels and tires, then, by all means make him earn it.
     
  11. 53 COE
    Joined: Oct 8, 2011
    Posts: 688

    53 COE
    Member
    from PNW


    Exactly - Where is the kid going to get in today's prices at 20 to 40 clams a month? Along the same lines of safety and dependability are tires, brakes, engine.........


    :confused:
     
  12. oldsman41
    Joined: Jun 25, 2010
    Posts: 1,556

    oldsman41
    Member

    build your own harness. good way for him to learn.
     
  13. 4 pedals
    Joined: Oct 8, 2009
    Posts: 958

    4 pedals
    Member
    from Nor Cal

    I hadn't thought of reusing the original fuse box as a basis. I'm perfectly capable of copying the existing wires and running new ones as needed. The existing harness has been butchered by previous owners but after having done mine, I have a pretty good idea of what needs to go where.

    Those that say build your own, can you be more specific? Like I said I can run the wires, but would you use the existing fuse panel or buy another?

    To those that have made offers, thank you.

    And yes, no matter what we do, every joint will be soldered. I hate seeing a bunch of butt connectors, just looks sloppy to me.

    Devin
     
  14. As long as the fuse holders in the original fuse block are not rusted or broken beyond repair you can use the original block. Lay it out on a sheet of plywood or similar substrate so you can tape or staple everything where it belongs relative to the entire harness, open up any wrap or loom that contains problem wires and repair them as needed, then re-wrap everything and run it.
     
  15. luckystiff
    Joined: Mar 20, 2002
    Posts: 1,465

    luckystiff
    Member

    maybe help the kid find a few more ways to earn a little more money. it's fall you nor cal guys don't have yards that need raked? Offer to give $X for every hour he does volunteer work somewhere(local animal shelters always need volunteers). got car buddies that need grunt work done? degreasing, shop cleaning, whatever. nothing teaches a kid to appreciate what they have like working for it themselves. i'm 41 and have been working since I was 11. mowing lawns, raking leaves, cleaning stalls at my dads horse barn, loading watermelons, anything I could before I could actually get a "official job" which the day I turned 16 and could I went to work at a local bbq joint.

    that way your not just giving him the money even if part/all of it is coming from your pocket...ken....
     
  16. Mike51Merc
    Joined: Dec 5, 2008
    Posts: 3,856

    Mike51Merc
    Member

    Get an OEM wiring diagram (preferably color coded). A '65 car doesn't really have a lot of wires, although looking at a bird's nest under the dash is a bit intimidating. You have to view it in your mind as one wire at a time. Your patience will be rewarded.

    Pull out the entire harness, unwrap it and inspect the wires. Clean/fix/replace wires as needed. Re-wrap and install.
     
  17. 1971BB427
    Joined: Mar 6, 2010
    Posts: 8,719

    1971BB427
    Member
    from Oregon

    Ditto. I'd try to use the original harness if it's repairable, but if not the Speedway GM harness is a nice unit. I just put one in my project this summer, and it was better than any I've previously used.
     
  18. tjet
    Joined: Mar 16, 2009
    Posts: 1,335

    tjet
    Member
    1. Early Hemi Tech

    I would try to use any original pieces - like fuse panel, etc. I would also try to match the OEM wire colors, markings, & routing.

    Is there a problem with the original wiring? If it looks & tests ok, I would use old wires. Make sure all your grommets are good & the wires are properly supported & routed
     
  19. trollst
    Joined: Jan 27, 2012
    Posts: 2,108

    trollst
    Member

    So......I see it differently than most, these are the times projects stall and sometimes are given up for dead, never to be revisited as it's "too hard" and we can't perform that kind of magic ourselves. If you're embarking on a project with your son, keep it interesting enough to overcome some tough stuff, wiring for me is easy, for most its a nightmare, do yourself and your boy a big favour and purchase a decent basic kit, something you can install together and not have all that hard work burn to the ground in front of you. It'll cost the same as if you built your own, be easier, and maintain his interest, as you get better at the car thing, attempt stuff like this yourself once you understand more about it. If its strictly about money, teach him that saving for parts is what we all have to do, its part of car building, but if its your first time wiring, go with a kit.
     
  20. waterhorse
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 138

    waterhorse
    Member

    I did a 65 El Camino and I found the individual metal fuse holder pieces in several of the classic chevy parts catalogs. Mine were slightly rusted and they would heat up and lose their spring tension.
     
  21. oldsman41
    Joined: Jun 25, 2010
    Posts: 1,556

    oldsman41
    Member

    I just upgrade the fuse box they are cheap at napa.
     
  22. waterhorse
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 138

    waterhorse
    Member

    This is a better idea, then you can use modern blade type fuses. Good call.
     
  23. 53 COE
    Joined: Oct 8, 2011
    Posts: 688

    53 COE
    Member
    from PNW

    Use the existing wiring - or get a OE loom kit. This advice from someone who has wired several cars from scratch including my COE. Hours and hours of work. I always followed basic schematics, using a Honda car fuse box or something similar from a wrecking yard.

    I walked away from a purchase once recenty, partly when I looked under the dash and saw a birds nest of wires...........

    :eek:
     
  24. xtremek
    Joined: May 1, 2011
    Posts: 78

    xtremek
    Member

    To me this is about 2 things, what can you afford and does your son enjoy this kind of puzzle. I wired many vehicles (and robots), both from kits and scratch. Several of them were brought to me because of "professional" hacks and the story is always the same. "I was driving down the road and all of a sudden......." And it's usually followed by a wrecker call and BIG money. My son just bought a CJ7 that someone totally hacked. It should be about the same complexity as your Camino. He's also tight on money. I'd wire from scratch, but I'm going to tell him to try and find an unmolested one from a scrapped CJ (he lives half across the nation from me). I do like the fact that the factory and kits usually have a wider variety of wire marking than I can get from my local wire/ternimal supplier, which makes additions and diagnosis easier in the future. So does your son love is kind of puzzle? If not, I'm with trollst. And stay within your comfort zone so you can lead him on this fun adventure.
     
  25. 4 pedals
    Joined: Oct 8, 2009
    Posts: 958

    4 pedals
    Member
    from Nor Cal

    I'm capable of rebuilding the existing harness, especially if we pull it out and lay it on a board or something. He's along for the ride, learning on the way. We built a small harness to get the engine running with a simple toggle for ignition and another for the starter to demonstrate the process.

    I had been more or less considering total replacement since what is there under the dash at least has been fairly hacked, as well as what comes out to the engine, but in reality, it's not that many wires and it's going to fit better than any aftermarket kit.

    Supposedly it was running with a 427 last (2 owners prior) but it may not take as much work as I was thinking. I know the engine room sub harness can be dealt with as a separate unit, as can the rear light circuit, so after that we really don't have much beyond the gauges, heater and ignition switch.

    Thanks for your input.

    Devin
     
  26. hendo0601
    Joined: Aug 24, 2013
    Posts: 288

    hendo0601
    Member
    from Tacoma, WA

    Keep It Clean wiring harnesses can be ordered for whatever you want to run and they are pretty inexpensive. I put one in my 63 dodge and every wire is labeled and comes with a modern fuse block and was super easy to install.

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  27. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 30,629

    The37Kid
    Member

    Good luck, wish someone tought me about electricity when I was 14. Bob
     

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