The H.A.M.B. has been rubbing off on me over the years since I've been here. I think my tastes have changed a bit, more toward the traditional and period correct, but I also think I have grown less tolerant of unsafe, rust ravaged, yard-art ridden, RAT SHIT rolling through carshows trying to present itself as the real deal. All that said, I think there still needs to be wiggle room when it comes to parts you cannot find causing you to have to use reproduction pieces and upgrading for safety sake.
...cracked me up too... ...absolutely, I think he does... ....totally agree with this.... ......AMEN AND AMEN, BROTHER.... My question is...if these cars are "survivors" after how many changes do they stop being "survivors"? Case in point....my Uncle Ray Anderegg's car still exists, but only the body is on a completed hot rod, does that constitute it as a "survivor". I really want to know (hypothetically of course) if all the "ugly" (mind you I dont agree with that term at all) is removed from the blue roadster, then unchanneled, then this, then that, at what point (if ever) does it no longer deserve the "survivor" moniker?????
Better watch out, Ryan. Metalshapes will be giving you demerits for "creating drama" with this thread!
...So why stop now... Here is the way I see it. A pile of parts, rip into them... Build something nice. Same with a nicely restored original. Cut it up. There are plenty more, just like it. But a nicely aged stocker, or a even a flawed old Hot Rod or Custom that has existed as a unit for a long time, deserves a second look before its changed. If for no other reason that we don't have all the answers, right now. Remember the pastel colored cars, dripping with store bought Billet? People actually thought those were beautiful. Some of our views and tastes are colored like that as well. So when the herd is thinned to a couple of survivors, it would be nice to have those survive a little longer. If possible...
Personally if the car has history I would leave it alone but if I opened the barn doors to discover a well preserved but ugly as sin hot rod rod built from a bunch of homemade and poorly thought out parts, and the only history was that the owners brother built it back in the 50's went racing on the streets for a summer and then parked it and moved on then I would just take a bunch of photos of it as it was and use the parts I take off as wall hangers while I make the car my own. Almost no one is going to appreciate a pile of junk just because of what it was but they sure will say wow what an awesome job when they see what you built from what it was, its just like the rat rod thing there are a ton of ugly crap boxes cruising around but they have no significance and a large portion of people don't like them so if it looks like crap to you and you can see a beautiful car in there somewhere then change it.
Its yours. Do what you want. Next owner can call you a dumb shit and 'fix' it. And so on and so on etc. Its called hot rodding.
Something that was ugly in 1960 is not any less ugly now in 2013. Some cars are forgotten about and lost track of. Others simply manage to be hidden away like the bastards they are until anyone who cares that they become public news stops caring or passes on. The blue car is hideous and could be easily fixed with simple bolt on pieces allowing it to be both preserved and to not be embarrassing to be seen in. The red one I love as is and wouldn't change a thing. Forget history....long live style.
I don't visit the HAMB as much as I used to. The cars I'm building now have AC, small block Chevy's and air ride. There was a time when I built cars with a solid focus on tradition and I still really like that world. In the future I'd like to build a model A with a built banger motor. If that happens I'll be back on here a lot more. My point is, I always thought the HAMB was about being a traditional hard ass. That's why I came here. I don't get why people feel the site should change with their personal car tastes. There's other message boards and when you get back into something "period correct" the HAMB will be here like an old pair of jammy's.
Well I just fuckin LOVE this topic. I mean go figure, right? Many know I RESTORE for a living, and that may or may not mean my grasp of this is any better than the next guy. Last week I dared to question the Jack Stewart Ford cpe. His Polynesian was WAAYY better, and the cpe is one I simply can't feel. I get it, but it missed the proverbial bulls eye for me. I also get that that one in particular should stay as is, if for nothing more than a "lesson" for the future. I'll hit another one too. The "Joyo" 36 Cabriolet. It's fuckin trashed. It's a worn out car that deserves to be restored to what it was. Simple, no real fame (unless I missed the 'discovery'), enough there to blueprint what it was. To leave it tattered and flaked, looking all put up wet, well that's just acting as mule with blinders and a carrot on a stick taped to it's head. The car needs a dedicated restoration. The 2 cars in the topic, I couldn't agree more on the blue one. I look at it and say in mind, "Aww, you poor thing..." because like many we see today it was "Cheaped Out". The red one, another blueprint to the past. A bit sloppy in the fit and finish dept, but not so far gone it couldn't 'represent' in today's vernacular. The blue car should go the way of the "Sylvester" Deuce roadster. Move it to the top of the ladder. The red one, something in between. I'll stop for a bit and see where the topic goes from here. The only way I'll go in the river is with souped up jet boat.
The red car is bad ass. As far as the blue car, this quote did make some sense: But I really have to go with this:
theHIGHLANDER - Just an FYI ... The Jack Stewart of the "POLYNESIAN '50 Oldsmobile Custom" fame is NOT the same Jack Stewart of the "Ayala ~ Barris '41 Ford Custom" fame.
When I read your post this afternoon I felt sick to my stomach. I wanted that car so bad I could taste it and you better believe I wouldnt have changed a thing. The new owner needs his skull thumped.
One of the evils of aging is that your memory trails off into the distance and blurs around the edges like those old coin-op viewers at the scenic overlook. While it's good to have the perspective, the loss of focus is vexing. The style of customs in vogue in the late '50s to early '60s is not so popular now, with their overdone trim features. They don't fit into our newfound philosophy of simple elegance and flowing lines. We do a bit of "editing" on those when we find them, removing the goofy extra headlights and chrome doodads to improve the look, substituting a stock grille for the monstrosity that's on there. Revisionist history. It's not bad, but let's call it by its right name. I think one of the most beautiful customs ever is the Hirohata Mercury. The dedicated builder who brought that car back did a lot of great work to fix a lot of really crummy '50s-era work. That kind of improvement I can live with. As long as I'm busting with opinions, the Maratta's Mystery custom was one of the very worst ever. I don't care how many beautiful customs the man built, that car is an abomination. If it still existed, and it was somehow possible to whomp it back into a '39 Mercury, I'd have to completely recant my position and chug some revisionist Koolaid. Does anybody here remember the great hot rod with whitewalls debate that spilled onto another forum? No? Me neither.
Thanks for that info bud. That's what I get for 'assuming' I suppose. Still, that Olds works. It's just so 'right' in so many ways. I got to see it in person at the Glenmoor a couple years ago.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/album.php?albumid=40821 they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder...
A grouping of grand and eloquent speeches here, and a little dribble thrown in for spice. To each his own self, decide. That's why they make chocolate and vanilla ice cream.
In a bit of a parallel to this topic and the core idea, within the parameters of the "Classic Car Club of America" they mention "meritorious coachwork". By that they mean that an early Buick series that's not recognized within their guidelines could be given Classic Status because it was delivered with a custom body by a coachbuilder of the time. I recall a Town Car on a Century platform that was given Classic Car recognition. So the parallel I mentioned would apply as in "just another hot rod" from back in the day. While our society in general seems to be suffering a pandemic of stupid lately it's not exclusive to the current time. In my youth I recall seeing cars come and go in my dear ol Dad's welding shop. There were some real turds that came and went. Take Mr. Peabody's "Way Back Machine" to the early 60s and you'd find a prior generation that also created cars that clearly were not laudable, nothing to be proud of, surely the next generation was only left with some raw material to do it better. A few years ago here there was some hack of a channeled roaster pulled out of a barn. Built in the early 60s is the ONLY thing worthy of recognizing. Shitty angle iron holding the lights (and uneven at that), some truly heinous stick welds on the front suspension that looked like racoon shit, even the engine showed little to no concern to proper placement. What got me was the admiration and near swooning over that pile, and the vehement declarations of "...that's how it was done...!" and "Please don't change a thing! It's a time capsule!" The only capsule that thing could be was Kaopectate Hack and slash practices have gone on since the 1st days of the automobile, and surely through the birth of hot rods and race cars. Our esteemed member "Harms Way" saved a roadster that was campaigned under the name of "The Blue Racer". The car won a national event and was something that the older sportsman racers still recognized. Restored and taken to every hot rod show in the midwest, to venues where it would be seen literally by 10s of thousands of spectators and participants, perhaps 20 of those folks might remember it by name. Still, it's significant because it won. If it were to be raced again it would lose it creds. Too many updates needed to make it competitive and it simply would not be the same. It deserves some dedicated preservation and restoration. Again, maybe more later. That is if anyone gives a shit
In the Mexican stand-off between history and progress, it's hard to take the side of progress and not be labeled a traditionalist pariah. Truth be told though, the history of history is revision. Auto restoration is a wolf in sheep's clothing in that regard and like most interpretations of history, claims to be the true, factual and real version. Restorations, especially 'show quality' restorations are just another revision. Superior panel fit, flawless paint, perfect chrome and stainless trim that lines up with itself is a historical fantasy in most cases. History is seldom that pretty. If these cars are to be treated as historical documents, then they must be UNCHANGED in all aspects. You planned to rewire it? Revision. Put new bias ply's on it? Revision. Replace the cracked upholstery? Revision. Do these machines exist to be driven and enjoyed or are they documents to be preserved for posterity? I bet I can guess what most of you would say...
I'm the keep it the way it was kinda guy. It's not hard to tell if a car has history simply by looking for the scars of modification. The methods of the work indicates the era of the build. Then half the fun is researching the past. If the car is untouched or you can't find any history leads, then it's a blank canvas. For me, that only goes for drylakes history. And late 40s and early 50s Hotrods and customs pre 1950 cars. Any thing above that or not a 40s build I could care less.
the other problem is the titles we give things now...rust is now patina, projects are now barn finds and, well used/neglected hot rods are now survivors. All titles to make it sound more valuable.
I think many times significant cars are restored way beyond the standards of how they were built, case in point is Burt Munro's Indian (not a car, I know) it is flawless now, it has lost a great deal of its soul, I would have preferred it untouched, but what do I know.
I don't se what this is about? It might be because I'm from another country. I love Hot Rods, of all shapes and kinds. The red is to me a beutiful Classic Hot Rod, clean nice and well build. Good looking. The blue is the one i like the Best. It's so different, refreshing and looks like it's all go and no time for show. And it looks like a car that is only made to look out off, not to look on. But it's old and there is more then one like it, so to me that is traditional. But when I look around, I see some issues with what is okay, and what other call traditional. I don't agree with all, and i don't expect other to agree with me. People likes lovered trucks, with bags or IFS and in primer. But people building a truck, in blue metalic and running lowered stock parts, full fenderd and hood, gets alot of heat, for being un-traditional. But odd, weird and special was around then and now. But to me, if you build era specific, it must be traditional. But as long as there is no clear rule-set for what is okay in here, there will always be fights about what is. But in my book they can't all be 32 coupes, with monster rake or completly slammed and in primer or faux patina. Just my two cents, sorry if it seems like a rant.
I disagree.... #1 Rust is now patina...You can have a new build that's all rusty. Patina is a car that's worn,from it's original state...chrome,paint,interior. #2 Projects are now barn finds...Projects can be any incomplete car,new or old. Barn find is a car that's been hidden away,forgotten,stored,and once again found. Which,I will say,is over used. #3 Well used/neglected hotrods are now survivors...Survivors are cars still in the state they were originally built and not effected by the trends that occured after. 80's style graphics,90's Easter-egg paint,billet,Pro-street,etc. The word survivor itself means something has stood the test of time. Used just means it's not new. Not all survivors are neglected. Some are taken care of and kept in the manner the original builder intended. A Westerguard car,still around from the 40's,the way it was built,would be a survivor. A stock '36,still around,is just an old car. These terms have always been used. Terms to make cars seem worth more are,well documented,matching numbers,fully restored,tribute,updated,untouched,and more I can't remember right now...
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