Another point that gets lost on younger employees [as I see it]....... You may in the process of considering this new job and subsequently asking for a wage increase to stay where you are,offend your current employer and maybe even cost you your current job........ I personally would be very likely to just tell a guy in this situation to get going and the sooner the better.....
We're the body shop guys the ones responsible for the poor work on the 35? Or did it come in that way? Cleaning up the work of other employees gets old quick. Scratched on a cave wall with a burnt stick
That is a given,, I was offered a job with a small distribution company and a paint manufacturing company almost 40 years ago and I was involved in our family business and our twin girls had just been born. Both of these business were out of state and they both offered a pretty substantial salary,,I turned them both down due to family obligations and the age of my children. Did I do the right thing? I realize now that if I had taken the job with the paint company I would have been left holding the bag,,they folded about 5 years later and all the the paint reps lost there jobs. yes, I did the right thing. On the other hand the small distribution company with 4 employees became a major player in the sundries business and was purchased by a huge conglomerate almost 20 years later,,the man that had offered me the job shared equally with his employees (12) at the time of the sale and they each received a severance package to the tune of 2.2 million. The previous owner now resides in Hawaii. Ooops,I guess I missed the boat on this one. None of us know what the future will bring,,I stayed right here in Anderson and raised my children here,,I don't have any regrets. HRP
"None of us know what the future will bring,,I stayed right here in Anderson and raised my children here,,I don't have any regrets. HRP" some things are more important than money!
I wouldnt say im "using it" as ammo for more money. But why cant this go my way? I have worked my ASS of for my current employer and PUMPED out quality work for almost 5 years now with 1 raise and that was 2 years ago. I feel that I am worth it to him to make a move. I'm not saying I'm god but I feel like I have been being used a little and its time I take care of me.
The other thing you have to consider is that they came to my door step and asked me to work for them. I didn't even know it was really going to happen. It was all here say and rumor. I didn't go lookin for ammo for more money, it ran into me. Thanks to everyone again for your imput. It means a lot and I appreciate it
____-----$$$$$----? Long term benefits? How nice of shop? What kind of fellow employees? Lunch break, how long and is the boss buying? Raise annual or when ever? Uniform? You pay to were a monkey suit and free advertising while your 1st name is sewn to the front like a million other monkeys (I fought and won that battle more than once)? Is this boss man cool, level headed, sober straight up dude? What is the forecast in your area for this kind of work? Any side jobs given to take home so you can score some serious $ once in while? Like a man who can truly share the wealth once in a while.
You are unclear as to your offiicial position with the "new" company. Do they expect you to do the machining work that you did for them with your "present" position? Do they have the equipment to do those jobs? they may think you are superman and dump numerous "projects" on you and expect you to change hats consently. This will wear you out fast.....Talk to your present employer about the future, and possibly running that shop for him, don't hold the sword over his head until you get a straight answer from him. If he hems and haws, then lay it on him and maybe he will have a comeback. GOOD LUCK
Any employer who is offended by an employee who has been approached by another company, offered a job for more money and wants to know if it is possible to earn more at his current place of employment is a employer that I wouldn't want to work for anyways. It would be a different story if you are running around trying to get job offers to raise your value but that is not the case. Someone else has decided what you are worth to them you either are or are not worth that to your current employer. For an employer to be offended and let someone go over that is just childish. It's pretty simple they can either say you are worth that to us and they either can or cannot afford it or you are not worth that to us so you can work for what we pay you or move on.
If your current employer does give you more money to stay I bet you wont see another raise for a very long time. If he can afford to give you more now that you might be leaving. Why couldn't he afford it before....... just another little bit of input - Fat Chico
From what I read of your imput, it's time to leave and take on the new job, Tell your old boss, if you have some jobs that he needs you to do,you would be happy to come in after hours of your new job and help him . That way you don't burn the bridges in case you don't like your new job ! try to leave on good terms ! I hired some of my employees back when they thought the grass was greener on the other side of the fence ! Just my 2 cents worth of being a boss with employees for 30 years ! Good Luck !!!
I was in the personnel field for 30+ years with several good companies. I spent the last 12 years before retiring doing executive search. What I saw was when an individual went to his/her current employer with a request to increase their compensation to match an offer they had received from another company if it was done they were let go in a year or so. The current employer felt "held up" and matched the offer until they felt they could do without the employee. Make up your mind to go or stay. Don't try to hold up your current employer. It may not end well for you.
Sounds like you are kind of bitter about your present employer. Maybe it's time to move on. I have been in the work force longer than you have been alive and it's been a long while since I have seen annual raises. Will you get them at the rod shop? Just because people have money doesn't mean they are in the habit of handing it out.
My advice would be to start your own thing. Sounds like you are awesome at what you do now. As long as there is business, you will always make the most amount of money buy working for yourself.
That sounds like employment and not a career. The worst people to work for are rich men who operate something as a hobby. My advice is to stay away. Street Rod shops are all about jack of all trades labor. You are a machinist. You should be proud. Your world revolves around thousands not 1/4" boxing plates that are an 1/8" off. Stay in your field and you will wind up with your own machine shop someday and a respectable reputation.
Parkinson's and Cancer is bad news. How old is the owner and what is his state of health and prognosis? If he drops dead tomorrow, will your "new boss" be his Wife, kids? Or will the shop just be closed down for probate? (if you want to stay in town forever)Try to buy the shop if you can with a down and monthly payments. Then the place is yours including doing work for the otther shop. Buy the shop or take the other job for better job security. Sounds like staying where you are under the conditions should be your 3rd choice.
I don't mean disrespect, but seriously 5 years in the grand scheme of careers is a short stint man, we all tend to rationalize how we are valuable in our craft, but really one should be realistic. I have been in this game for 38 years now[fulltime] and about 48 years adding in the part time portion of my work history. That and the other advice offered here should indicate that it is not always as we want it in our job searches. You seem like a sharp guy, I am sure you will see the right path and take it, Good luck on this venture.....
I didn't read all the replies, but suppose you try working for them a couple hrs maybe 2 nights a week. Get to know how they operate, what they think of their staff, how serious are they. Doing it all for a living? I'll tell you 1st hand, it's NOT for everyone. I'm as all in as they come, don't fish, hunt, bowl, golf, nothing but car stuff in restoration and hot rods for most of my 40yrs in the game. There's times I could care less if I ever even see another vintage car or hot rod. It doesn't last long, but I'm sure 1 day it's going to be 'forever'. My shit sits because I'm so busy for clients that I have no time for mine, then when I do I simply can't stomach another day in the shop. Make sense? If you can handle the internal and personal roller coaster you're sure to get on, go for it. Staying in one portion of the craft and keeping the rest of the trade for yourself has intangible advantages. Just sayin...
Well,you nor I may not want to work for a guy like that , but in reality he as an employer does not have to like that approach and can and often would not be very happy to hear ypu are not happy.....he aslo could just let you go and that is a consideration....I had an employee many years ago,who said he was just there for the paycheck anyway,at the end of the day I fired him...cause I could.....
this is a situation where you do a 'spread-sheet' of pros and cons of your present job and a spread-sheet of the 'future-job'. i do not recall a mention of your age...........consider your goals and aspirations, accepting the future job will allow you to 'polish your apple'/ gain skills [you describe yourself as a machinist] your present employer's health issues, not to mention the new job is not the owners primary business [people in the oil well/petroleum-related-business are well positioned, in our economy], you may have been given an open door to promising future. ALL THE BEST! just my two pesos------------- red
This is spot on! Weigh the pros and cons of both. While this looks like a great opportunity, the grass isn't always greener on the other side.
I appreciate the comments guys. I guess there really is no easy solution. As far as my bosses condition, its not very good. He is in terrible health and as I see it, is running on pain meds and cancer treatments. Its terrible. And I feel bad about even saying anything to him. Thats why this is so tough. Consider this. My co worker makes 5 dollars an hour more than I do. He is not a machinist and has nothing to do with that side of the shop. I am a machinist, welder and fabricator and cross over all day every day. From alum, to stainless to anything welded, machined, repaired, painted, anything. Dont get me wrong he is a great hand, but (and again, not tootin my own horn) my versitility list is way longer than his. And he makes more money, by a lot. So there are all kinds of angles to look at here. I am still undecided. Does this change anything?
A lot of good info and differing opinions here. Feel free to disregard anything I have to say below: I've been in the automotive engineering and design business for 17 years. I've worked for a lot of different companies and gained a lot of experience working on nearly every different part of a vehicle. I know guys guy who've stayed at the same job for a long time and may be experts in one area, but they don't have a good grasp of how an entire vehicle works together. You're young. You should roll the dice and take the new job. Trust that you have the skills and knowledge to make the best of it. And when you make the switch, don't second guess yourself. You'll have a chance to expand your skill set. When you get there, don't just follow the job description that the previous guy had. Forge a new one. Be a leader and team player that people want to work for and work with. Provide positive feedback and constructive criticism, and avoid the drama. You've mentioned that another guy gets $5 more per hour, for doing less and/or knowing less. Don't sell yourself short. Are you getting paid what you are worth? Would getting $5 more an hour be enough, or are you worth $10 more an hour? Some guys never put much effort into a good resume. It's in your best interested for the future to make sure your resume is put together well and highlights all the stuff you eventually forget about.
If the shop owner is in poor health, have you approached him to discuss the potential to take over the shop for him? Perhaps that will lead to an ownership stake in the shop? Think big picture....
That is awesome advice DrDetroit. If I could get to match pay with him, I would be thrilled. I think I should at least try that first. I kind of feel like I have nothing to lose ya know? If he freaks, I move on.
This has been pondered a lot. Myself and a co worker are both thinking about this approach. From the outside looking in, I dont think he wants to give it up. Mostly due to his personal involvement in the place with his own personal projects and such. He is there every day doing something (mostly making a mess for us to clean up) and is still buying equiptment like crazy for the shop if we need it or not. Im just going to have a talk with him and see what happens. How should I approach him? I really have not had to have such a loaded conversation with someone this way before. Thanks a lot again guys. Hack
If you can survive it ,family needs, insurance long hours & everything else that goes with being your own boss go for it. Nothing ventured nothing gained. For stay a one person owner no partners. My .02
First, I'd ask him for a meeting over lunch or a coffee "to sit and chat about the business". Get him out of the shop and into a place where you'll have his undivided attention, and in a comfortable setting. I'd then flat out ask him what his future plans are/what his "exit strategy" is......the questions would go something like this: "do you plan to work til you die and let all that you've worked for die with you? Or, do you want to consider taking a lesser role while we put money into your pocket and buy the business.....either whole, or in part.....and allow me to run the place while you tend to your health issues?". Something like this should work to clarify where you stand, in his eyes and his future. That should allow you to make the decision to stay or bolt pretty easily.
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