A friend of mine posted these pics on Facebook complaining about the quality of Comp Cams and Chinese parts. I think there's something else going on. He's got a Fairlane that he swapped in a 302. I don't know what he got the 302 out of but he had it completely rebuilt before the install. He claims to be getting about 200 miles out of a cam/lifter combo. This is his third one in 6 months. Comp Cams told him to use high zinc break in oil on the second one. He did but had the same results. The one on the left is the first one, the one on the right is the second and the one in the back is the one he's waiting to put in This picture sucks. He says the fifth lobe from the top on the first one is worn off, the third from the top on the middle one looks to be broken and the cam on the right is his latest replacement. Can you guys help figure out what's going on?
Depends on a lot of things--- 1.How the cam was broken in 2.Spring pressure 3.Type of oil 4.Oil pressure 5.METAL in the oil galleys from the rebuild
I told him to run the oil pump with a drill and make sure all of the lifters are getting oil. I also mentioned to check with the manufacturer to be sure he has the right tension on the springs to be sure he's not floating valves or putting more pressure on it than it can handle. He's using the lifters that the manufacturer recommends. Is there something I'm missing?
It's happening before it should even be broken in. You think he's being to rough on it when he should be babying it for the first 1500 miles? He says that there's no wear on the bearings but that doesn't mean that the metal shavings just didn't go that way. Hmmm.
there's a lot of stuff to check on cam / springs installs - cam bearing orientation, coil bind, seat pressure, pushrod length, retainer clearance, rocker geometry, etc. I think it's time well spent checking these things out even on the simplest installations. Filling a new rebuild full of ground up cast iron particles after a cam / lifter failure is just not worth the time spent to get it right the first time.
At first glance I thought his cam was pretty mild. .480 lift isn't that much more than my BB had stock. Then I looked it up and it's a hundred thou over stock in his 302. So he should be checking all of his clearances but when I called him up, he said it was back together and running again so he didn't need help. He fixed it by using a no-name cam and lifters. I guess I'll try to talk some sense into him again in 200 miles. Thank you guys for your help. If nothing else you made me a little smarter.
My comments here are about a Chev engine.A fellow I knew rebuilt a 327 that was already in a car he bought.Decided to run a hydrolic cam instead of the solid cam that was in it.Step one,,damaged the cam,step two,,,damaged the new one.Step three,,get help.It turned out the 327 block was designed for solid cam only,therefore not enough oil.Do you think Ford might have done this also?
Should be able to check some of the key clearances after pulling off a rocker cover. Coil bind, maybe retainer to seal.
Never heard of this as the oil has to go through the solid lifter and go through the pushrod to lube the rocker arm. Chevrolet isn't one to make different blocks. Seems to me all the talk of proper break in of cam and lifters is just an excuse used by manufacturers to cover up poor quality control in their products. We built engines and broke in the cam by running it at 7,000 rpm in a dirt track race and never had a lobe or lifter wear problem. In my years of working on cars and trucks, the only cam and lifter problems I saw were on vehicles with lots of miles that hadn't had oil changed regularly. Even in the GM 307 and 327 engines with the cams that had a lobe that wasn't properly hardened, it took about 50,000 miles to show up. If the camshaft and lifters are made out of properly matched materials and properly hardened and assembled with the proper lube, there shouldn't be any break in necessary. The failures are most likely caused by faulty heat treating processes. We used Comp cam kits and they came with a moly installation lube. We ran Valvoline racing oil. That was in the 70s and 80s.
While .480 lift would be mild for a BB, it is a pretty decent lift for a SB. It is not radical by any stretch, but certainly is over stock by a good bit. With that said, the spring pressures and coil bind come to mind when I see those lifters, also he might want to check the lifter bores. Also, if he is not following the break in procedure properly, that could cause a wiped lobe. The cam is completely broken in after the 20 minute break in procedure, taking it easy on the engine for the first 1500 miles is more about making sure the rings are seated. I am thinking he might need to hone the lifter bores, especially after seeing 2 lifters that have obviously been hot. I would also have to agree that cam bearing orientation needs to be checked, he has an oil passage blocked somewhere.
If he is just swapping the dead cams, he needs to take a step back before moving to the next one! look at those lifters. There is probably a pint of loose steel in that engine after three rounds of this! Engine needs a teardown and complete checkout before anything proceeds, THEN start over on the cam with someone knowledgeable advising. I have no idea whether CC is at fault in this mess, but in this case I would start over elsewhere. Also think about pan/oil level/capacity. Cams depend on oil thrown around freely...
Well, he didn't even get 200 miles out of the new cam and lifters. He drove it to a show 60 miles away and had to tow it home. He has a mechanic friend that helps him work on this engine so this is pretty ridiculous. I've never had a problem like this on any cam I've ever installed so I want help him through this so I can get smart rather than relying on luck in the future. Here's my list of things you guys have said and I've done my homework on all of it. If anyone sees anything I'm missing please chime in. 1) The oil. The engine needs to be torn down and and all of the oil passages need to be cleaned. All of the crap that came off those cams needs to be removed from the engine. Check the bearings and make sure that they are oriented properly. Check the oil capacity to be sure that the pan is not being emptied while its waiting for oil to drain back from the top of the engine. Check to be sure that plenty of oil is making it through the lifters and push rods to the top of the engine. Check the type of oil and oil pressure. Use assembly lube. 2) The lifter bores need to be checked for damage and honed. 3) Tolerances. Check the clearance from retainer to seal. Check for coil bind. Check the pushrod length. Make sure that the rocker arm geometry is not putting anything in a bind on lift. 4) Check to be sure the spring/seat pressures are right for the cam, lifters, rocker arms and valves. 5) Either find someone knowledgable to advise or become that person. I prefer experience to books myself so I'd be looking for a grey-beard. A couple more questions: if something was binding up like the retainer hits the seal or the spring becomes fully compressed, would you be able to tell by turning the engine by hand? And if that is happening, shouldn't it be damaging more than just the lifters and cam? Wouldn't you expect to see damaged rocker arms, seals and push rods too?
Looks like more than too much spring pressure. I would check to make sure the retainers aren't hitting the valve guides at full lift. Looks like something is bottoming out somewhere.
If your friend has time to post on FB then he's got time to post here. A lot of good info posted, but he should have sent the pix to Comp Cams instead of FB.
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