Tunnel Ram Idea: 2 barrel Holley Gurus?!

You guys sure look like your havin' a bunch of fun on that one. I just posted a thread a month back or so that questioned if there was anything new under the sun in the world of traditional Hot Rodding. Gotta hand it to you guys and pass my vote along for that build and the damn header pipe alone. Keep on keepin' on guys! I gotta get down and fab and take some pics this weekend . Got few days off next week as well, finally, so I will be at it.

 

I've thought about doing two 2bbls on a tunnel ram before too. Why not? I raced circle track for years with a 500cfm Holley and it did just fine. Most guys I raced against were running well over 400ci, some up to 440ci.

On a side note, C&S makes a 890cfm, YES 890!, 2-bbl with 2" throttle blades that is bad to the bone. It's basically a all-or-nothing deal but it's a ANIMAL when WOT. dAMBEST also makes a killer billet 2-bbl that's rated up to 800hp, but that's probably getting too un-HAMB'ish.

 

Thanx for all the helpful comments gang. The cfm info. was prob most important. The one carb I have has a 102 stamped on the base; so I guess from what has been defined on here, the first of my two carbs is the smallest of the bunch from AL or MC.

So, now I am really going to open up the doors for a Rocky Balboa beating in the 11th!

Do you guys think I should consider going larger in CFM on the second carb - since I have to buy it anyway? I was thinking that the one I intend to place toward the rear of the TR will cover the last 4 cylinders most (as a QJ) and in theory might work similar with larger CFM/fuel mix (same external model). My logic is as follows: if a stock QJ 4 barrel, with manual secondaries (twice as large as the primaries), dumps more air and fuel when manually called for to the back 4 cylinders, wouldn't my second carb be better off being larger in air and fuel flow - kind of like a larger secondary set of butterflies? Progressive linkage? Build a set up that won't crack the rear fully until 3-3500? Just thinking out load, again; so if you intend to stomp me, please also lend some ideas with the hardy-har-hars.

 

Dude......I'm dyin' here.

 

BOOM, that Falcon is bad to the bone! I see that you have done your pinion in some pics. I don't mean to lead this post astray, but I picked up a set of 411s (pin and ring) and a mini spool. Gonna goof with that before the winter is out. I purchased the gaskets and the crush washer. What issues did you run into that I should look out for? I picked up a dial indicator but have no stand for it, so I will fab something when teh time comes. A friend told me 10-13 thous, is this on the money? I have heard all the guff about the min-spools and I had a car years ago for a short while that had one. I will deal with it. A 14 year old girl with pigtails won't be driving the car anyway; so I know it will be a handful, but that's part of it all anyways, right? Please fill me in on any Doos and Don'ts you learned or knew already before pulling your pumpkin and jumping in. By the way, what gears did you put in?

 

Aw dude, I dunno'- what kinda' rear is it?

Domestic-wise, I only ever done 8 n' 9 inch Fords. Done lot'sa Volvos and even ring n' pinion gears in SAAB 5 speed transaxles (seriuosly) an' several many 3 n' 5 series BMW's an even a Mercedes Benz or two way back in the day but I don't think I ever done anythin' with a GM rear, 'sides R&Rin' the axles for one reason or 'nother an that was prolly for some bartender gal that I might'a been fooolin' 'round with at the time.

Dude, PM me 'fore this turns inta' a "What makes a Gasser A Gasser?" thread.

 

Gotta go check the drama out at the gasser post now! BTW, I am running a 9 inch Ford from a 65 Tbird. Large housing , 31 spline, non-posi with 300 gears that just gotta go.

 

Hey, Pork;

The two-2bbl on a tr isn't a bad idea, but I'd suggest a slightly different approach. As mentioned, I'd try for the larger 2bbls, but can always be changed out later when you find them at your buddies' yard. Do keep them the same size. & don't go progressive, unless you decide on three of them.

Anyways, back in ~ '68/'69 era (possibly before), a friend was playing around w/this concept & succeeded very well, although using Studebaker v8s. 259 cid mostly, & 289cid also - for the street, but also for hi-po "fun". DD used two 2bbls from a normal stude v8. He was after a good hi-po manifold w/good fuel distribution. There wasn't a lot of manifolds available for the stude then, (Stu-V was one of the better ones, just not many made), less now. For a n/a stude v8, 2-2s, or one small afb is about right. For a small cid engine, two 2's aren't a bad choice. Same deal for larger mills that aren't turning hi rpms. I mention studes, 'cause I'm familiar w/them, but a 350 chev isn't that much bigger, & the carbs you're looking at using, are proportionally larger for the larger engines. So the idea is the same. No point in over-carbing. (Ex: I've got a IH 392, that has a Holley 850 dbl-pumper on it, apparently from the factory - or at least from the orig owner. What a mess - it can't use half that, as it only turns ~ 3900 rpm. Does suck fuel at a prodigious rate though. . No, I'm not driving it anymore.).

When he made his "street-ram" he used fairly short runners, ~ 7-8" (it was what worked when following the port-angle-till-runners-meet-point), & for the plenum bottom, a flat plate. To get various amounts of plenum volume, he used wood spacers (only for temp testing & for quick 'n' easy changes). What he found, was that he could change where the ram would 'hit', by changing the volume. He got it to hit as low as 1500 rpm, & as high as 7000 rpm (kinda maxed out on a decent stude v8 at that level). The useful range of the hit was also ~ 1500 rpm. The plenum volume for the lower range, (ideal street usage), was almost non-existant , little more than a thin/flat equalizing passage 'twixt the two carbs, (which btw, were spaced directly over each grouping of four runners), & the throttle response was sharp & quick. IIRC, fuel economy also went up. (Although few on here seem to be interested in that aspect. Sorry - I digress.) For the hi rpm end, it was a rather big box, & throttle response was soggy until it hit. Done to prove the point that plenum volume is a valid tuning tool. Cold & hot starting, in FL (ya, ya, I know), was good, fuel distribution was also very good. DD wrote about it in a club mag, then published a small how-to booklet in ~ '70, after the experiments were done.

Shortly after this, Edelbrock came out w/their version of the small-plenum tr. Interesting co-incidence. .

I would try to minimize the plenum volume, w/some sort of filler, as much as I could (or a different top plate - which would mean modifying the tr). Should be worth your time.

FWIW.

Marcus...

 

ive had my A since 65...i enjoyed trying different things intake wise...had intake that i used wooden runners to extend the wieand tunnel ram made it work with both holley 3 barrels one at a time this was looking for better performance[recently Dashman here on hamb made me some spacers out of alum/phelonic spacers...used same carbs...homemade intake is from auction site add......

 

"What he found, was that he could change where the ram would 'hit', by changing the volume. He got it to hit as low as 1500 rpm, & as high as 7000 rpm (kinda maxed out on a decent stude v8 at that level). The useful range of the hit was also ~ 1500 rpm. The plenum volume for the lower range, (ideal street usage), was almost non-existant , little more than a thin/flat equalizing passage 'twixt the two carbs, (which btw, were spaced directly over each grouping of four runners), & the throttle response was sharp & quick. IIRC, fuel economy also went up."

Thanx this is very helpful. Wood spacers. I was thinking the same thing for test run instead of steel, as I could run 5 shots up and down the street stomping it and checking idle and vacuum(spell?). I could adjust in between and then do the final in Alum chunk, or steel fab.

Got sicker than a dog todays guys. Never had the "Chills" in 43 years and got them this afternoon. Regardless of how hot I got this house running I am freezing. Sux. Hope I don't have that damn flu cause I have my 6 month old newborn son. Will be out of commits for a while. Keep on trucking all !

 

Well Porkpie464, you have outdone yourself this time. I bow down in your presence.
This thread with 102 posts sure beats your other stuff... i.e...
"Duel brake master cylinders are a guvment conspiresy!!"
or my favorite..." Would it be a good idea to run drum brakes up front and discs in the rear of my rod?"
LOL... you do amuse me. Its a pity that some folks in here think you are serious...LOL.

 

WOWSERS
Now those are some pretty artistic headers. How did that hemi run with that height? You need to blow that image up and hang it in teh shop for sure!

 

“LOL... you do amuse me. Its a pity that folks in here think you are serious...LOL.
<O> </O>
Yeah, D, may actually seem that way; but although I am often full of satire, all my posts are authentic in purpose. My front drum rear brake disk post was in earnest. No Joke. Fact was, at the time, I had the set up and wanted to save money. I found a rear set of plates and drums from a F150 for nothing so away went the idea; however, I don't retract the post? Why should I? If we don't think, question, and challenge, why are we in this hobby?

I could have gone and charged a 4&#8221; dropped, tube, I beam, disk set up axle from Speedway for 1400, when all was said and done, but I was broke &#8211; sadly, I still am. Regardless of poor finances, I am not ashamed of any questions or of any laughter. What does such mean to me? For those earnest enough to step above the hub-bub and be lumped as a short bus passenger with me, I have been fortunate in every post to get the answers I need.

What is the true meaning or idea behind our hobby? Seriously? Do we look at all that has been or is being done currently to copy such blindly to ensure to fit in? Are we to purchase all the parts in mainstream use because it is the way we can each be different? I can&#8217;t help but think of Kurt Vonnegut&#8217;s line, &#8220;Man spends his life trying not to be embarrassed;&#8221; but what if a person is looking to get something done, something put together, in a different but mostly like way?
<O</O

There are millions of beige and gray sedans all about this country. I see them every morning on my way to work. The "I am you, you are me, and we are all the same and therefore &#8216;safe&#8217;" cars, which, to be honest, as I age, really scare the living hell out of me.

Look here, I don't have 32 rails. I don't have a chrome windshield frame; I don&#8217;t have a 32 shell; I don&#8217;t have a Nail Head or a Hemi; I don't have a quick change, three-piece rear axle; I don't have a Super Bell, dropped I beam; I don't have fighter riveted aluminum seats; I don't intend to shoot my car semi-gloss black with red rims and dog dish caps on retro stamped steelies; I don't expect to have German crosses or skulls for gussets on the innards of each frame corner; I don&#8217;t expect that my car will do any better than low 14s when I finally smile and take her down the track at the Englishtown Old Time Drags, wearing the crazy pair of bug eyed old goggles I found at a Flea-Market. All the above noted things (minus the bad ones) are important to this hobby, and I, in many cases would buy them if I could and hold nothing against each.

When I fail, and the good Lord and I know how often I do, I never do so at the expense of someone's safety or humility (only my own for both charges); but like I stated so often: no one pays my taxes, my college loans, or my son's baby food expense (except his grandma); so I will think aloud and debate all the dumb and decent ideas that kick around as long as I can; whether people feel stupid or okay about such, is irrelevant. That is, of course, so long as the moderators aren&#8217;t offended. I do believe, however, that my sentence composition and lack of violent adjectives and other un-family-like derogatory keep those barriers at bay.

If a few people get a chuckle from time to time from my posts, and these same people believe that I am a jokester, good to all of them. But I will close with a simple idea; that we all, myself included, get a little too serious about things in life at times. When the day is done, stop and think about it all; none of this matters in the least. I really mean it. When you really think about it, go call a person you haven&#8217;t been in touch with for a while, because the energy wasted in any argument reaps no reward. Sorry for this long diatribe. I am sicker than a dog. I understand if this one gets flagged. But remember, wherever boredom and warm air conversations are turning pale, the Pork will arrive and stir up the mix!

 

Well i guess if we were all the same we whould all be married to the same gal.
PM me if you have trouble finding your 2 brl carbs I beleave I have 1 of the big ones

 

Thank you SaltFlats. I'ii get in touch with you if need be.

 

Just read through the thread. Disappointed by so many comments about not doing something that doesn't perform as well in exchange for looks. What? There is no straight axle, buggy sprung bias ply flathead rod out there that can't be " out handled" by a cheap rice rocket that gets a million miles to the gallon to boot. EVERYTHING we do is about the look. And that is mostly to try to stand out from the crowd. You can easily build several hundred hp from a single 4 barrel small block, but they look boring. That's why we prefer to run a tri power nailhead or flatty. Usually way more money and half the power!
If you can get yours to look cool as well as different, and you can live with the performance, do it. No matter what we do, there are restorers that hate it, and treehuggers that hate us, and the majority that just don't get it. Have fun.

 

PKap. Right on Brother. Man! There really isn't any sound like a flattie! Gotta close friend who lives in Lake Hopatcong, and he has been building Flatties for the last 50 years. He has tons of so many truly museum worthy cool older parts. I am always amazed when I go there to see just how small those little B engines are. We get to talking/debating about small block, big block, and he won't listen. He just waves his hand and says- "Boat Ankers'! Junk! If it aint a Ford Flathead - it aint shit!" Now that is one sharp and crabby old timer that's got it down.

 

Holley did make 350 &500 cfm two barrels at one time that had secondary's with a progressive linkage.

I ran one on a built 2.3 Ford in a Model A roadster

Two of these would run on two primary barrels,then cut in the secondary's like a 4 barrel....may work

Model # was 2305,but it would be difficult to find these and be just as expensive (or more) than to find two 500 cfm 4 barrel Holleys and rebuild them

 

Oh, go ahead, run your two-two barrels on a tunnel ram. And take it to cruise night. I would love to see it. People like you should not be allowed around wrenches.

 

????????????????

Wtf

 

No, he's serious. "They walk among us"

 

I think I have actually seen that movie.

 

Just from your avatar: a red... Oh, I forgot the damn year; they are so rare. In fact, I don&#8217;t believe I have ever seen another like it. Which year is that one again?
Oh, no, then I got broadsided with the "Just wait til' you take it to cruise night!" comment. These things tell me all I need to know about your creativity, originality, and mechanical prowess.

A red Chevy with polished mags! Yippie! Please tell me it&#8217;s not an automatic with a small block and glass packs? Do you have dice hanging from the mirror? I know you have those polished valve caps for your tire stems! Are they aluminum with crossed Chevy racing flags? Do you have the 30 dollar cooler and the full fold out beach chair? Do you have a Hawaiian Shirt?

 

He is a crackster - just look at that there avatar! Now that's funny. I mean... flat out funny.

Damn, I am gonna stop caring if this is the best to be had? I know the old H has better than these clowns.

Got the first carb today. Feelin better. I know I sound like a broken record, but... this weekend...

 

i actually thought of doing a smaller carb 2x4 set up too. if it was an engine which was just going to be for more of the good looks aspect, a couple of 390 holley's could maybe do the trick. i never tried it, but thought it could probably work. i don't know much about tunnel rams, but i know i've seen guys use two 390's. though i don't know how well they worked!

 

WOW..... Just wow....
I really feel bad for the OP. Not only are there very few useful replies, but your question seems to have brought out the BEST of the rest of the HAMB.

This thread shows why a lot of folks, me for one, don't post very often.
Usually the same few folks too.... go figure.

So.... I have a tunnel Ram on the shelf and have often pondered the same question.
So.... if you can survive the AlphaFabricatorPro I know better than you onslaught...... I'd love to know how it works out.....

Howard

 

Hay beaner what cable channel was that on and did it have anything to do with a train?

 

That Hemi ran pretty damn good - there was a problem with those headers over scavenging at about 3000 rpm and they couldn't richen it up enough to cover the hole, but if you drove around that it ran like a cut cat.

 

".but if you drove around that it ran like a cut cat... !!!!!!! This is why I love this site. Man, I missed the best of stuff by 20 or 30 years! I wish I could have been around when guys were doing stuff like this. Racing must have been so damn nerve racking and flat out insane fun.

 

The plot thickens! Just got a hold of 2 of the below (governed Holley small bore 4 barrels) for 60 bucks total. These are what I am using! Hands down! I don't know how just yet; but these sick looking things have to go on my car.
Now , I know I am gonna get a bunch more flack for these carbs, but , damn I couldn't pass them up, they are real small 4 barrels and both are for a 57 International. Don't know much, but if you know, please comment and help the Pork.