setting sbf into my sedan...help on location

i am working on getting my motor setup so i can start on motor mounts and trans mounts. its going to be a 289/AOD. i have a water pump off a 67 289 on mockup block. what i wasnt sure on was if i set it where i have it now would the mechanical fan cool being that low on the radiator. or i wasnt sure if i would be better off to lower the motor and run electric fan. i figure either way i am going to have to cut some of it back out and make a tunnel down the car. here are a few pics of the setup i have now. i looked though a couple threads but couldnt really tell location of the fan on the radiator.











any suggestions??

 

I am still in mock up myself. I will be running a snow white water and an electric fan. I also stretched my frame 3". This dosn't answer your question but, its what I am doing w/my SBF.

 

i dont really want to add anything to the frame so i can just run the stock hood. and might might not run fenders

 

The electric fan on the front of the radiator should work the best. Put a manual fanswitch on it to get a head start on cooling when pulling a grade. This allows you to go without a fan on the engine which gives more room, a cleaner look and an extra 12-15 horses. Good luck. Send more pics

 

Maybe the photos, but your engine looks too level......

 

I thought/figured you would want to have the motor as level as the car was.

 

and i also am planning on running the 28-29 radaitor shell so if i was thinking there wasnt any room or it would look goofy out in front without anything to cover the fan.

 

Digging your AOD mock up trans and sbf block. I'm doing this swap in my 64 right now and that would have made things MUCH easier!

 

alot of intakes have a few degrees built into the carb bases so you might want to set the intake on if you have one. other than that it looks fine to me..

 

thanks tommy and yeah i thought there we a little pricey at first and not overly impressed with the quality of the inserts (already had two pull out of the back of the tranny when trying to take bolts out) but i have to say i think if ya had to put money into a swear jar they save ya money in the long run..bare block and tranny is about 35lbs. ill post some pics of the motor where i have it now which is a lot lower in the frame tomorrow which i think is where it is going to end up...but have to also look at where the stearing box is going also before i start on the mounts...

 

My 29 RPU, I used the Ford Racing Short "Street Rod" water pump. I then used a Flex A Lite Elctric fan. With a healthy 347 it ran plenty cool this way.


My Tudor, I ran the standard 302 water pump and mechanicl fan, also no cooling issues

 

don..... on your tudor how far up the radiator does the fan run. if i set mine that low it seems like there is a lot of the radiator that is not covered by the fan. here is where i put it down to tonight. wish i had more time to work on it but was worked on getting old tires off some 16" wires for the rpu. but here is where its at i think if i tilt it a little it will help with the floor and just run an electric fan.







thoughts suggestions??

 

Mine in the Tudor was probably a good 4" higher than yours. I sold the car a few years back so I can't go measure it. Looking at where your motor mount pads on the block are, I know mine was higher. Basically, if you take a stock early mustang motor mount and bolt it to the block, the holes for the cross bolt (that bolts the mount to the frame mounts) will be about even with the top of the frame rail. This has always been a good height that I have used to keep the oil pan and fan from being too low.

 

I just did this for the first time a few months ago on my tudor with a bbc. And it was be pretty damn tricky. Here's what I would do, Put an intake on that block and set the carburetor plane level. That will determine the angle of your motor and trans. If you like foot room (as I do). Keep that motor as low as possible to reduce a giant tranny hump and further firewall mods. It will also keep your center of gravity in a better spot for handling. Just keep in mind Oil pan clearance and header clearance. On my car, the headers determined the height of my motor.

 

I set my engine so if there was a tire failure, the oil pan wasn't lower than the front axle. Mine is higher than yours' but not where it needed to be for proper cooling. I eventually put a Cooling Components fan and shroud on because it appeared to be the best available. I also used the Explorer 5.0 water pump setup which is the shortest available. You have several choices, trying to save a dollar at this point will cause lots of grief down the road.

 

this the same thing im getting ready to do. 5.0 w AoD. model A frame. let me know what not to do .

 

I don't know if this picture will help you or not, but it is the best I have. It will show where the motor and trans mounts ended up on the sbf in on the model a frame under my 27. With it in this position and using a short Ford Racing water pump assembly, it just clears my radiator with electric fan behind it. You will probably end up like me, with part of your motor going through the firewall a little.

Don

 

X2, never seen it in print but suspect the factory does it possibly to aid in oil drainage or more likely to prevent air pockets in the back of the heads opposite the thermostat.

 

With a Tripower set up on my sbc 350 the intake is made so that the carbs sit level with a 3 degree tilt to the motor.
So my transmission tail shaft is 3 degrees down and the pinion on the rear end is 3 degrees up.
I second the cooling components electric fan, that what I have and it moves alot of air, but it also draws alot current.

 

Is that a sbf 289-302?
From the looks of the valve covers---looks like a 351 Cleveland(?)
I'll go out & take a pix of my 260 Shelby Cobra in my '32 showing my electric fan with auto set control to come on at 190 degrees.
If you are a DRIVER, I would shy away from any SHORTENED water pump assys. Once stranded because of a water pump failure, any stock unit from junk yard or parts house will be gratefully welcome & then on your way---Instead of waiting for a special UPS or Fed Ex delivery days(?) later!!-----Don

 

Don's idea is doable.

If you want to cool the engine with a mechanical fan you need to set the engine highenough to get the can inside a fan shroud.

Or else you will need to build a drop in your fan shoud to get it around the fan. The former would be easier.

 

If you are just going to putt around the streets with the car, engine height isn't much of a concern but if you plan on doing some serious cornering, you want to mount the engine high as practical in the chassis.

 

Shouldn't that be the other way around?

 

Hope these pix will help!---The long tube is for expansion & return siphon.
Using a stock water pump, the button on nose of pulley is a fingers width from radiator.----Don

 

Nope.

 

Make sure you get the hoses to fit before you finalise the height. This caused me problems later on

 

my friends car only shot I got but you can tell engine position to firewall and cowl area.

 

WHAT

The center of mass height, relative to the track, determines load transfer, (related to, but not exactly weight transfer), from side to side and causes body lean. When tires of a vehicle provide a centripetal force to pull it around a turn, the momentum of the vehicle actuates load transfer in a direction going from the vehicle's current position to a point on a path tangent to the vehicle's path. This load transfer presents itself in the form of body lean.
Height of the center of mass relative to the wheelbase determines load transfer between front and rear. The car's momentum acts at its center of mass to tilt the car forward or backward, respectively during braking and acceleration. Since it is only the downward force that changes and not the location of the center of mass, the effect on over/under steer is opposite to that of an actual change in the center of mass. When a car is braking, the downward load on the front tires increases and that on the rear decreases, with corresponding change in their ability to take sideways load.
A lower center of mass is a principal performance advantage of The center of mass height, relative to the track, determines load transfer, (related to, but not exactly weight transfer), from side to side and causes body lean. When tires of a vehicle provide a centripetal force to pull it around a turn, the momentum of the vehicle actuates load transfer in a direction going from the vehicle's current position to a point on a path tangent to the vehicle's path. This load transfer presents itself in the form of body lean.
Height of the center of mass relative to the wheelbase determines load transfer between front and rear. The car's momentum acts at its center of mass to tilt the car forward or backward, respectively during braking and acceleration. Since it is only the downward force that changes and not the location of the center of mass, the effect on over/under steer is opposite to that of an actual change in the center of mass. When a car is braking, the downward load on the front tires increases and that on the rear decreases, with corresponding change in their ability to take sideways load.
A lower center of mass is a principal performance advantage of sports cars, compared to sedans and (especially) SUVs

 

We are not talking sports cars here. He has an old basic hot rod.
Totally different concept which the Mercedes gull wings could not grasp
as I drove around them inside or outside anywhere on the track.

By the way, 90% of the people on this forum won't have a clue what you are talking about and they USUALLY won't appreciate the big words.

 

I'm a 10 percenter!!!!